BoxRec

Jack Johnson vs. Jack Dempsey. How does this one go.

Johnson by UD.

Too slick, and he was notably stronger and harder-hitting then either Gibbons or Tunney . . .

Does anyone know anyhting about a bout that is supposed to have taken place beteen these two in 1921?

I have a photocopy from a magazine containing an article by Lew Eskin who thinks that a 'secret' fight may have taken place in Canada.

The article has a reprint of a contemporary newspaper report detailing the action.

I had never heard of this before. Any ideas anyone?

The way Johnson was everybody would have heard about it if it happened.

tonyevs wrote:The way Johnson was everybody would have heard about it if it happened.

Not if he were to lose.........but I doubt that would happen.

When Jack Johnson fought, he fought in a one dimensional boring clinch fest style that would have made John Ruiz proud. His offense and defense consisted of moving straight back... and lunging forward with a left hook that was thrown so wide that you just knew it didn't have any power on it. Johnson caused about as much excitement as a head cold.

Jack Dempsy was a sloppy mauling fighter that had little technique, he came forward and swarmed you while throwing sloppy punches. Dempsy would sime times look so wild in the ring that he reminded me of a flailing ape that had escaped from the zoo and was hell bent on revenge against the human race.

This match up is laughable... and any ways guys, Jack Dempsy was a racist and would have never fought Johnson because he was black. Therefore this debate shouldn't have even taken place, because the fight wouldn't have happened anyways.

Grimm wrote:

tonyevs wrote:The way Johnson was everybody would have heard about it if it happened.

Not if he were to lose.........but I doubt that would happen.

But wouldn`t he have added a bit of ever lasting controversy about it first though

Grimm wrote:

tonyevs wrote:The way Johnson was everybody would have heard about it if it happened.

Not if he were to lose.........but I doubt that would happen.

GRIMM,
what are you thinking?that cheesing bastard Johnson,would be on the floor so fast ,the back of his head would be flat.Dempsey would have broken his ribs,jaw,and those big exaggerated pearly whites.After the fight ,it would look as if Johnson had a mouthful of chiclets,because his teeth would be dislodged.Grimm,I want you to go to your room for a 20 min time-out after rating Johnson's extremely over-rated skills to the point that you think he had any chance against a monster like Mr.Dempsey.
zuru

zuru wrote:

Grimm wrote:

tonyevs wrote:The way Johnson was everybody would have heard about it if it happened.

Not if he were to lose.........but I doubt that would happen.

GRIMM,
what are you thinking?that cheesing bastard Johnson,would be on the floor so fast ,the back of his head would be flat.Dempsey would have broken his ribs,jaw,and those big exaggerated pearly whites.After the fight ,it would look as if Johnson had a mouthful of chiclets,because his teeth would be dislodged.Grimm,I want you to go to your room for a 20 min time-out after rating Johnson's extremely over-rated skills to the point that you think he had any chance against a monster like Mr.Dempsey.
zuru

8)

Sugar Dus Leonard wrote:When Jack Johnson fought, he fought in a one dimensional boring clinch fest style that would have made John Ruiz proud. His offense and defense consisted of moving straight back... and lunging forward with a left hook that was thrown so wide that you just knew it didn't have any power on it. Johnson caused about as much excitement as a head cold.

Jack Dempsy was a sloppy mauling fighter that had little technique, he came forward and swarmed you while throwing sloppy punches. Dempsy would sime times look so wild in the ring that he reminded me of a flailing ape that had escaped from the zoo and was hell bent on revenge against the human race.

This match up is laughable... and any ways guys, Jack Dempsy was a racist and would have never fought Johnson because he was black. Therefore this debate shouldn't have even taken place, because the fight wouldn't have happened anyways.

Yeah and I suppose you'd have beaten them both with one hand tied behind your back? This post shows complete ignorance of two of the best heavyweights ever to step in the ring. Both of whom would have had a picnic with today’s so-called "champions".

Your post is laughable. Where is your evidence Dempsey was racist? Dempsey would have fought any fighter who deserved a shot at his title, Doc Kearns however had other ideas. Dempsey fought black fighters before his partnership with Kearns.

Dempsey signed to fight Harry Wills but the NYSAC called a halt. I don't think he had any feelings one way or the other about drawing the color line. He and Kearns were going for the best money match, whatever it might be. Good hustlers, they were. Ask Shelby, MT.
As for Johnson vs. Dempsey, if we're talking about a hypothetical fight with both at their peak, (Dempsey 1921, Johnson 1910) I have to go with Johnson. He could frustrate and smother hard punchers and brawlers. I wouldn't be surprised if Dempsey went foul-crazy like Jim Flynn. Johnson was just too composed and too much of a tactician to allow Dempsey to brawl successfully.

