BoxRec

Tom Schwarz
Pianeta
Seferi
Christian Hammer
Joey Abell


Come on, for a fighter of his status thats really an atrocious body of work outwith his stink-out with Wladimir Klitschko & Deontay Wilder.

Can o worms

Yeah it’s abysmal. Still better than Wilder’s record though, which is a complete joke. What a terrible era.

When you put it like that it ain't good is it.

Doesn't mean he's not good tho - he is light years ahead of the chasing pack.

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 16:06 Yeah it’s abysmal. Still better than Wilder’s record though, which is a complete joke. What a terrible era.

I'm not so sure. Luis Ortiz was a genuine talent and despite the fact he schooled Wilder twice he got that scalp by pulling a big KO out the bag.

Stiverne, Arreola and Breazeale were also at least live opponents which is really more than you could say about any of the garbage Fury has picked as opponents.

When Fury was in contract talks with Hearn it broke down due to the level of opponent Fury wanted to face, Eddie Hearn said he would probably beat the guys Fury had lined up.

Ricky wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 16:22

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 16:06 Yeah it’s abysmal. Still better than Wilder’s record though, which is a complete joke. What a terrible era.

I'm not so sure. Luis Ortiz was a genuine talent and despite the fact he schooled Wilder twice he got that scalp by pulling a big KO out the bag.

Stiverne, Arreola and Breazeale were also at least live opponents which is really more than you could say about any of the garbage Fury has picked as opponents.

When Fury was in contract talks with Hearn it broke down due to the level of opponent Fury wanted to face, Eddie Hearn said he would probably beat the guys Fury had lined up.

Hearn wanted him to him to fight Bellew, Whyte, then Joshua. Something like that.

But instead, he went Seferi, Pianeta (less than 3 months) and then Wilder four months later.

He was 270+ against Seferi and not like he was in the Wilder 2 fight.

He arguably beat Wilder that first fight as well.

Whilst Fury is the division number 1, I think the fact that he has only ever defended a version of the heavyweight world title on one occasion, helps put Fury’s legacy into perspective for me.

In the future Furys legacy will be tough to judge, he is already prob past his peak and while having beat Klit and Wilder, who else will he have fought when he is genuinely over the hill? Usyk, Whyte and AJ.
Not enough to put him as TBE, and there isn't anyone else coming over the horizon who will give him legacy fights.
If Fury comes through the next couple of years well enough he will have cemented his position as the best of his time but in the bigger picture that's not a huge thing.

I wish my record stunk

emallini wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 17:24 I wish my record stunk

Seriously.

Fury’s very good. His layoffs and apparent poor discipline haven’t helped. Leaving big gaps. And making it frustrating for us. But he’s been remarkable in his ability to rise to the occasion. It’s about time to see him vs his mandatory, but the mandatory is having his own issues.

Really like Fury & Whyte both, but I wouldn’t dare buy a ticket for their fight (if they can even get to the stage of announcing it) as I’d be doubting it happens until they walk in the ring.

He’s taken the title from a future Hall of Famer, and waged a big abd exciting rivalry in America. Now he just needs to do all that “in between” stuff like defending the crown.


Yes, some of those comeback fights were a bit of a joke, reminding me a bit of a late career Foreman.

Ricky wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 16:22

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 16:06 Yeah it’s abysmal. Still better than Wilder’s record though, which is a complete joke. What a terrible era.

I'm not so sure. Luis Ortiz was a genuine talent and despite the fact he schooled Wilder twice he got that scalp by pulling a big KO out the bag.

Stiverne, Arreola and Breazeale were also at least live opponents which is really more than you could say about any of the garbage Fury has picked as opponents.

When Fury was in contract talks with Hearn it broke down due to the level of opponent Fury wanted to face, Eddie Hearn said he would probably beat the guys Fury had lined up.

I don’t necessarily disagree that Ortiz was talented but, again, look at his record. Piss poor. Honestly I don’t don’t really see how anyone in this era could genuinely claim to have a very strong record, unless they beat everybody possible, the depth just isn’t there.

I always gave AJ a lot of credit for never ducking anyone and clearly being up for any challenge; sadly, it’s proved far too much for him and he’s actually regressed as a result, but at least he had a go.

