BoxRec

Overrated
1) Lennox Lewis (Average in a poor era)
2) Rocky Marcianco (Fought Nobody, short bald armature)
3) Mike Tyson (Iron man? Tin Man more like it)
4) Henry Cooper/Frank Bruno (just to add British interest, to be honest even the 2 of them fighting together would still got knocked out by any others)
5)......

Underrated
1)Larry Holmes (Possibly the greatest)
2)Floyd Patterson (Shamefully turned into a joke figure)
3)Jerry Quarry (Could of been the best due to bad management)
4)Ron Lyle (was this the biggest hitter of all time above shavers?)
5)Joe Bugner (Archived so little for a great talent)

Patterson was mighty protected, thought he may have been screwed in the Maxim fight, he got bombed out plenty of times by finer fighters, namely Sonny Liston.

tigerpomfret wrote:Overrated
1) Lennox Lewis (Average in a poor era)
2) Rocky Marcianco (Fought Nobody, short bald armature)
3) Mike Tyson (Iron man? Tin Man more like it)
4) Henry Cooper/Frank Bruno (just to add British interest, to be honest even the 2 of them fighting together would still got knocked out by any others)
5)......

Underrated
1)Larry Holmes (Possibly the greatest)
2)Floyd Patterson (Shamefully turned into a joke figure)
3)Jerry Quarry (Could of been the best due to bad management)
4)Ron Lyle (was this the biggest hitter of all time above shavers?)
5)Joe Bugner (Archived so little for a great talent)

i have never seen a post where u havnt gone out of ur way to degrade marciano and lennox




boxrec has way to many lewis haters and bugner nuthuggers. i have never seen so many bugner nuthuggers in my life!

Bugner was one of the fair few boxers who could actually box.
He was unmarked in his all career.

tigerpomfret wrote:Bugner was one of the fair few boxers who could actually box.
He was unmarked in his all career.

Go watch the Shavers fight.

Overated

1. Lewis
2. Marciano
3. Johannson



Underated

1. Coetzee
2. Patterson
3. Holmes
4. Tyson
5. Ruddock

boxrec= anti marciano and lennox forum

Overrated are Dempsey and (sorry, Brockton) Marciano. While both were great and very popular heayweights, people who place them in their top 5 hype them up way too much.

Underrated are the black heavyweight contenders before Joe Louis, especially Harry Wills and Sam Langford. Slightly underrated is also Jack Sharkey in my book. More recenlty, Larry Holmes doesn't always get the respect he deserves, and neither does Lennox Lewis.

And then there are some farily unreasonable Vitali Klitschko haters here whose point I don't quite get. As soon as you say Vitali is one of the leading heavyweights of the 2000s - while adding in the next phrase that the 2000s are a weak period - they go nuts.

pundit,


i notice how u say underated "BLACK heavyweights pre louis"



then when it comes to overated u say marciano and dempsey who are both white.



do u have an agenda against jack and rock cause there white?






how is marciano overated?

A. he never lost

B. he beat the best of his era and dominated his era

C. he beat 4 hall of famers, 3 who were still great fighters

D. he beat the best contenders out there pre title

e. he showed true heart of a champion

F. he had incredible stamina, power, strength, work ethic and he was underated in the skill department



what more do u expect?

pundit wrote:And then there are some farily unreasonable Vitali Klitschko haters here whose point I don't quite get. As soon as you say Vitali is one of the leading heavyweights of the 2000s - while adding in the next phrase that the 2000s are a weak period - they go nuts.

I don't think anyone would question that he was a top HW of 2000+. But to say that he was THE MAN in the HW division at any time during his career just seems a bit over the top.

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:boxrec= anti marciano and lennox forum

I don't think you can really say that Marciano is disliked on this forum... he has many supporters here, though obviously you are probably his biggest. I think there are quite a few people like myself who feel Marcinao is overrated to certain extents but thats not to say we are Rocky haters, I certainly don't dislike the guy...

Brockton:

I have absolutely no agenda. I do think though that black fighters in the "color line"-period still don't receive the respect they deserve - in large measure because the official title was always held by whites (except for JJ), and the official title continues predetermine views unduly. Only Joe Louis broke through he color line once and for all.

As for Marciano, there is an own thread where I voiced my opinion.

Cheers, P

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:pundit,


i notice how u say underated "BLACK heavyweights pre louis"



then when it comes to overated u say marciano and dempsey who are both white.



do u have an agenda against jack and rock cause there white?






how is marciano overated?

A. he never lost

B. he beat the best of his era and dominated his era

C. he beat 4 hall of famers, 3 who were still great fighters

D. he beat the best contenders out there pre title

e. he showed true heart of a champion

F. he had incredible stamina, power, strength, work ethic and he was underated in the skill department



what more do u expect?