The supposed bout between Dempsey and Johnson taking place in Canada was in a 1980s magazine that was published by John Ort, I don't recall the title, but it was a nice looking magazine, all glossy photos, but they ran that article in their very first issue! I don't think anything has ever turned up, nor do I think that a fight of that magnitude would have just slipped by the rest of the newspaper press without either man, or anyone that would have watched it ever mentioning anything ever about it until around 1985!

Prime Dempsey was perfect in the offence. He was very good in coming in, no one could outbrawl him in his best times. Dempsey was such a fighter, whom you needed to outbox. Johnson obviously didn't possess abilities to keep Dempsey outside. I pick Dempsey to knock Johnson out.

DrDuke wrote: ↑03 Apr 2018, 12:15 Prime Dempsey was perfect in the offence. He was very good in coming in, no one could outbrawl him in his best times. Dempsey was such a fighter, whom you needed to outbox. Johnson obviously didn't possess abilities to keep Dempsey outside. I pick Dempsey to knock Johnson out.

The thing with Dempsey was that there was nothing like him. Smothering punches; relentless pursuit; amazingly strong; vicious determination. Having never seen Johnson in prime films that revealed anything useful, it's difficult to say, but knowing Dempsey, I'd not bet against him.

Boxscribe wrote: ↑16 Mar 2005, 13:52 an article by Lew Eskin who thinks that a 'secret' fight may have taken place in Canada.

NOBODY does this unless it's a fantasy written into an Apollo Creed vs Rocky Balboa movie... NOBODY is dumb enough to fight "secret" fights unless it's 2 high school kids or 2 drunks in a bar who go out to the back ally.

If it's a sparring session yes... Your coaches are there and you might be curious about the other boxer and just how good he is.. Sparring sessions can get rough. But you won't fight a guy on that level less you get paid a ton of money.

As for who would win this??? .... Johnson would fight Dempsey the way Tunney did and beat the crap out of him.

Kalan wrote: ↑03 Apr 2018, 16:01 As for who would win this??? .... Johnson would fight Dempsey the way Tunney did and beat the crap out of him.

Johnson had no such abilities.

Kalan wrote: ↑03 Apr 2018, 16:01 As for who would win this??? .... Johnson would fight Dempsey the way Tunney did and beat the crap out of him.

I definitely don't see that!

Kalan wrote: ↑03 Apr 2018, 16:01 As for who would win this??? .... Johnson would fight Dempsey the way Tunney did and beat the crap out of him.

Johnson was a totally different boxer to Tunney.

BitPlayer wrote: ↑03 Apr 2018, 16:19

Kalan wrote: ↑03 Apr 2018, 16:01 As for who would win this??? .... Johnson would fight Dempsey the way Tunney did and beat the crap out of him.

Johnson was a totally different boxer to Tunney.

Great jab... great reflexes.... excellent foot work and movement, but didn't run because he was stronger than everybody.... great counterpuncher.... great sense of distance and timing... great infighter and body puncher... All like Tunney.

Dempsey by first round KO; two different eras of fighting, Johnson never had anyone come at him with Dempsey's reckless abandoned; just like Willard he would have been overwhelmed and unable to adjust. Modern prize fighting began with Dempsey-Willard. Johnson fought at a different time, at a different pace.

Dempseys wild haymakers with loaded gloves would have been too much for the Galveston Giant.

Johnson didn't have the lateral movement (nor the punch) needed to keep Dempsey off him. He would go the way of Fulton, Willard and Firpo. The 'boxing match' Johnson supporters want to believe would happen, wouldn't.

APerno wrote: ↑08 Apr 2018, 13:44 Johnson didn't have the lateral movement (nor the punch) needed to keep Dempsey off him. He would go the way of Fulton, Willard and Firpo. The 'boxing match' Johnson supporters want to believe would happen, wouldn't.

Dempsey was very punchable... Prime Johnson was a master boxer and would beat and bat Jack's head off... What happened when Dempsey faced boxers like Willie Meehan, Tommy Gibbons, and Gene Tunney??? ... He couldn't find them... Styles make fights don't forget... Johnson was too big, strong, fast, clever, and skilled for Dempsey.

Jack Johnson wasn't some inept swinger like Willard, Firpo, Morris, Flynn, or Fulton...

Fulton also got flattened by Harry Wills, Johnson's sparring partner... Fulton was terribly hittable.

Johnson early on would be deadly serious against Dempsey by the middle rounds Johnson would have taken control of the fight and started to Bash the living day lights out of Dempsey by round 11 the fight would be halted with Johnson well on top punishing and taunting Dempsey until the police stop the slaughter.