BoxRec Forum HW Top 15 ranking - Zhang vs. Joyce 2

[Ruthless-RKO]

New rankings

Current ranking:
Oleksandr Usyk - 21(14) 0 0 - next fight: TBA

2. Tyson Fury - 33(24) 0 1 - next fight: 28.10.2023 vs. Francis Ngannou - 17(12) 3 0* - (Unranked, Inactive)

3. Anthony Joshua - 26(23) 3(1) 0 - next fight: TBA

4. Deontay Wilder - 43(42) 2(2) 1 - next fight: TBA

5. Zhilei Zhang - 24(21) 1(0) 1 - next fight: TBA

6. Joe Joyce - 15(14) 2(2) 0 - next fight: TBA

7. Joseph Parker - 32(22) 3(1) 0 - next fight: TBA

8. Filip Hrgovic - 16(13) 0 0 - next fight: TBA

9. Martin Bakole - 19(14) 1(1) 0 - next fight: TBA

10. Frank Sanchez - 22(15) 0 0 - next fight: 30.09.2023 vs. Scott Alexander - 17(9) 5(1) 2 - (unranked, inactive)

11. Jared Anderson - 16(15) 0 0 - next fight: TBA

12. Arslanbek Makhmudov - 17(16) 0 0 - next fight: TBA

13. Efe Ajagba - 18(13) 1(0) 0 - next fight: TBA

14. VACANT

15. VACANT

* MMA record
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Question: How are the rankings affected after Zhang’s KO win over Joyce?

[Ruthless-RKO]

Keep it simple.

Vote on Zhang and Joyce only please.

I know we’d want some movement of the likes of Parker and Hrgovic.. they can wait.

[Ruthless-RKO]

My votes!

Zhang up to #3

Joyce down to #9

[Ruthless-RKO]

Didn’t think anyone would break the top 4.

Wilder and Joshua were kinda hovering it.

The HW’s need to fix up and start fighting more.

[joshj909]

No change. This fight already happened with the same result a few months ago and we voted on that so not sure how this changes anything.

Wilder gets dropped out in a few weeks due to inactivity so Zhang moves up anyway so moving Zhang up to 4 is the same as keeping things the same. He hasn't done enough to move him above Joshua. Moving Joyce down would see him move below Parker who he has decisively beat a year ago.

Can't vote for either of these options. Voted for Zhang to 4 as that is equivalent but I don't think Joyce should move down.

My current rankings:
1. Usyk
2. Fury
3. Joshua
4. Hrgovic
5. Zhang
6. Joyce
7. Sanchez
8. Parker
9. Wilder
10. Ajagba
11. Makhmudov
12. Chisora
13. Wallin/Gassiev winner
14. Bakole
15. Anderson

[Thomastearns]

I think we all know who's responsible for the traffic jam at HW.

We all know who won't fight his mandatories.

We all know who's got the WBC up his backside now.

Good luck to Fury in his exhibition against Ngannou but if he had a decent bone in his body, or any hint of integrity he'd give up the WBC belt instead of clinging to it like a banker clings to money.

What did we learn last night?

Well, we now know southpaw 'big bang' Zhang can bang with both hands. As for this strategy of tiring someone out for the second half of the fight, well let's remember it shouldn't include them landing some very heavy shots on you in the first.

That shot that put Joe down would have flattened anyone in the top 10. Zhang is up there with Wilder and Ruiz for sheer power.

Maybe even ahead of them.

We also know that Ishmael Salas (or Salad as he was listed as last night) is a worse than useless trainer.

Whatever he was doing with Joe only made him worse.

Zhang could catch Joe's jab with ease and was just playing with him last night.

Zhang improved and Joyce got worse.


It's a pity Joe didn't get his big payday against either Joshua or Fury, but that's boxing politics for you. In a better world Fury would be stripped immediately and Zhang and Hrgovic could rematch for the WBC belt.

