BoxRec

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qc5ElebuV0E


IMO, Marvin's the best MW ever. Hagler was such a consumate pro when it came to training & preparing for fights. He didn't cut corners.

It takes an awful lot to become champion, even more-so when you suffer defeats before becoming champ as Marvin did. Hagler was very vesatile as a fighter i.e. was able to box orthodox or southpaw. Niot many fighters can switch stances & still have great success.

Was Hagler more effective as a southpaw or orthodox?

Nice footage of the Marvelous one!

Was Hagler more effective as a southpaw or orthodox?

Nice footage of the Marvelous one!

You bet it is nice footage.....what it shows is just how one dimensional Hagler was. Of course many, including SRL already knew that!!

ringsider wrote:You bet it is nice footage.....what it shows is just how one dimensional Hagler was. Of course many, including SRL already knew that!!

True to form ringlicker. I bet the first thing you do when you visit this forum is put Hagler's name in the search engine so you can peddle your "plodding" thesis again . . . and again. . . and again. . . . .

The problem with your one-dimensional thesis is that you're blind to the innumerable subtleties of the Marvellous one.

The problem with your one-dimensional thesis is that you're blind to the innumerable subtleties of the Marvellous one.

And what are those? Please do tell......

I always get flamed for saying the same thing! Hagler was great, and as good a defensive fighter coming forwards as I've seen, and powerful and merciless, but.... he wasn't the most adaptable was he?

Hagler could box, or he could slug it out toe to toe. He could fight both orthodox as well as southpaw. He could fight at close quarters as well as at a distance. He had good hand speed, good power and a phenomenal chin. He did have a few subpar perfromances that should be held against him. However, they were few in a long career. He was beyond reasonable doubt one of the very best middleweights of all time.

I am a huge Marvin Hagler fan and believe that he is the equel to any Middleweight in history, but no fighter is unbeatable and on a given night any great fighter can be beaten by a fellow great.

From the modern Middleweights I have seen in action I would not be too shocked, if that on a given night Dick Tiger, Carlos Monzon and Emille Griffith sneaks a win over The Marvelous One. I would also not be too shocked if Hagler sneaked a win off them in a rematch either.

You Hagler fans are so blind......more so than any other fighter's fans. He wasn't that good.

I'm not a Hagler fan, and I'm not blind. I also know that Hagler wasn't just good, he was an all-time great.

ringsider wrote:You Hagler fans are so blind......more so than any other fighter's fans.

Don’t you know any Klitschko fans?

I remember reading an article about Hagler in the 80's. Robbie Sims his half brother, said as kids that Marvin as the oldest boy used to help his mother keep the other kids in line. They shared a room and Marvin would tell Robbie to keep his half of the bedroom clean. Somehow I couldn't see Robbie telling him "f*ck off"

Ambling Alp wrote:I'm not a Hagler fan, and I'm not blind. I also know that Hagler wasn't just good, he was an all-time great.

Good call, I am a Hagler fan and fully agree. Hagler was at least a top 3 middleweight of all time, id put him at number 1.

...... Hagler was at least a top 3 middleweight of all time, id put him at number 1.........

Phhhhtttttttt......

>>>I am a huge Marvin Hagler fan and believe that he is the equel to any Middleweight in history, but no fighter is unbeatable and on a given night any great fighter can be beaten by a fellow great.<<<

That's as accurate as it gets!!!! On any given night any great fighter could beat the next. On any given night Ketchel could KO Hagler, on any given night Hagler could KO Ketchel...on any given night Hagler could beat Monzon, or vice versa, on any given night Roy Jones could KO Hagler and vice versa...and the comparisions can go on and on...no one is completely unbeatable...though some are better skilled than others, but anyone can get caught by a KO shot!

barry wrote:>>>I am a huge Marvin Hagler fan and believe that he is the equel to any Middleweight in history, but no fighter is unbeatable and on a given night any great fighter can be beaten by a fellow great.<<<

That's as accurate as it gets!!!! On any given night any great fighter could beat the next. On any given night Ketchel could KO Hagler, on any given night Hagler could KO Ketchel...on any given night Hagler could beat Monzon, or vice versa, on any given night Roy Jones could KO Hagler and vice versa...and the comparisions can go on and on...no one is completely unbeatable...though some are better skilled than others, but anyone can get caught by a KO shot!

