BoxRec

Valuev
Fury
Wilder
W. Klitschko
V. Klitschko
Lewis
Bowe
Carnera
Willard

Like grades in school:

F, D, C, B, A with +/- increments if you desire.

What constitutes a big heavyweight?

Let's say 6'4" and over by height, 220 and over by weight

I'll say Lewis is A+
Bowe is A
Fury is A-
W. Klitschko is B+
V. Klitschko is B+/A-
Carnera is C+/B-
Wilder is B-/B
Valuev is C-/C
Willard is C-

If 6'4'' then Buster Douglas qualifies. On his night: A+ Other nights: F

PS. Bonecrusher was 6'4'' and Tucker 6'5''.

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑21 May 2023, 22:03 Valuev
Fury
Wilder
W. Klitschko
V. Klitschko
Lewis
Bowe
Carnera
Willard

Like grades in school:

F, D, C, B, A with +/- increments if you desire.

What constitutes a big heavyweight?

Let's say 6'4" and over by height, 220 and over by weight

I'll say Lewis is A+
Bowe is A
Fury is A-
W. Klitschko is B+
V. Klitschko is B+/A-
Carnera is C+/B-
Wilder is B-/B
Valuev is C-/C
Willard is C-

Your're Grades seem accurate to me.
Valuev is D maybe.
Willard is overrated to me somewhat but C- seems acceptable.

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑21 May 2023, 22:03 Valuev
Fury
Wilder
W. Klitschko
V. Klitschko
Lewis
Bowe
Carnera
Willard

Like grades in school:

F, D, C, B, A with +/- increments if you desire.

What constitutes a big heavyweight?

Let's say 6'4" and over by height, 220 and over by weight

I'll say Lewis is A+
Bowe is A
Fury is A-
W. Klitschko is B+
V. Klitschko is B+/A-
Carnera is C+/B-
Wilder is B-/B
Valuev is C-/C
Willard is C-

Do all the big guys active count? Using just the names given.

Lewis A+
Vitali A
Wlad A
Bowe A-
Fury B+
Wilder B
Valuev B-
Carnera C
Willard C -

IMO, Valuev, Carnera or Willard would not rate in the top 3 around today.

pound per pound wrote: ↑29 May 2023, 08:45

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑21 May 2023, 22:03 Valuev
Fury
Wilder
W. Klitschko
V. Klitschko
Lewis
Bowe
Carnera
Willard

Like grades in school:

F, D, C, B, A with +/- increments if you desire.

What constitutes a big heavyweight?

Let's say 6'4" and over by height, 220 and over by weight

I'll say Lewis is A+
Bowe is A
Fury is A-
W. Klitschko is B+
V. Klitschko is B+/A-
Carnera is C+/B-
Wilder is B-/B
Valuev is C-/C
Willard is C-

Do all the big guys active count? Using just the names given.

Lewis A+
Vitali A
Wlad A
Bowe A-
Fury B+
Wilder B
Valuev B-
Carnera C
Willard C -

IMO, Valuev, Carnera or Willard would not rate in the top 3 around today.

I think you can make that case for Willard, but Carnera unfortunately has fallen victim to many apocryphal stories that his entire career was manufactured and that he couldn't fight a lick, etc and its untrue.

For an overly muscular man who started off as a circus strongman, like Victor McLaglen, he went farther than any strength athlete in the history of boxing. No man who was manufactured could get knocked/thrown eleven times by Max Baer with a broken ankle and just keep taking it round after round. No man who was a fraud could go fifteen rounds with Tommy Loughran and actually win basically every round. No man who was crap could go fifteen rounds with Jack Sharkey and then knock him out in six a few years later. Etc.

He was actually lighter on his feet than people give him credit for and he was more agile than you would think. I'd certainly rate him above guys like Jameel McCline, Michael Grant, Nicolai Valuev, and most of the behemoths you saw in the 80s, 90s, and 2000s.

At his peak he had great conditioning, a good jab, was really tough, and a desire to prove he wasn't some sideshow attraction. And if he timed you just right he could hit like a ton of bricks, like he did Sharkey when he pushed him into the ropes and Sharkey bouncing off walked straight into an uppercut.

Jameel McCline was always an interesting guy to me. A big, HUGE guy that always fought in an almost timid way.

Even when he knocks out Michael Grant with the first punch he throws. He threw that punch as if he was absolutely terrified

He was timid. Mount Whitaker was even more so. Couldn't crack an egg.

Bowe and Lewis are far above anyone else. Lewis did for a long time s0o he should be ahead of Bowe. After that, there is a big drop off. If Bowe is an A, no one else is above a B-.

There are several big heavyweights far back that are in the mix: Buddy Baer, Abe Simon. George Godfrey might actually be the best of the old timers.

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑21 May 2023, 22:03 Valuev
Fury
Wilder
W. Klitschko
V. Klitschko
Lewis
Bowe
Carnera
Willard

Like grades in school:

F, D, C, B, A with +/- increments if you desire.

What constitutes a big heavyweight?

Let's say 6'4" and over by height, 220 and over by weight :TU:

I'll say Lewis is A+
Bowe is A
Fury is A-
W. Klitschko is B+
V. Klitschko is B+/A-
Carnera is C+/B-
Wilder is B-/B
Valuev is C-/C
Willard is C-

I like your ratings. Perhaps would have had Carnera just a notch lower. Certainly can't see him at B-.

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑29 May 2023, 17:47 He was timid. Mount Whitaker was even more so. Couldn't crack an egg.

Bowe and Lewis are far above anyone else. Lewis did for a long time s0o he should be ahead of Bowe. After that, there is a big drop off. If Bowe is an A, no one else is above a B-.

There are several big heavyweights far back that are in the mix: Buddy Baer, Abe Simon. George Godfrey might actually be the best of the old timers.

The big men 245 + pounds ( Willard's size ) today in Fury, Hrgovic and Zhang are better than Willard. And there are several big men like Makmudov , Anderson and Jalovov on the way up who are likely better as well. I think the big men of 80-110 years ago do not rate. It is almost silly to compare them.

Willard, sure. But not anywhere near Lewis and Bowe.

pound per pound wrote: ↑29 May 2023, 08:45 Lewis A+
Vitali A
Wlad A
Bowe A-
Fury B+
Wilder B
Valuev B-
Carnera C
Willard C -

That looks good to me

prime big daddy bowe would have absolutely wiped the floor with the hesitant younger klit aka doc vlad steelhugger.

Agreed. Absurd to think any of them were remotely close to Bowe. It's Bowe and Lewis and then a huge gap.

adislav123 wrote: ↑02 Jun 2023, 20:43 prime big daddy bowe would have absolutely wiped the floor with the hesitant younger klit aka doc vlad steelhugger.

Shortest prime of any of those listed though.

Lewis A
Wlad A-
Fury B
Vitali B
Bowe B
Wilder B-
Willard, Primo, Valuev C

adislav123 wrote: ↑02 Jun 2023, 20:43 prime big daddy bowe would have absolutely wiped the floor with the hesitant younger klit aka doc vlad steelhugger.

I doubt that. would have been a good matchup though.