BoxRec

Dillian Whyte's long wait and big flop last night got me thinking of other heavyweight challengers who were either made to wait too long or never got their shot.

Of these great contenders who, if any, could have sprung an upset?

If you could pick ONE fight to have happened, which one would it be?

1886-92
Champion: John L Sullivan
Challenger: Peter Jackson

1910-16
Champions: Jack Johnson, Jess Willard
Challenger: Joe Jeannette

1911-18
Champion: Jack Johnson, Jess Willard
Challenger: Sam Langford

1920-26
Champion: Jack Dempsey
Challenger: Harry Wills

1926-31
Champions: Gene Tunney, Max Schmeling
Challenger: George Godfrey

1926-32
Champions: Gene Tunney, Max Schmeling, Jack Sharkey
Challenger: Johnny Risko

1932-37
Champions: Jack Sharkey, Primo Carnera, Max Baer, Jim Braddock
Challenger: Larry Gains

1937-49
Champion: Joe Louis
Challengers: Leroy Haynes, Jimmy Bivins, Elmer Ray

1953-54
Champion: Rocky Marciano
Challenger: Nino Valdez

1957-58
Champion: Floyd Patterson
Challengers: Eddie Machen, Big Cat Williams (later fought Terrell and Ali respectively)

I would go with Langford, if I could only pick one.
Zora Folley, Turkey Thompson and Sam McVey should have shots as well.

All these potential matches would've been interesting, but I would be most intrigued by the Mutt and Jeff combination of Willard defending against Langford.

Likeliest upset? I think Cleveland Williams catches Floyd Patterson.

Give Jimmy Bivins a tremendous shot in 1946, if he fought Joe Louis. Also Lem Franklin had a chance in 1941.

Mike DeJohn (late 1950's/early 1960's)

Ernie Schaaf, Bob Baker and Ike Ibeabuchi

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑24 Apr 2022, 12:05 I would go with Langford, if I could only pick one.
Zora Folley, Turkey Thompson and Sam McVey should have shots as well.

Zora Folley got a shot.

bennie wrote: ↑10 May 2022, 06:10

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑24 Apr 2022, 12:05 I would go with Langford, if I could only pick one.
Zora Folley, Turkey Thompson and Sam McVey should have shots as well.

Zora Folley got a shot.

Well, like Cleveland Williams, he got it a bit late. They should have been challengers for the protected Patterson.

Ike Ibeabuchi is good modern call before severe mental illness set-in :salut
Kallie Knoetze was a dangerous challenger and at his best in 77/78 so maybe worth a shout?

There was never a realistic time when Ike Ibeabuchi could have got a shot. He dropped out of boxing after each of his signature wins over Tua and Byrd.

Caractacus wrote: ↑09 May 2022, 14:17 Mike DeJohn (late 1950's/early 1960's)

Great call on Mike DeJohn should have been given a title shot. Remember my Father and Uncles (who grew up with the DeJohns) talking about (and being happy that) local neighborhood guy Nick Barone got his shot at the title with Ezzard Charles, but being disappointed that Mr. DeJohn never got his title shot.

scartissue wrote: ↑09 May 2022, 20:31 Ernie Schaaf, Bob Baker and Ike Ibeabuchi

Ernie Schaaf is a good mention. He always seems to get overlooked. Maybe he would if he didn't die tragically.

With Johnson you say Joe Jeanette, Sam Langford, and Sam Mcvey never got their shot. The time white contenders in McCarty ( while he was living ) and Gunboat Smith never got a shot either. Instead inferior white contenders like Fireman, Flynn, Frank Moran, Al Kaufman, Middle weight Stanley Ketchel and, old and 6 years in-active Jim Jeffries did.

Has any tenured champion ducked / avoided this much talent while champion?

Obviously it would have been great had he fought these guys.
We do have to some things in perspective.
Johnson himself fought for a very long time before he ever got a title shot. (Beating guys like Jeannette, McVey and Langford during this time. McVey and Langford improved later.)He pretty much had to fight Jeffries. He got more money fighting him than he would have got fighting the rest of these guys combined.
It's the old risk/reward situation.

Early on in his title reign, Johnson probably would have beaten any of them. However he was older than them and by the end would have lost to them.

Moran and Flynn were about legitimate as Gunboat Smith.

But yes, it would have been awesome if Johnson would have defended the title against a couple of these guys.

1953-54: Earl (The Hooded Terror) Walls. Marciano flat-out ducked him.

pound per pound wrote: ↑12 May 2022, 17:02 With Johnson you say Joe Jeanette, Sam Langford, and Sam Mcvey never got their shot. The time white contenders in McCarty ( while he was living ) and Gunboat Smith never got a shot either. Instead inferior white contenders like Fireman, Flynn, Frank Moran, Al Kaufman, Middle weight Stanley Ketchel and, old and 6 years in-active Jim Jeffries did.

Has any tenured champion ducked / avoided this much talent while champion?

Jack Johnson must be the only champion in history accused of ducking men whom he already beat multiple times.

ya, it's not as if someone like sam mcvea wouldve gotten better than he was as the teenager a fully grown johnson beat around a decade earlier

18 is the real heavyweight prime!

and 156 pounds is the new best weight for heavies, like sam langford was when fully grown johnson fought him in 1906, a month after an obviously still filling out sam said goodbye to his teenage years

jack had a thing for picking on the kids didn't he

writehooks wrote: ↑16 May 2022, 18:35 1953-54: Earl (The Hooded Terror) Walls. Marciano flat-out ducked him.

Who did he beat to get a shot at Rocky?

Back-to-back quick KOs of Rex Layne.

writehooks wrote: ↑13 Jun 2022, 18:54 Back-to-back quick KOs of Rex Layne.

In 1953 when he knocked out Layne Rocky fought Charles and LaStarza. 2 fighters Walls lost too. Also if Walls would not of lost in 1954 he more than likely would of gotten a title shot.
But he didn't he lost to Tommy Harrison.
Not a duck just a matter of timing not adding up

Always thought Rex Layne was an interesting case. He fought Charles, Walcott, and Marciano, but never was in a title fight.

Several contenders during Willard's title reign never got a shot: Fred Fulton, Carl Morris, Gunboat Smith.

writehooks wrote: ↑16 May 2022, 18:35 1953-54: Earl (The Hooded Terror) Walls. Marciano flat-out ducked him.

Not true. Walls didn’t force his hand. Never climbed higher than # 5 in rankings, never accepted archie moores offer, couldn’t even win Canadian heavyweight title over C level James J Parker, and he lost to marcianos sparring partner Tommy Harrison

writehooks wrote: ↑13 Jun 2022, 18:54 Back-to-back quick KOs of Rex Layne.

The same Layne who had recently lost to club fighter Willie James and Harry kid Matthews? Layne wasn’t a big name anymore and Walls victories over Layne got him in the rankings but certainly not high enough to force a title shot or to insinuate Marciano was “afraid”

Marciano fought archie Moore who was far more accomplished as a contender than walls!

I highly doubt he would be afraid of a guy who lost to his sparring partner Tommy Harrison and drew with clumsy James J Parker

Al Palzer
Bombardier Billy Wells.

Joe Baski
( Who I think was going to fight Joe Louis
at one point)