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 18:20

Ricky wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 16:22

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑26 Dec 2021, 16:06 Yeah it’s abysmal. Still better than Wilder’s record though, which is a complete joke. What a terrible era.

I'm not so sure. Luis Ortiz was a genuine talent and despite the fact he schooled Wilder twice he got that scalp by pulling a big KO out the bag.

Stiverne, Arreola and Breazeale were also at least live opponents which is really more than you could say about any of the garbage Fury has picked as opponents.

When Fury was in contract talks with Hearn it broke down due to the level of opponent Fury wanted to face, Eddie Hearn said he would probably beat the guys Fury had lined up.

I don’t necessarily disagree that Ortiz was talented but, again, look at his record. Piss poor. Honestly I don’t don’t really see how anyone in this era could genuinely claim to have a very strong record, unless they beat everybody possible, the depth just isn’t there.

I always gave AJ a lot of credit for never ducking anyone and clearly being up for any challenge; sadly, it’s proved far too much for him and he’s actually regressed as a result, but at least he had a go.

Absolutely, you won't find a harsher critic of AJ than me, and I was one of a tiny minority to pick Ruiz such is my skepticism of his ability, but the names on his record cannot be called into question at all, it's a who's who of the divisions top contenders, current & ex champions.

The heavyweight division for the last 15 to 20 years has stunk.

Apart from Wlad, who is the purest boxer Fury has fought??

It's a bit crap, made more crappy by all the snoozers, sorry, boxing exhibitions

fury has beat 2 top opponents, which were very nice wins. you'd have to go back decades to find another pair of hw wins as good for one guy

apart from that, pretty gash though

and has made 1 single title defense his whole career. hasnt shown as consistency or longevity as a champ. ppl mock len for losing to mccall and rahman, but that's the type of sh!t that can happen when you stick around and regularly fight decent contenders, rather than jumping on mental health/ped leave

furys obviously really good when he's on his night and up for it. he is hands down the most complete hw today id say. but it's a knock on him that he can't put together any type of sustained run against top opposition, and his fans get oddly defensve when you simply call for him to keep at it fighting top oppositon. cheering like giddy schoolgirls for him to do nothing instead of fighting whyte, aj, etc

Fury dethroned Klitschko, while Klitschko was the longtime man and a heavy favorite against everyone. Fury beat Wilder, when Wilder was a one of the two main candidates for #1 position. It's ridiculous how people start to disvalue someone after losing.

Anyway, the OP is even beyond that. Mentioning Abell, Schwarz, Pianeta and Seferi, while not mentioning Chisora and Wallin. Also, Cunningham and even Kevin Johnson at that point were better than Abell, Schwarz, Pianeta and Seferi.

Fury still has something to prove, but the others have even more.

ya, he beat two top guys. very good wins.

its also true though that hes made only 1 title defense (against a guy he fought 2x before) and his best opponent outside the guys above is probably dereck chisora. could be wallin, though wallin's mostly been rated for turning tyson's face into a vagina and then hurting him

how about putting together a consistent championship reign, regularly fighting decent contenders and showing longevity as champ? be a real king of the division and stick around to see off challengers, instead of being a guy who wins and runs off. what gets me all the time is the bizarre number of fury fans who seem to cheer for him not to fight good opponents. some dudes be jizzing their pants at the thought of whyte not getting a fight with him. some even calling for him to retire

Even with the losses, Foreman's 1987 to 1997 career is better than Fury's career. When you add in his prime career too it really puts things in perspective.

DrDuke wrote: ↑27 Dec 2021, 03:22 Fury dethroned Klitschko, while Klitschko was the longtime man and a heavy favorite against everyone. Fury beat Wilder, when Wilder was a one of the two main candidates for #1 position. It's ridiculous how people start to disvalue someone after losing.

Anyway, the OP is even beyond that. Mentioning Abell, Schwarz, Pianeta and Seferi, while not mentioning Chisora and Wallin. Also, Cunningham and even Kevin Johnson at that point were better than Abell, Schwarz, Pianeta and Seferi.

Fury still has something to prove, but the others have even more.

Everyones resume is easy to pick a part but furys is particularly easy.

