BoxRec

Who are/were the best?

Chuck Bodak and Stitch spring to mind.

Angelo Dundee

Dundee?? One wellknown case and what else?

In Europe and England we had Paddy Byrne. He was fantastic. He brought his own stuff. We always joked that his adrenalin was 1000/1 and not 1/1000 as ordered. It certainly worked!

the dude was in Carmen Basilio's corner, and he never lost a FIGHT ON CUTS DID HE ?

Ray Arcel and Freddie Brown were great.

Caractacus wrote: ↑07 Dec 2023, 17:00 the dude was in Carmen Basilio's corner, and he never lost a FIGHT ON CUTS DID HE ?

Angelo Dundee learnt mostly about how to handle cuts from Chickie Ferrara at Stillman's Gym in NYC,
but he also learned from Charlie Goldman, Whitey Bimstein, Teddy Crystal, Freddie Brown,Ray Arcel.

you ever heard of a really old time boxing match,(pre-1940's)
were the fight was stopped due to cuts ?
Thats because fighters use to soak their faces in brine to toughen up the skin.
I wonder who the last champion was who soaked their face (and hands)in brine ?
Jack Dempsey ?

Milt Baily (of Philadelphia)had been Sonny Liston's cutman up until Lewiston Maine in 1965,
then he worked the corner for Joe Frazier.

Mick Williamson has been a top cutman in the UK for a long time.

who had been Henry Cooper's cutman ?
( and were they ever actually able to stop a cut from bleeding from him ?)

Were coagulants permitted in England during Cooper's career ?

goose 5 wrote: ↑12 Dec 2023, 20:21 Were coagulants permitted in England during Cooper's career ?

I dunno either , but I think England was very much more of a conservative society
back then it is now.
Henry Cooper began his boxing career only about 45 years after
The Victorian/Edwardian Times ended (1910).
Henry Coopers pro boxing debut was in September 1954.

Caractacus wrote: ↑07 Dec 2023, 17:00 the dude was in Carmen Basilio's corner, and he never lost a FIGHT ON CUTS DID HE ?

Dundee was one of the best cutmen in the business.

There is an art of being a cutman.

Just like kids who use paste and glue, a good boxing cut man can stop the flow of blood, limit swelling, grease up the boxers face to make the blows slip off the face and more. Some cut men can um, aid the a fighters offense by doing dirty things to a fighters gloves. Giving the fights illegal type of smelling drugs to help wake a man up, limit pain or drink " special " fluids to energize fighters. They do a lot more than work on cuts. This stuff isn't really regulated by boxing commisons..

Most fans , 99.9 % of them have no clue what these corner men can do.

Panama Lewis was skilled in these dark arts. But he acts are out of date.

Danny Holland was Henry Cooper's cutsman, although the two fell out just before Henry's rematch with Muhammad Ali at Wembley, inevitably over money. Danny pulled off a few miracles in Cooper's corner using 1/1000 adrenaline (as Woller mentions with Paddy Byrne). Ernie Fossey was another brilliant cutsman.

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑12 Dec 2023, 20:59

Caractacus wrote: ↑07 Dec 2023, 17:00 the dude was in Carmen Basilio's corner, and he never lost a FIGHT ON CUTS DID HE ?

Dundee was one of the best cutmen in the business.

Cassius Clay aka Muhammad Ali refereed to Dundee as a "Mr. Cutman".
after watching the second Basilio vrs Langlois fight on TV.
two well known cases where The "Master" 'pulled the iron from out of the fire"
-1954-

-1971-

I’d have to rate Freddie Brown because Vito Antuofermo won the middleweight belt and defended it a couple of times. Vito started bleeding halfway through the national anthem in most of his fights

according to Angelo Dundee in his book.
Freddie Brown use to use the "Monsel's Solution" for the cuts.

Brown was one of the best cutmen in the business.

In Gene Tunney's first fight with Harry Greb (1922)
In that fight ,Tunney suffered a really deep cut over the left eye( he was cut over the same eye earlier in training)
,(he was also cut over the right eye and nose fractured in two places was also bleeding profusely)
a four inch gash over the left eye down to the bone that cut an artery.
Doc Bagley and Tunney usually went to fights with 2 bottles of Adrenaline Chloride to coagulate the blood
for cuts, but the cut and other bleeding by Tunney ,was so bad they ended up using six bottles of Adrenaline chloride
over the 15 rounds.
Tunney once said, he estimated that he lost "two quarts of blood" in that one fight
(former featherweight champion Abe Attel (1904-1912)was in the audience supplied the other four
bottles of adrenaline chloride)
why he would have happened to have four bottles of it was not mentioned.
source A MAN MUST FIGHT by Gene Tunney (published in 1932)

Caractacus wrote: ↑20 Dec 2023, 13:38 according to Angelo Dundee in his book.
Freddie Brown use to use the "Monsel's Solution" for the cuts.

Freddie Brown was also Rocky Marciano's cut man for all his champion ship fights.
Al Weil had hired him the very morning (with a 50 dollar bill)of Marciano fist fight with Joe Walcott.
Freddie Brown also used Monsel Solution to put in Rocky Marciano's nose,
when Marciano nose was split lengthwise in the second fight with Ezzard Charles.
Monsel solution coagulated the blood and it was said to be like pouring in cement into a cut.
They had to immediatley cut it out in the dressing room, however it always left scars.
Monsel's solution was banned by boxing corners by 1960.

giacomino wrote: ↑20 Dec 2023, 03:13 I’d have to rate Freddie Brown because Vito Antuofermo won the middleweight belt and defended it a couple of times. Vito started bleeding halfway through the national anthem in most of his fights

I remember reading somewhere, where Vito Antuofermo said he had to have 75 stiches around the eyes, in his face and around his jaw, but there was 'No bleeding" wonder what Freddie Brown(in the Green sweater) had used then ?

Caractacus wrote: ↑05 Jan 2024, 16:55

giacomino wrote: ↑20 Dec 2023, 03:13 I’d have to rate Freddie Brown because Vito Antuofermo won the middleweight belt and defended it a couple of times. Vito started bleeding halfway through the national anthem in most of his fights

I remember reading somewhere, where Vito Antuofermo said he had to have 75 stiches around the eyes, in his face and around his jaw, but there was 'No bleeding" wonder what Freddie Brown(in the Green sweater) had used then ?

Good question, because he usually was bleeding by the end of the first round (like in Minter II and Hagler II) and he took way more punishment in Hagler I. I can't remember if it was right after the Hagler fight or later that he had surgery on his eyebrow areas because he had so much scar tissue. Only comparable amount of stitches needed I can remember in a Hagler title fight was Hamsho I. Hamsho needed 55 stitches after the fight and after watching it, I left the arena wondering how he stood up to the pounding so long having lost so much blood.
Been a long time since I watched Hagler v Vito I (I thought it was closer than a lot of folks on here) but I do remember him having a deep cut under his right eye (I think) that Brown stuffed with vasoline or something similar

Vito Antuofermo had five different cuts in the first fight.
I remember hearing back in the 1990's that some trainers were
using "Superglue".
'BTW
remember when the re-match almost didnt happenen because of a dispute over the salve ?
check out the article from the bottom of this newspaper page.


https://books.google.com/books?id=9qorA ... &pg=PA7&dq

Thats Freddie Brown ( in the green sweater) at age 71 yrs