BoxRec

Let’s just take a brief look at some boxers to come out of the United Kingdom and compare them to Mr. Calzaghe.
Win lose or draw these British fighters fought dangerous opponents or at the very least boxers who were expected to beat them or give them a serious run for their money.
In some of the cases the fights turned out to be one sided, but the intentions were honorable and the fights were well matched for the most part.
Compare them to Joe Calzaghe's,Im sure you have seen his record by now.

FRANK BRUNO v
Tim Witherspoon
Mike Tyson [Twice]
Lennox Lewis
Oliver McCall

LENNOX LEWIS v
Razor Ruddock
Ray Mercer
Andrew Golota
Evander Holyfield [Twice]
David Tua
Hasim Rahman
Vitali Klitschko

DANNY WILLIAMS v
Vitali Klitschko
Mike Tyson [Going in this wasn't a fight Williams was expected to win]

HERBIE HIDE v
Riddick Bowe
Vitali Klitschko

HOWARD EASTMAN v
Bernard Hopkins
William Joppy

HEROL GRAHAM v
Sumbu Kalambay [Twice]
Mike McCallum
Julian Jackson

NIGEL BENN v
Michael Watson
Chris Eubank [Twice]
Gerald McClellan
Steve Collins

MICHAEL WATSON v
Nigel Benn
Chris Eubank [Twice]
Mike McCallum

CHRIS EUBANK v
Nigel Benn [Twice]
Michael Watson [Twice]
Graciano Rocchigiani
Steve Collins

NASEEM HAMED v
Tom Johnson
Kevin Kelley
Marco Antonio Barrera

COLIN JONES

Kirkland Lang [Twice]
Milton McCrory [Twice]
Don Curry

JIM McDONNELL

Brian Mitchell
Barry McGuigan
Azumah Nelson

TONY SIBSON

Marvin Hagler
Mark Kaylor
Dennis Andries [This was a challenging fight because it was one of Sibson’s first bouts as a Light Heavyweight]

DENNIS ANDRIES

Thomas Hearns
Jeff Harding [Three Times]

PAT COWDELL

Salvador Sanchez
Azumah Nelson

LLOYD HONEYGHAN

Gianfranco Rossi
Don Curry
Maurice Blocker
Marlon Starling



How does Joe Calzaghe compare in terms of opponents fought ?

I think these days it is easier to get big pay days without fighting particularly great fighters, so a lot of guys milk it for all it's worth.

Evander wrote:Let’s just take a brief look at some boxers to come out of the United Kingdom and compare them to Mr. Calzaghe.
Win lose or draw these British fighters fought dangerous opponents or at the very least boxers who were expected to beat them or give them a serious run for their money.
In some of the cases the fights turned out to be one sided, but the intentions were honorable and the fights were well matched for the most part.
Compare them to Joe Calzaghe's,Im sure you have seen his record by now.

FRANK BRUNO v
Tim Witherspoon
Mike Tyson [Twice]
Lennox Lewis
Oliver McCall

LENNOX LEWIS v
Razor Ruddock
Ray Mercer
Andrew Golota
Evander Holyfield [Twice]
David Tua
Hasim Rahman
Vitali Klitschko

DANNY WILLIAMS v
Vitali Klitschko
Mike Tyson [Going in this wasn't a fight Williams was expected to win]

HERBIE HIDE v
Riddick Bowe
Vitali Klitschko

HOWARD EASTMAN v
Bernard Hopkins
William Joppy

HEROL GRAHAM v
Sumbu Kalambay [Twice]
Mike McCallum
Julian Jackson

NIGEL BENN v
Michael Watson
Chris Eubank [Twice]
Gerald McClellan
Steve Collins

MICHAEL WATSON v
Nigel Benn
Chris Eubank [Twice]
Mike McCallum

CHRIS EUBANK v
Nigel Benn [Twice]
Michael Watson [Twice]
Graciano Rocchigiani
Steve Collins

NASEEM HAMED v
Tom Johnson
Kevin Kelley
Marco Antonio Barrera

COLIN JONES

Kirkland Lang [Twice]
Milton McCrory [Twice]
Don Curry

JIM McDONNELL

Brian Mitchell
Barry McGuigan
Azumah Nelson

TONY SIBSON

Marvin Hagler
Mark Kaylor
Dennis Andries [This was a challenging fight because it was one of Sibson’s first bouts as a Light Heavyweight]

DENNIS ANDRIES

Thomas Hearns
Jeff Harding [Three Times]

PAT COWDELL

Salvador Sanchez
Azumah Nelson

LLOYD HONEYGHAN

Gianfranco Rossi
Don Curry
Maurice Blocker
Marlon Starling



How does Joe Calzaghe compare in terms of opponents fought ?