-Klit was 39 and never won again.
-Wilder has been questioned by many forever, i still have no idea if he is good or not, i think honestly his value has gone up to most since the fighting Fury.
-Chisora is his 3rd best opponent, decent enough but not great.
-Wallin is still not proven, he was an absolute noone when he fough Fury, it was a gross tune up, he only got his fame because he cut fury.

Wouldent mention cunningham as a resume saver, he had lost 3 of his last 4 going into the fury fight. And kingpin, while pre punchinig bag era, was not showing shades of ali...

Fury is probably the best heavyweight of the era. he even might be favourite vs any heavyweight of any era. But its not backed in great resume.

Who are "Fury fans"? I'm a boxing fan who likes Tyson Fury. I've probably seen more live boxing than most before Tyson was born!

gregregegg wrote: ↑27 Dec 2021, 04:32

DrDuke wrote: ↑27 Dec 2021, 03:22 Fury dethroned Klitschko, while Klitschko was the longtime man and a heavy favorite against everyone. Fury beat Wilder, when Wilder was a one of the two main candidates for #1 position. It's ridiculous how people start to disvalue someone after losing.

Anyway, the OP is even beyond that. Mentioning Abell, Schwarz, Pianeta and Seferi, while not mentioning Chisora and Wallin. Also, Cunningham and even Kevin Johnson at that point were better than Abell, Schwarz, Pianeta and Seferi.

Fury still has something to prove, but the others have even more.

Everyones resume is easy to pick a part but furys is particularly easy.

-Klit was 39 and never won again.
-Wilder has been questioned by many forever, i still have no idea if he is good or not, i think honestly his value has gone up to most since the fighting Fury.
-Chisora is his 3rd best opponent, decent enough but not great.
-Wallin is still not proven, he was an absolute noone when he fough Fury, it was a gross tune up, he only got his fame because he cut fury.

Wouldent mention cunningham as a resume saver, he had lost 3 of his last 4 going into the fury fight. And kingpin, while pre punchinig bag era, was not showing shades of ali...

Fury is probably the best heavyweight of the era. he even might be favourite vs any heavyweight of any era. But its not backed in great resume.

I'd say Aj's is easier to dissect. He got given a title. The rest were either crap or ancient except Usyk and he got absolutely schooled in that one. Even managed to get stopped by one of the crap ones!

funny enough i think charlie martin could beat almost everyone wilder and fury have beaten. he's fighting luiz ortiz next week, presumably the ortiz ppl claim is a bit of a beast should smaash him, but you never know.

reminds me that brezeale was called a soft first defense for 2.5 year pro aj, yet then dudes hyped wilder for beating him after 11 years and 40+ fights pro. still one of the best 3 guys big deon's beaten, barely top 10 for josh

but anyway, fury's record defo doesnt stink. hes got a couple very high quality wins that are probably the best pair of the last 20 years. id put him ahead of wlad, aj, wilder and josh for now. but he's missing a key component of a real great for me, which is that consistent streak against good opposition, showing that he can stay around and regularly turn back leading contenders.

Fury has had a great career no doubt; he is mostly recognised as the top heavy today based on beating a terrible title holder 2/3 times, and the next dominant heavyweight losing to big underdogs.

The win against an ancient Wlad may look good on paper - but it's hard to overlook that Fury was the only person who couldn't stop Wlad out of all Wlads past and future losses; the fight was so boring and terrible to watch that the UK media hardly mentioned it .. John Fury identifying that as a reason why Tyson went off the rails.

The Wallin fight for me shows Fury's real level. Those mythical skills were not evident against the guy chosen to give little resistance. Fury had to resort to crudely using his huge mass to smother Wallin.

Then Wilder. Enough has been said about Wilders lack of skill. Fury's biggest fan points to the 2nd Wilder fight as proof of Fury's greatness/skills .. yet Fury had an opponent falling over on spaghetti legs from the 4th round .. yet couldn't put any sort of organised offence together to get him out if there until he was practically out on his feet. Once again just crudely using his mass to wear a pathetic looking opponent down.
The 3rd wilder fight was exciting in the same way as 2 drunks outside a pub would be; there was as little skill shown by both guys also.

This generation of heavies have undoubtedly been the worse. Fury just so happens to be probably the best of a bad bunch .. probably; because he first needs to fight Joshua and Usyk to actually prove it.