BoxRec

It wasn’t that long ago that if you were a skilled pugilist boxing was really the only door open to pursue, especially if you were after some fame and fortune.

This is now not the case with other combat sports dangling carrots for enticement.

I certainly feel the heavyweight division is poorer due to the rise in popularity of MMA.

There is a noticeable decline in decent US heavyweight boxers in the 2000s, a division they practically owned up until the 2000s.

Just wondering if boxing is now too old school and it inevitable it would have its day.

Everything has its day. Just now, I’d say basketball and NFL are the main causes as it’s not like there’s any huge talents in heavyweight MMA unless you include Jon Jones.

As for rewards the champ in the UFC got paid $600k for his last defence. Even a second tier fighter like Dillian Whyte wouldn’t get out of bed for that.

MMA certainly seems to have captured the imagination of the youth. Not surprising, given that Dana White learned from boxing's mistakes and has avoided all the short sighted, idiotic decisions that gradually marginalised the sweet science.

I still think theres nothing quite like boxing,and there is more people for MMA now,but not for the reasons you mentioned

They pay in mma and boxing is a massive difference but people like mma fan wise because there is little to no messing about,fights get made when they should

For example,khan-brook,were all gonna watch it and were all up for it but its a joke its taken this long to happen,laughable even, whereas a big fight in MMA happens when it should, obviously all men in the ufc are under one banner so its easier to make fights but the politics of boxing are another thing that makes it a joke at times

It hasn't outside of America.

The recent suggestion is UFC fighters are quite underpaid for the damage they are taking onboard. It’s probably swung too far the other way in mma.

Wee Tommy wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:04 Everything has its day. Just now, I’d say basketball and NFL are the main causes as it’s not like there’s any huge talents in heavyweight MMA unless you include Jon Jones.

As for rewards the champ in the UFC got paid $600k for his last defence. Even a second tier fighter like Dillian Whyte wouldn’t get out of bed for that.

There's lots of talent in UFC, that's a ridiculous statement.

The popularity of MMA has certainly hurt boxing, however it's ironic that the top guys in MMA are now looking to boxing to get their biggest paydays.

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:52

Wee Tommy wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:04 Everything has its day. Just now, I’d say basketball and NFL are the main causes as it’s not like there’s any huge talents in heavyweight MMA unless you include Jon Jones.

As for rewards the champ in the UFC got paid $600k for his last defence. Even a second tier fighter like Dillian Whyte wouldn’t get out of bed for that.

There's lots of talent in UFC, that's a ridiculous statement.

There isn't up here. Boxing is on fire, and Muay Thai. I know a few who've given it a go, but they reckon lack of BJJ left them at a massive disadvantage. Maybe the next generation will come through. If my sons were into it I would recommend a few years of bjj as a start.

I’d agree with Wee Tommy as far as MMA heavyweights go. I can’t think of anyone who is a talented up and comer. You just feel like you’ve seen it all before, with those big fellas crudely swinging away.

The other divisions are a different story.

mickey1975 wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:40 It hasn't outside of America.

Personally feel the US has been hit hardest in terms of recent quality boxers versus yesteryear.

When I was towards my last year of school I knew about half a dozen lads who joined our local boxing club, (circa 15 – 16year olds). Whereas now I know a couple of mates who have sons who attend MMA classes, also a couple of younger lads I work with do Mauy Thai classes. Maybe MMA is just more envogue and way cooler than Queensbury rules boxing, the talent pool just seems to be noticeably drying up (with exceptions of course).

UFC as a platform is now bigger than any boxing promotion but there are no MMA fighters that are bigger than the biggest boxers. Only McGregor's popularity has come close. UFC pay peanuts in comparison to boxing despite PPVs pulling decent figures so simply comparing the pay or viewership of an individual MMA guy probably isn't an accurate way to compare the popularity.

I think the current model of prizefighting over sport in boxing is harming it's reputation while alternatively MMA provides more competitive fights but at the cost of more freedoms.

I also think that when you look at the backgrounds of professional mixed martial artists, most of them start later in life, have a grappling background or other striking backgrounds, not strictly boxing. In boxing most of the best guys start pretty young and are mostly from boxing dominated areas. I don't think that the effects of MMA's on boxing talent will have significantly been felt yet, especially outside the US.

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:52

Wee Tommy wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:04 Everything has its day. Just now, I’d say basketball and NFL are the main causes as it’s not like there’s any huge talents in heavyweight MMA unless you include Jon Jones.

As for rewards the champ in the UFC got paid $600k for his last defence. Even a second tier fighter like Dillian Whyte wouldn’t get out of bed for that.

There's lots of talent in UFC, that's a ridiculous statement.

Tell me exactly who is in the heavyweight division of MMA who could have made a serious impact in boxing.

Also explain the rewards situation.

You are clueless as usual.

Tom Aspinall is apparently good according to Peter Fury.

mickey1975 wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 14:31 Tom Aspinall is apparently good according to Peter Fury.

Edit: Apologies, I didn't realise you were talking about his boxing ability. Yes, he is pretty good.