I think you are being a little harsh on calzaghe as if you listed some of his best opponents they would measure up.

As for Tony Sibson, you can add Dwight Davison and John Collins to that list.

Tony would be a champion today.

He would have beat 40 yr old Bhop and Taylor

calzaghe's path has been an easy one at times. but there are good wins on his ledger & I have little doubt that he would've beaten prime versions of Benn and Eubank.

I think Calzaghe, if this HBO stuff comes off, will fight Tarver late in the year. Don't know if that'll be hard or not. Tarver has a good defense, long reach, counter punching skills and punching power. On the other hand, I doubt his stamina at this stage, and isn't particularly strong physically (in that 1st fight, Eric Harding really broke him down, Tarver made Harding look like Chavez!)

if he manages wins over Lacy and Tarver in the space of a year, we definitely would have to reevaluate

IMO Calzaghe's toughest test would have been Steve Collins. a real hard bastard, & one of the better 168 champs, but SC pulled out. Collins at s/m was so much better than the m/w one who lost to boxing masters Kalambay and McCallum

With Benn you can add Iran Barlkly & Doug DeWitt. ALso most of the fighters mentined fought tough europeans, sort of opponents that often do not get mentioned.

viciousmaussa wrote: IMO Calzaghe's toughest test would have been Steve Collins. a real hard bastard, & one of the better 168 champs, but SC pulled out. Collins at s/m was so much better than the m/w one who lost to boxing masters Kalambay and McCallum

Steve pulled out for a good reason - he realised he was on the slide and got out on whilst at the top(ish).

He was floored by no mark CRaig Cummings, which was a warning sign and I belivee he suffered some sort of black out against Howard Eastman in sparring in the build up to the calzaghe match.

Its a shame because as you say, a bullish SC would have given Joe hell although I would fancy the welshman on points.

TerribleTerry wrote:

viciousmaussa wrote: IMO Calzaghe's toughest test would have been Steve Collins. a real hard bastard, & one of the better 168 champs, but SC pulled out. Collins at s/m was so much better than the m/w one who lost to boxing masters Kalambay and McCallum

Steve pulled out for a good reason - he realised he was on the slide and got out on whilst at the top(ish).

He was floored by no mark CRaig Cummings, which was a warning sign and I belivee he suffered some sort of black out against Howard Eastman in sparring in the build up to the calzaghe match.

Its a shame because as you say, a bullish SC would have given Joe hell although I would fancy the welshman on points.

i remember collins having something legitimately wrong with him, but what a fight that would've been. shame it didn't, as it sort of set a pattern for calzaghe's career with attractive fights not happening. at s/m collins looked like a decent sized light heavy & was a right handful, would've made joe calzaghe fight for it all the way

Don't forget Benn also beat DeWitt and Barklay.

So what do you do if despite big money offers the best guys want no part of you, which is what is happening with JC. His display against Lacy has them all turning him down or asking for crazy sums knowing they will get passed over.

boxingchat wrote:So what do you do if despite big money offers the best guys want no part of you, which is what is happening with JC. His display against Lacy has them all turning him down or asking for crazy sums knowing they will get passed over.

I am sure this was not the case PRE LAcy, however.

How do you justify years of feasting on Tocker Pudwell et al?

sometimes it's calzaghe's fault, sometimes not. must have been much easier to get fights vs mitchell and brewer After they were eased out of their title reigns by ottke.

Calzaghe really frustrates me, because I know the man is very talented.

I believe that he is the best UK fighter of the last 10-15 years, but you simply cannot give him the ranking he deserves, because he hasn't really fought anybody of major note.

