BoxRec

This makes the Warren/ Hatton saga sound rediculously boring. This is really interesting, seems like John Ruiz is taking Toney to court and is suing him for loss of future earnings as a result of beating him with the aid of performance enhancing drugs.

Looking at it at face value, he has a case and can take it from one of two angles.

1) Had Toney not been on the drugs, he would have won and his marquee value would have increased, now it has dimished.

2) Toney gave him more of a beating than he would have when not under the influence - this could have an adverse effect on Ruiz' future performances in the ring - i.e. Ruiz will not be the same fighter after the Toney defeat, he'll be a little bit worn.

I think this could just fastrack Toney vs Ruiz II, probably would be the best "compensation" for Ruiz - to fight arguably the biggest active box office heavyweight fighter - for the lions share of the purse. Could a judge overule the WBA's suspension of Toney.

stujones wrote:.

I think this could just fastrack Toney vs Ruiz II

I hope your right. If Ruiz is so pissed that he lost to Toney then having a rematch with a clean Toney is the way to settle it I'd have thought.

The argument about the loss having an adverse effect on Ruiz' career is weak IMO. If he is a true champion, then he should surely feel he has the requirements to beat a clean Toney

This is ridiculous. Unfortunately quite typical of our American sue happy society. The only thing adversely effecting John Ruiz career is his own fighting style. I should sue him for boredom.

RobD wrote: I should sue him for boredom.

Great line!

Ruiz knows Toney is the true WBA champ.

Toney was on medication from his injury and that could cause inflamation and could of gave a higher nandrolone count as it was nandrolone after all, not some anabolic crap.

Toney Ko's him in court and in a rematch.

Max Molyneux wrote:Ruiz knows Toney is the true WBA champ.

Toney was on medication from his injury and that could cause inflamation and could of gave a higher nandrolone count as it was nandrolone after all, not some anabolic crap.

Toney Ko's him in court and in a rematch.

nandrolone was the drug that all the sprinters seemed to use a few years back. if the olympic athlete`s are using it i`m pretty sure it`ll be good stuff. as much as ruiz seems to wind us all up toney cheated.
there`s a definate grey area in boxers using performance enhancing drugs, in athletics its one thing where beating a man in a race you maybe bruise his pride but in a sport where the sole intent is to inflict physical damage on your opponents (unlike say rugby or american footy where you try to score a try / touchdown) using roids is like loading your gloves imo.

Slightly off topic. THe US olympic commitee are trying to get IOC to use their powers so that Italy wont use their anti doping laws during the winter olympics in Torino. In Italy you can go to jail if you use doping and somehow the americans are against that, I wonder why? It doesnt seem to affect the alpine, cross country ect skiers, but I wonder if the laws are in affect during the olympics that the number of NHL players might drop alot? I really hope that the italians stick by their own laws.

Freiheit wrote:Slightly off topic. THe US olympic commitee are trying to get IOC to use their powers so that Italy wont use their anti doping laws during the winter olympics in Torino. In Italy you can go to jail if you use doping and somehow the americans are against that, I wonder why? It doesnt seem to affect the alpine, cross country ect skiers, but I wonder if the laws are in affect during the olympics that the number of NHL players might drop alot? I really hope that the italians stick by their own laws.

if thats true its a disgrace that the u.s olympic commitee are going down that road.

stujones wrote:This makes the Warren/ Hatton saga sound rediculously boring. This is really interesting, seems like John Ruiz is taking Toney to court and is suing him for loss of future earnings as a result of beating him with the aid of performance enhancing drugs.

Looking at it at face value, he has a case and can take it from one of two angles.

1) Had Toney not been on the drugs, he would have won and his marquee value would have increased, now it has dimished.

2) Toney gave him more of a beating than he would have when not under the influence - this could have an adverse effect on Ruiz' future performances in the ring - i.e. Ruiz will not be the same fighter after the Toney defeat, he'll be a little bit worn.

I think this could just fastrack Toney vs Ruiz II, probably would be the best "compensation" for Ruiz - to fight arguably the biggest active box office heavyweight fighter - for the lions share of the purse. Could a judge overule the WBA's suspension of Toney.