He's 1-0 (1st round KO) as a pro from 2017 but he's chosen the MMA route for a reason i.e. he's better at it.

Wee Tommy wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 13:09

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:52

Wee Tommy wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:04 Everything has its day. Just now, I’d say basketball and NFL are the main causes as it’s not like there’s any huge talents in heavyweight MMA unless you include Jon Jones.

As for rewards the champ in the UFC got paid $600k for his last defence. Even a second tier fighter like Dillian Whyte wouldn’t get out of bed for that.

There's lots of talent in UFC, that's a ridiculous statement.

Tell me exactly who is in the heavyweight division of MMA who could have made a serious impact in boxing.

Also explain the rewards situation.

You are clueless as usual.

Bore off.

589555 wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 14:49

mickey1975 wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 14:31 Tom Aspinall is apparently good according to Peter Fury.

Edit: Apologies, I didn't realise you were talking about his boxing ability. Yes, he is pretty good.

He's 1-0 (1st round KO) as a pro from 2017 but he's chosen the MMA route for a reason i.e. he's better at it.

He trains at Furys a bit. He's local to there.

The popularity is harming boxing a little yet ironically enough the biggest reward for an MMA fighter is landing a boxing match with a faded boxing pro.

Ciril garne, francis nganu, Alexander Volkov, jairzinho Rozenstruik, jon jones, alexander gufsterson, stipe and mabey Tai Tuivasa could have been good heavyweights had MMA no existed and they went into boxing instead. Not saying they could cross over now, but i think. sure there are others too, but even with just that list 6 or 7 extra good heavys would really help the division. Think Football and basketball are hurting heavyweights more still... can you imagine if lebron boxed his entire life.

For all the other divs, pretty much every MMA guy would of been a boxer and its a huge drain on the sport. especialy at the light weights where traditionaly boxing had its pick of the litter because you arnt going to play NFL at 130 lb....

UFC is a scam though for the fighters. Most young people I know like both but def MMA has changed the game

not sure mma has been prominent long enough to have much of an impact yet on the talent pool we have at the moment

stipe was one of the better guys with his hands, ufc champ etc.........best he did as a boxer was quarterfinals of the golden gloves, which is respectable but puts him miles off the top level

jon jones doesnt even have much of a boxing game, mostly knees, kicks, elbows, grapping

guys like cormier were wrestlers who were into that before mma took off

and some of these other guys mentioned come from countries where boxing is so minor it's unlikely they wouldve gotten into it or progressed much if they had

Stipe did that golden gloves result having boxed for 8 months being mainly a wrestler im pretty sure. Had wrestling and MMA not being options and he dedicated his life to boxing i think he could of got pretty decent.

Jones isnt a boxer at all, but with no MMA i feel thats where his life would of lead him, feels like a fighter. Crazy fit, Crazy tough, 6'4 long, 230ish lb, Coordinated and fast. Jones could of definatly been a topish heavyweight had he gone that way.

Nganu origonaly moved to france to become a pro boxer... what could he of got done at 26? very hard to know, but if he was as dedicated to boxing as he was to MMA he probably could of become pretty decent, natrual freak thats for sure.

But the real loss for boxing is at the lower weights and in the future. I'd say the tallent pool from 125-168lb for people born after the year 2000 is being cut in half between MMA and boxing.

For now the prodigy children are still boxing, because it takes a dad boxer to get there son on the mits at 4, but that will slowly change as MMA fighters/fans have kids and get them leg kicking at 3.... Max Holloways son would probably bash me...

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 15:08

Wee Tommy wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 13:09

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 09:52
There's lots of talent in UFC, that's a ridiculous statement.

Tell me exactly who is in the heavyweight division of MMA who could have made a serious impact in boxing.

Also explain the rewards situation.

You are clueless as usual.

Bore off.

Exactly. That’s all you’ve got.

Boxing has always been fueled by absolute poverty .. the word prizefighting kinda identifies that.

In the USA it was often the lower classes that took the boxing route to money: African Americans and 2nd generation immigrants typically. In the UK the traveller community are quite prominent.

In Western societies absolute poverty has increasingly disappeared and there are numerous opportunities for youngsters to potentially make money. University for the clever academic types - football/rugby/cycling/track etc for the not so bright but athletic types.

Boxing now competes with lots of other things for young people to make their fame and fortune; add YouTube/Insta/TicTok to the list too (The young girls doing their funny dances and the travellers doing their threatening videos). I don't see primarily MMA as watering down boxing, because it's just one of many factors reducing boxing participation.

gregregegg wrote: ↑18 Feb 2022, 19:19 For now the prodigy children are still boxing, because it takes a dad boxer to get there son on the mits at 4, but that will slowly change as MMA fighters/fans have kids and get them leg kicking at 3.... Max Holloways son would probably bash me...

Start leg kicking before you have gone through puberty and you will be finished by the time you are 20 like the Thais. Very bad for the body. Leave it until 16 to start like the Dutch and you'll get far more longevity in the sport, you'll still be a wreck by the time you are 50 though. At least boxing only ruins the hands, elbows and shoulders.