It's a real shame that he's 34 now, because I believe he could have been a great fighter.

Calzaghe is an embarrassment and most of us know it.
He has ducked and dived he way through through pro boxing so much his first name should have a K in it after the O.
He was dragged kicking and screaming into this fight with Jeff Lacy and quite honestly if it wasn't for the outrage of the boxing public he probably wouldn't have taken the bout.
Again look him,the first chance post Lacy and there he is again looking for boxers who have little or no chance of beating him.
It's funny with Calzaghe it's allways one excuse after another with him,but when you are 33 years of age and all you can say is I beat a shopworn Chris Eubank[again nicely timed from Joe]and Jeff Lacy his career and standing in the pro ranks leave a lot to be desired when compared to some of the finer British boxers of past and present.
At least they were man enough to have tough fights unlike JOKE CALZAGHE.

TerribleTerry wrote:

viciousmaussa wrote: IMO Calzaghe's toughest test would have been Steve Collins. a real hard bastard, & one of the better 168 champs, but SC pulled out. Collins at s/m was so much better than the m/w one who lost to boxing masters Kalambay and McCallum

Steve pulled out for a good reason - he realised he was on the slide and got out on whilst at the top(ish).

He was floored by no mark CRaig Cummings, which was a warning sign and I belivee he suffered some sort of black out against Howard Eastman in sparring in the build up to the calzaghe match.

Its a shame because as you say, a bullish SC would have given Joe hell although I would fancy the welshman on points.

At a press conference Calzaghe called him "the Celtic worrier".

Evander wrote:Let’s just take a brief look at some boxers to come out of the United Kingdom and compare them to Mr. Calzaghe.
Win lose or draw these British fighters fought dangerous opponents or at the very least boxers who were expected to beat them or give them a serious run for their money.
In some of the cases the fights turned out to be one sided, but the intentions were honorable and the fights were well matched for the most part.
Compare them to Joe Calzaghe's,Im sure you have seen his record by now.

FRANK BRUNO v
Tim Witherspoon
Mike Tyson [Twice]
Lennox Lewis
Oliver McCall

LENNOX LEWIS v
Razor Ruddock
Ray Mercer
Andrew Golota
Evander Holyfield [Twice]
David Tua
Hasim Rahman
Vitali Klitschko

DANNY WILLIAMS v
Vitali Klitschko
Mike Tyson [Going in this wasn't a fight Williams was expected to win]

HERBIE HIDE v
Riddick Bowe
Vitali Klitschko

HOWARD EASTMAN v
Bernard Hopkins
William Joppy

HEROL GRAHAM v
Sumbu Kalambay [Twice]
Mike McCallum
Julian Jackson

NIGEL BENN v
Michael Watson
Chris Eubank [Twice]
Gerald McClellan
Steve Collins

MICHAEL WATSON v
Nigel Benn
Chris Eubank [Twice]
Mike McCallum

CHRIS EUBANK v
Nigel Benn [Twice]
Michael Watson [Twice]
Graciano Rocchigiani
Steve Collins

NASEEM HAMED v
Tom Johnson
Kevin Kelley
Marco Antonio Barrera

COLIN JONES

Kirkland Lang [Twice]
Milton McCrory [Twice]
Don Curry

JIM McDONNELL

Brian Mitchell
Barry McGuigan
Azumah Nelson

TONY SIBSON

Marvin Hagler
Mark Kaylor
Dennis Andries [This was a challenging fight because it was one of Sibson’s first bouts as a Light Heavyweight]

DENNIS ANDRIES

Thomas Hearns
Jeff Harding [Three Times]

PAT COWDELL

Salvador Sanchez
Azumah Nelson

LLOYD HONEYGHAN

Gianfranco Rossi
Don Curry
Maurice Blocker
Marlon Starling



How does Joe Calzaghe compare in terms of opponents fought ?

I've got my criticisms of Joe but your list undermines the very point you are trying to make. Taken over his career as a whole, Joe has got names on there that compare favourably to most on your list. And there's a big difference between fighting a great (like Pat Cowdell's fights) and beating a great. By definition, if you're a lesser fighter you will take part in more fights against boxers who are expected to beat you.