This is the biggest load of bollocks I have ever heard.

Ruiz cant prove any of this. Its just speculation

headhunter wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:Ruiz knows Toney is the true WBA champ.

Toney was on medication from his injury and that could cause inflamation and could of gave a higher nandrolone count as it was nandrolone after all, not some anabolic crap.

Toney Ko's him in court and in a rematch.

nandrolone was the drug that all the sprinters seemed to use a few years back. if the olympic athlete`s are using it i`m pretty sure it`ll be good stuff. as much as ruiz seems to wind us all up toney cheated.
there`s a definate grey area in boxers using performance enhancing drugs, in athletics its one thing where beating a man in a race you maybe bruise his pride but in a sport where the sole intent is to inflict physical damage on your opponents (unlike say rugby or american footy where you try to score a try / touchdown) using roids is like loading your gloves imo.

Well since Nandrolone can be produced by the body how do we know that Toney cheated if he was on medication to heal an injured arm?

Steroids only help you gain strength and Speed it doesn't do crap for your skill, skills and timing come from yourself so doesn't really make your punching skill or power better.

Plus he hardly trained for Ruiz till 4 weeks before the fight and was doing nothing but sit on his fat arse for months waiting for his arm to heal.

Toney paid the price so Ruiz can;t do shit and would have to prove he took them intentially.

Max Molyneux wrote:

headhunter wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:Ruiz knows Toney is the true WBA champ.

Toney was on medication from his injury and that could cause inflamation and could of gave a higher nandrolone count as it was nandrolone after all, not some anabolic crap.

Toney Ko's him in court and in a rematch.

nandrolone was the drug that all the sprinters seemed to use a few years back. if the olympic athlete`s are using it i`m pretty sure it`ll be good stuff. as much as ruiz seems to wind us all up toney cheated.
there`s a definate grey area in boxers using performance enhancing drugs, in athletics its one thing where beating a man in a race you maybe bruise his pride but in a sport where the sole intent is to inflict physical damage on your opponents (unlike say rugby or american footy where you try to score a try / touchdown) using roids is like loading your gloves imo.

Well since Nandrolone can be produced by the body how do we know that Toney cheated if he was on medication to heal an injured arm?

Steroids only help you gain strength and Speed it doesn't do crap for your skill, skills and timing come from yourself so doesn't really make your punching skill or power better.

Plus he hardly trained for Ruiz till 4 weeks before the fight and was doing nothing but sit on his fat arse for months waiting for his arm to heal.

Toney paid the price so Ruiz can;t do shit and would have to prove he took them intentially.

i know nandrolone is produced by the body naturally but for him to fail a drugs test you imagine there were abnormal levels of the drug in his system, though i must admit i aint a doctor and havent a clue in what amounts it was found in but i doubt we are talking trace value`s here.
i`m not saying max that a course of the roids are going to turn you into joe gans or ray robinson skillwise or a few needles in the arse are going to turn a crap fighter into a hall of famer but it could give evenly matched fighters an edge. what roids do give you as you rightly say are strength and speed and these are important parts of a fighters armoury too. in fact some successfull fighters have traded on those attributes alone.
you again rightly point out that the gear wouldnt aid timing or punching skill but if you already posess these skills like toney the added speed and power would make him a far more destructive puncher than he would be. roids wouldnt create a big puncher but they would certainly enhance one.
toney is a hundred times the fighter that ruiz is and if he has taken roids it probably is to heal the injury, after all they give people with arthritis steroids, but the fact remains he shouldnt have (thats if he did of course).
in recent years there have been drugs alligations thrown at a fair few american fighters who have jumped through the weights recently, and as anyone who has ever weight trained knows to put on muscle quick is not easy task without the aid of drugs. in fact it takes years.
someone in another thread mentioned that ezzard charles once said he really struggled at heavy because when he tried to put weight on he just kept on losing what he`d gained with the cardio vascular stuff that is the backbone of a boxers workout in the gym and on the road. how many of these modern fighters are bypassing this obstacle with drugs?

Isn't Ruiz also suing to get released from the grips of Don King? King has his faults but he made a champion out of a guy like that so Ruiz needs to come to his senses and stick with the Don.