It is a fair question to ask whether Rocky would have been so popular had he been black?... what if Ezzard Charles had been white, would he be so underrated today?... what if Joe Frazier had been white?....
Its fair to say that iF Dempsey had been black he would never have got near the title, while if Harry Wills had been white he may well have been champion....

tigerpomfret wrote:Overrated
1) Lennox Lewis (Average in a poor era)
2) Rocky Marcianco (Fought Nobody, short bald armature)
3) Mike Tyson (Iron man? Tin Man more like it)
4) Henry Cooper/Frank Bruno (just to add British interest, to be honest even the 2 of them fighting together would still got knocked out by any others)
5)......

Underrated
1)Larry Holmes (Possibly the greatest)
2)Floyd Patterson (Shamefully turned into a joke figure)
3)Jerry Quarry (Could of been the best due to bad management)
4)Ron Lyle (was this the biggest hitter of all time above shavers?)
5)Joe Bugner (Archived so little for a great talent)

What is this thing you have against Cooper?.... you praise Bugner and demaen Cooper yet Henry gave Joe a very tough fight aged 37... if he was so bad why did Bugner have such a hard fight...
I've heard rumours that you are in fact Brian London , is there any truth to this?... it would explain the anti Cooper stance as Henry beat you a fair few times eh!....

I think Holmes was likely under rated. Patterson Patterson...I give up, I don't mean to beat a dead horse but I don't agree. He's not a joke...he's just average.

I've seen some Lewis fans here and Brocky...there are some Rocky fans here to....how do you figure this is a Rocky Knockin forum?

I had never really paid much attention to boxing "pre-when I started watching it in the late 80's"...... I knew alot of the names of the past greats and some factoids, but never really cared to study much into it.... Pretty recently though I learned that Rocky was down on the cards in alot of his fights post-title, and was getting outboxed, and he landed some big blows to take the other guy out.

Not going to say Marciano is overated (my grandfather sometimes reads this site), but given this fact as far as his skill as a boxer he might be alittle overated by people like me who dont look back into the far past of boxing....

Just my 2 cent I dont post in this forum much.

Probably the most underrated: Gene Tunney. Ezzard Charles, thankfully, is finally getting his due.

pundit wrote:And then there are some farily unreasonable Vitali Klitschko haters here whose point I don't quite get. As soon as you say Vitali is one of the leading heavyweights of the 2000s - while adding in the next phrase that the 2000s are a weak period - they go nuts.

agreed

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:boxrec= anti marciano and lennox forum

agree about Lennox, seems to be pretty even with Marciano IMO

underated: ezzard charles, floyd patterson, jack sharkey, sam langford, harry wills, max schmeling


overated: gene tunney, lennox lewis, evander holyfield, jack johnson's accomplishments

I think people think Marciano's overrated cuz he isn't a textbook boxer, he had his own awkward style that doesn't mean he wasn't without skill, you don't get 49-0 by knowing absolutely nothing

Overrated:
Marciano (I don't consider BB as someone who overrates Maricano BTW, but I have heard many mention him in the same breath as Ali and Louis which is unjustified because Rocky did not beat a good enough quality of opposition over long enough a period of time to be considered greatest ever. I rate him No 5 all time.)
Tyson (Some still think there was none better than Tyson in his prime, despite the fact that he beat no better than B grade fighters. The fact that some say he would beat Ali is laughable IMO. I rate him No 12 all time.)
Dempsey (Was an undoubtedly great fighter, but does not have the record to back it up. Kind of like Tyson really.)
Johnson (Best defense ever, but lost far too many fights to be a top 3 of all time like some suggest. I rate him No 9, which I think is quite generous).
Lewis (I am a Lennox fan, but I find it painful when I hear people say he would beat Joe Louis on size alone. Holyfield is a pretty similar size to Louis, only with less power, and Lewis had enough trouble with him. I rate him No 7 all time)

Underrated
Marciano (Many on this forum place the Rock near the bottom, or outside their top10, on the basis that he never beat anyone of mention and was not champ for all that long. Fair points, but blown way out of proportion by some.)
Holmes (His record alone justifies a top5 place IMO. His quality of opposition may not have been great, but he was never beaten in his prime and had a good KO record. Much like Joe Louis. I rate him No 3 of all time.)
Lewis (There are a lot of Lewis hater out there also, who underrate Lewis simply because he was often very defensive and made boring fights, and was also lazy in getting KO'd by two very ordinary heavyweights. This may have been so, but he is also a 3 time champ who beat everyone he fought and is 4th of all time in terms of successful title defenses.)

Slikov

I've heard rumours that you are in fact Brian London , is there any truth to this

Maybe I am maybe I'm not. But the truth is the only reason Henry Cooper won that 15 rounder was the same old story. He had the crowed, the judges and the ref in his poket as usaul. And he was so badly hurt he couldn't fight for nearly a year. And don't forget as soon as the fight was over Patterson challenged the winner but as usaul Cooper refused any fight in America and Brian London took up the challenge and put up a great display agaist the Champion.