If Joe has any interest in continuing he must change his trainer. Otherwise it's time to walk away.

I've never trained anyone but I'd do a better job than that - over the phone.

His current handlers should count themselves lucky for not being sued for criminal negligence.

Shocking.

Zhang absolutely deserves a shot at the title and Usyk should consider a trip to China next.

Zhang would get a 12 round boxing lesson (think Joshua v Ruiz 2) and Usyk would improve his resume by beating the man that beat Joyce who beat Dubois etc.

We did see one moment of humour when Chisora almost begged Zhang for a fight afterwards and Zhang replied that when he couldn't get fights and was begging Chisora, he didn't want to know.

Boxers like Joyce, Chisora, Whyte and Dubois all have one thing in their favour, they really will fight anyone. Even if it doesn't always make the most financial sense.

In this case, maybe whoever set up Joyce v Zhang needs to take a good look at their strategy which has now cost them XX £millions.

Especially after that fright Zhang gave Hrgovic.

[adislav123]

No change. This fight already happened with the same result a few months ago and we voted on that so not sure how this changes anything.

Wilder gets dropped out in a few weeks due to inactivity so Zhang moves up anyway so moving Zhang up to 4 is the same as keeping things the same. He hasn't done enough to move him above Joshua. Moving Joyce down would see him move below Parker who he has decisively beat a year ago.

Can't vote for either of these options. Voted for Zhang to 4 as that is equivalent but I don't think Joyce should move down.

My current rankings:
1. Usyk
2. Fury
3. Joshua
4. Hrgovic
5. Zhang
6. Joyce
7. Sanchez
8. Parker
9. Wilder
10. Ajagba
11. Makhmudov
12. Chisora
13. Wallin/Gassiev winner
14. Bakole
15. Anderson

hrgovic at 4? wtf?

did u ever take a look at his record?

[Ruthless-RKO]

Zhang beating Joyce clean twice is much better than Hrgovic winning a thin decision over Zhang.

It’s a bit exciting right now.

Everyone’s just losing to anyone. Lol

[Finkel]

Keep it simple.

Vote on Zhang and Joyce only please.

I know we’d want some movement of the likes of Parker and Hrgovic.. they can wait.

I think I could only choose one option in the above list.

Anyway, I'm going with Zhang up to #3 based on recent form. His two wins this year over Joyce (and a controversial loss to Hrgovic) put him above Joshua and Wilder.

Joyce down to #8. It's odd having him below Parker, but he got beat so emphatically across two fights I have to drop him some places. Sandwiched Between Hrgovic and Bakole seems about right.

[joshj909]

No change. This fight already happened with the same result a few months ago and we voted on that so not sure how this changes anything.

Wilder gets dropped out in a few weeks due to inactivity so Zhang moves up anyway so moving Zhang up to 4 is the same as keeping things the same. He hasn't done enough to move him above Joshua. Moving Joyce down would see him move below Parker who he has decisively beat a year ago.

Can't vote for either of these options. Voted for Zhang to 4 as that is equivalent but I don't think Joyce should move down.

My current rankings:
1. Usyk
2. Fury
3. Joshua
4. Hrgovic
5. Zhang
6. Joyce
7. Sanchez
8. Parker
9. Wilder
10. Ajagba
11. Makhmudov
12. Chisora
13. Wallin/Gassiev winner
14. Bakole
15. Anderson

hrgovic at 4? wtf?

did u ever take a look at his record?

Whether you like it or not he has a 1 year old win over Zhang who everyone thinks is 3rd/4th...

[CMCanavessi]

Damn I only voted for Zhang, didn't even see the option for Joyce.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Damn I only voted for Zhang, didn't even see the option for Joyce.

I’ve opened the votes. You can pick for Joyce now

[Perkin Warbeck]

hrgovic at 4? wtf?

did u ever take a look at his record?

Yes. He's undefeated.

