BoxRec

168,12 rounds in Germany.

Ottke UD

In Germany, Ottke wins.

Ottke SD in Germany. Ottke holds a lot, ref breaks every time Cáñelo tries to punch him

If adalie byrd scored this in germany there would be a rip in the space time continuum

34-0

no blueprint

many tried, all failed

To be honest, I'd take Canelo even in Germany. I'll be that brave, lol.

Ottke was a good boxer. Irrespective of the fact, that he received a lot of hometown decisions. But somehow, I don't think he matches well with Canelo.

He has a good footwork, but he wasn't a helluva mover that Canelo would struggle to pin down.

He had a fine defense, but his high guard wasn't impossible to penetrate.

He doesn't hit hard enough to be able to hold Canelo off.

Wasn't big enough or physically strong enough to mess with Canelo at close and push him back (the way Bivol was able to do).

I don't think his shoeshine combos will do a lot to Canelo. Plus, Ottke didn't have Calzaghe's or Bivol's volume.

And given Canelo's great reflexes with upper body movement - a lot of those combos will simply be negated. Some stuff that will land - it's unlikely to have a lot of effect.

So, there will be some tricky rounds. Ottke will shade some of them.

But if Canelo comes in trim, without excessive muscle mass and takes an approach of a fast come forward counter-puncher (an approach he has mastered with years) as oppose to a Bivol fight approach (plod forward and load up with single blows) - he solves an Ottke puzzle after 2-3 rounds of getting into a groove. And then proceeds to outbox and outscore him with heavier, cleaner shots the rest of the way.

Now, why I believe Canelo takes a decision in Germany?

There were cases where the visiting fighter was able to win a dec in Germany. Not against Sven Ottke. But let's say, judges will feel Canelo's magnitude and won't dare to do some over the top shit.

Can't see it.

Canelo would be docked points for low blows etc....there is no way Canelo wins, not because he isn't good enough etc....You just don't get the W vs Ottke in Germany.

Watched his fights with Brewer I & II, Tate, Glencoffe, Mitchell and Reid and with a lot of help from the refs, some very generous scoring, won those bouts, which he probably would have lost in any other country.

Back then, Germany was notorious for favouring the hometown fighters, no matter how the fight panned out.

Short of knocking him spark out, he isn't winning and even then, he would probably be disqualified for some kind of foul.

NazNaci1 wrote: ↑09 May 2024, 17:25 Can't see it.

Canelo would be docked points for low blows etc....there is no way Canelo wins, not because he isn't good enough etc....You just don't get the W vs Ottke in Germany.

Watched his fights with Brewer I & II, Tate, Glencoffe, Mitchell and Reid and with a lot of help from the refs, some very generous scoring, won those bouts, which he probably would have lost in any other country.

Back then, Germany was notorious for favouring the hometown fighters, no matter how the fight panned out.

Short of knocking him spark out, he isn't winning and even then, he would probably be disqualified for some kind of foul.

I hear you. But... I decided to take a little risk here . I believe in Canelo, in this particular match-up. Though, of course, all the things you mentioned will make it tough even for a VIP fighter to get a clear decision.

EdwardRevolver1993 wrote: ↑10 May 2024, 05:01

NazNaci1 wrote: ↑09 May 2024, 17:25 Can't see it.

Canelo would be docked points for low blows etc....there is no way Canelo wins, not because he isn't good enough etc....You just don't get the W vs Ottke in Germany.

Watched his fights with Brewer I & II, Tate, Glencoffe, Mitchell and Reid and with a lot of help from the refs, some very generous scoring, won those bouts, which he probably would have lost in any other country.

Back then, Germany was notorious for favouring the hometown fighters, no matter how the fight panned out.

Short of knocking him spark out, he isn't winning and even then, he would probably be disqualified for some kind of foul.

I hear you. But... I decided to take a little risk here . I believe in Canelo, in this particular match-up. Though, of course, all the things you mentioned will make it tough even for a VIP fighter to get a clear decision.

I am with you anywhere but Germany. I think an in-form Canelo could dominate Ottke. But in terms of scoring/refereeing fights, while there are bad decisions most places, Germany during that era set a standard for corruption

giacomino wrote: ↑10 May 2024, 14:59

EdwardRevolver1993 wrote: ↑10 May 2024, 05:01

NazNaci1 wrote: ↑09 May 2024, 17:25 Can't see it.

Canelo would be docked points for low blows etc....there is no way Canelo wins, not because he isn't good enough etc....You just don't get the W vs Ottke in Germany.

Watched his fights with Brewer I & II, Tate, Glencoffe, Mitchell and Reid and with a lot of help from the refs, some very generous scoring, won those bouts, which he probably would have lost in any other country.

Back then, Germany was notorious for favouring the hometown fighters, no matter how the fight panned out.

Short of knocking him spark out, he isn't winning and even then, he would probably be disqualified for some kind of foul.

I hear you. But... I decided to take a little risk here . I believe in Canelo, in this particular match-up. Though, of course, all the things you mentioned will make it tough even for a VIP fighter to get a clear decision.

I am with you anywhere but Germany. I think an in-form Canelo could dominate Ottke. But in terms of scoring/refereeing fights, while there are bad decisions most places, Germany during that era set a standard for corruption

Yes, true. Interestingly, Axel Schulz may have been the unluckiest German boxer of that time. Back in the days, when it was very hard for a visiting fighter to win a decision in Germany, Schulz appeared on the wrong end of two close decisions - against Moorer and Botha. Ironically, Schulz had a very good case of actually winning both fights

EdwardRevolver1993 wrote: ↑11 May 2024, 02:46

giacomino wrote: ↑10 May 2024, 14:59

EdwardRevolver1993 wrote: ↑10 May 2024, 05:01

I hear you. But... I decided to take a little risk here . I believe in Canelo, in this particular match-up. Though, of course, all the things you mentioned will make it tough even for a VIP fighter to get a clear decision.

I am with you anywhere but Germany. I think an in-form Canelo could dominate Ottke. But in terms of scoring/refereeing fights, while there are bad decisions most places, Germany during that era set a standard for corruption

Yes, true. Interestingly, Axel Schulz may have been the unluckiest German boxer of that time. Back in the days, when it was very hard for a visiting fighter to win a decision in Germany, Schulz appeared on the wrong end of two close decisions - against Moorer and Botha. Ironically, Schulz had a very good case of actually winning both fights

Sturm was an odd case. He got favorable decisions on several occasions in his prime in Germany but he also had a couple that he lost/drew later in his career where he could have gotten the nod.

giacomino wrote: ↑11 May 2024, 14:08

EdwardRevolver1993 wrote: ↑11 May 2024, 02:46

giacomino wrote: ↑10 May 2024, 14:59
I am with you anywhere but Germany. I think an in-form Canelo could dominate Ottke. But in terms of scoring/refereeing fights, while there are bad decisions most places, Germany during that era set a standard for corruption

Yes, true. Interestingly, Axel Schulz may have been the unluckiest German boxer of that time. Back in the days, when it was very hard for a visiting fighter to win a decision in Germany, Schulz appeared on the wrong end of two close decisions - against Moorer and Botha. Ironically, Schulz had a very good case of actually winning both fights

Sturm was an odd case. He got favorable decisions on several occasions in his prime in Germany but he also had a couple that he lost/drew later in his career where he could have gotten the nod.

Oh, yeah. Geale, Murray and Soliman (1st bout) fights all could've went Sturm's way. All took place in Germany. But Sturm is 0-1-1 in those fights.