Frank Bruno spent most of his career knocking over fighters who could barely make it into the ring, if Howard Eastman had shown just one percent of the fight that Joe has showed in his big matches he would be a world champion by now and if there is anything honorable (to use your word) about Herbie Hide getting battered from pillar to post by Riddick Bowe I'd like to know what it is.

Pat might have lost to Salvador Sanchez but he put in a great effort in that fight - in todays day and age Pat would have picked up all sorts of titles.

Vastly under rated is Pat Cowdell.

Evander wrote:Calzaghe is an embarrassment and most of us know it.
He has ducked and dived he way through through pro boxing so much his first name should have a K in it after the O.
He was dragged kicking and screaming into this fight with Jeff Lacy and quite honestly if it wasn't for the outrage of the boxing public he probably wouldn't have taken the bout.
Again look him,the first chance post Lacy and there he is again looking for boxers who have little or no chance of beating him.
It's funny with Calzaghe it's allways one excuse after another with him,but when you are 33 years of age and all you can say is I beat a shopworn Chris Eubank[again nicely timed from Joe]and Jeff Lacy his career and standing in the pro ranks leave a lot to be desired when compared to some of the finer British boxers of past and present.
At least they were man enough to have tough fights unlike JOKE CALZAGHE.

you're ridiculous. the eubank fight was made last min after collins pulled out. collins is rated by even most yanks as a top 10 super middle champ...fact is Calzaghe also beat Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Mitchell, Lacy, Sheika. those are good world class names even if they're not perfect.

oh, don't be so sure he's only going to fight ppl with no chance of beating him. for his autumn date, the most prominent name is Tarver

See Boxing chat knows how much their shitting one when Calzaghe wants them.

At a press conference Calzaghe called him "the Celtic worrier".

Anyway if the fight was made with Collins then why did he realise he was on the slide at the last minute instead of before the fight was made?

Thats ducking talk to me.

Max Molyneux wrote:See Boxing chat knows how much their shitting one when Calzaghe wants them.

At a press conference Calzaghe called him "the Celtic worrier".

Anyway if the fight was made with Collins then why did he realise he was on the slide at the last minute instead of before the fight was made?

Thats ducking talk to me.

As someone else has already pointed out above, Collins had a blackout in sparring in preperation for the fight so it wasn't simply a case of ducking out of the fight. There were medical reasons behind it.

Ah well, would of been a good one to watch if it happened anyway.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Don't forget Benn also beat DeWitt and Barklay.

And Wharton also. Note, it was Wharton's first title fight, when he was at his prime. Wharton felt that was his best chance in that he was at his best, but admitted to being a bit overtaken in the first few rounds by the fact he was fighting his idol for the world title. After those first few rounds he really came into the fight - naturally powerful puncher.

Benn states in his autobiography that the Wharton fight was his 'toughest' fight. By that he didnt mean Wharton was the best he fought, but that the fight was physically the most difficult, aparently even more so than the Mclellan!

joes been fighting bums for years and is continuing the thrend after the lacy fight. beating lacy isn't a big achievement. imagine roy vs lacy at 168? hopkins?

fist wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:Don't forget Benn also beat DeWitt and Barklay.

And Wharton also. Note, it was Wharton's first title fight, when he was at his prime. Wharton felt that was his best chance in that he was at his best, but admitted to being a bit overtaken in the first few rounds by the fact he was fighting his idol for the world title. After those first few rounds he really came into the fight - naturally powerful puncher.

Benn states in his autobiography that the Wharton fight was his 'toughest' fight. By that he didnt mean Wharton was the best he fought, but that the fight was physically the most difficult, aparently even more so than the Mclellan!

Yes, I've always thought that was a case of "what could have been".... Wharton did seem to freeze, when he woke up the fight was generally even - but he lost the first 4 or so rounds by just doing nothing.

It was similar to Francis vs Williams 1.

"A little too carefully" is putting it very nicely.
P

He's clearly got the best resume of ANY active Supermiddle now, and for the last few years also.

A fight with Tarver next year looks promising.