Hrgovic clearly deserved to win the fight against Zhang, despite the referee helping Zhang. The misleading DAZN commentators ignored his many punches and saw only Zhang's relatively few. And then we had the naive fans claiming Zhang was robbed.

The fact is that Hrgovic has been the fighter with the iron chin, not Joyce. He took Zhang's best punches and, although he was dazed and somewhat disoriented a couple of times, did not go down (except for the push to the back of his head in the first round, which the referee should not have counted as a knockdown). He scored a knockdown himself in a middle round, but the dodgy referee did not count it.

I challenge people to watch the fight OBJECTIVELY with the biased commentary turned down. Hrgovic clearly won, and especially considering Zhang's recent success, Filip has been underrated since that fight.

[CMCanavessi]

Damn I only voted for Zhang, didn't even see the option for Joyce.

I’ve opened the votes. You can pick for Joyce now

Here's what I would do: Zhang number 3, leave Joyce where he is (ahead of Parker) and then move Hrg ahead of both.

They would end like this:

1 Usyk (Fury if it was up to me)
2 Fury (Usyk if it was up to me)
3 Zhang
4 AJ
5 Wilder
6 HRG
7 Joyce
8 Parker

The problem is that I can't vote for Joyce to remain 6, and if I vote him to drop to 7th, he will drop behind Parker which is stupid because he beat him soundly.

[oogiebe]

Zhang to 3. who really is clear cut better than him at this point. I can't wrap my head around what he has done to Joyce and then consider his fights with Hrg and Forrest.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Zhang to 3. who really is clear cut better than him at this point. I can't wrap my head around what he has done to Joyce and then consider his fights with Hrg and Forrest.

Styles makes fights.

[joshj909]

My current rankings:
1. Usyk
2. Fury
3. Joshua
4. Hrgovic
5. Zhang
6. Joyce
7. Sanchez
8. Parker
9. Wilder
10. Ajagba
11. Makhmudov
12. Chisora
13. Wallin/Gassiev winner
14. Bakole
15. Anderson

Just realised I still have Wilder in this. Take him out and move them all up then Huni at 15. Damn this looks bad.

[oogiebe]

Zhang to 3. who really is clear cut better than him at this point. I can't wrap my head around what he has done to Joyce and then consider his fights with Hrg and Forrest.

Styles makes fights.

Nah not in those cases. Zhang gassed. No sign of it with JJ.

[Ruthless-RKO]

His S&C coach has done him wonders.

[oogiebe]

His S&C coach has done him wonders.

LOL! Wonder what he's ingesting?

[gregregegg]

Zhang to 2

Joyce to 9


Weird votes because I don’t particularly rate Zhang. And Joyce bashed Parker.

But based on recently what he has done is better than aj or wilder.

I went above fury because… Chisora, say your retired , Ngannou, talk of jones… I just hate that shit, fury is very very good, but If he isn’t looking to fight too guys then I’m not looking to keep him near the top of the rankings.

[Lackeos]

No changes.

(Insane that the poll options require that you rank Zhang at least above Wilder and rank Joyce at least behind Parker. Bro, JOYCE KO'ED PARKER LAST YEAR! Also, y'all completely ruined these rankings by takings Ruiz, Whyte, and Chisora out of them.)

[Ruthless-RKO]

If you don't like the poll and want to keep Joyce were he is, just comment it, i take them into account too.

[Rob3_142]

Zhang up to #4

Joyce stays at #8

Joyce beat Parker, and has a better recent resume (barring these two losses).

Zhang moves above Wilder because of inactivity and no meaningful wins since 2019.

[Rob3_142]

Zhang to 2

Joyce to 9


Weird votes because I don’t particularly rate Zhang. And Joyce bashed Parker.

But based on recently what he has done is better than aj or wilder.

I went above fury because… Chisora, say your retired , Ngannou, talk of jones… I just hate that shit, fury is very very good, but If he isn’t looking to fight too guys then I’m not looking to keep him near the top of the rankings.

Sadly you are so right...