Hagler was hit by many a KO shot and went nowhere

>>>Hagler was hit by many a KO shot and went nowhere<<<

No one is KO proof!!! The hardest hitter Hagler fought was Mugabi, or maybe Hart, or maybe Briscoe, who were all bona-fide KO artists, but anyone can be KO'd if hit just right...Hagler was just never hit just right. No doubt he had a great chin, but he was not indesructible.

ringsider wrote:

...... Hagler was at least a top 3 middleweight of all time, id put him at number 1.........

Phhhhtttttttt......

Ok Ringy, I'm aware that your posts on here are designed to wind up Hagler fans, but just out of interest, which middleweights do you put above the Marvelous One?

barry wrote:>>>Hagler was hit by many a KO shot and went nowhere<<<

No one is KO proof!!! The hardest hitter Hagler fought was Mugabi, or maybe Hart, or maybe Briscoe, who were all bona-fide KO artists, but anyone can be KO'd if hit just right...Hagler was just never hit just right. No doubt he had a great chin, but he was not indesructible.

I understand what you're saying. But that's an impressive list of hitters you've mentioned. Add Hearns to the list too. Even Marv was impressed with his power. After their fight he said "he can hit a bit" (coming from Hagler that means Hearns had major power )

Hagler's chin was beyond question. He was never even knocked down in 60 odd fights - the count he took in the Roldan fight followed a slip. He fought major league punchers such as Hart, Briscoe, Hearns and Mugabi. Marvin's chin was made out of titanium, and is rated as A+++.
Can anyone think of any other top level fighters who never even got knocked down in their career?

>>>I understand what you're saying. But that's an impressive list of hitters you've mentioned. Add Hearns to the list too.<<<

You can also add Fully Obelmejias, Juan Roldan, Marcos Geraldo, Tony Sibson and Wilford Sypion to the KO artist list...even fighters like Ray Seales, Johnny Baldwin, Bobby Watts, Willie Monroe, Vito Antuefermo, Alan Minter, Mustafa Hamsho and Caveman Lee hit hard, but if a fighter is hit just right he can be KO'd...it has been demonstarted time and again by fighters with chins just as good as Hagler. Hagler had one of the top chins in history, but he was not invincible to a knockout if he had been hit just right.

There was no better example that I can think of than Harry Greb. Greb was stopped early in his career, but around 1923, 24, or 25 Greb was knocked down and nearly out by one Soldier Buck...a good enough fighter with a solid punch, but it was not his power, but the spot and way that he hit Greb which put Greb down and nearly out. In fact, Greb purposely thumbed Buck, which very possibly saved Greb from being stopped. Greb had just as good a chin as Hagler and had close to 250 more fights, but like Hagler, Greb knew how to fight...knew how to roll with the punches and knew how to slightly adjust his stance to take all the steam out of a punch, but eventually a fighter wil get caught with the exact kind of punch that I am speaking of and then if the fighter is not KO'd clean, then it is on for that fighter to survive the round. No fighter is immune to being knocked out. But there are many, many, many other examples like the one with Greb and Solider Buck. Ray Robinson-Artie Levine for example.

Hagler was good, but anything Leonard could sneak out the back with, Monzon could just take through the front window.

barry wrote:
Greb had just as good a chin as Hagler

One of the funniest sentences I've ever read.

Greb beat Gene Tunney and Tommy Gibbons.

Greb fought heavyweights including Dempsey title fight opponents Bill Brennan and Billy Miske.

Greb fought Tunney 5 times, even when Tunney had grown unto a full heavyweight.

Hagler never fought a fighter over 160 pounds.

Hagler struggled for 15 rounds with fat, old, overweight lightweight Roberto Duran.

>>>One of the funniest sentences I've ever read.<<<

So what was funny about it...eh?

Are you under the disillusioned presumption that Greb had a chin so made of granite that Hagler's would crumble at the mention of it? That's just ignorant...nothing funny about it...idiocy! You mention all the people that Greb fought, which we already knew who he has fought to begin with, but it does not make up for Greb being knocked silly by a lowly middleweight journeyman named Soldier Buck...so what's your remedy to that...that the Buck knockdown and near KO of Greb doesn't count...LOL!!!! Now that's the funniest thing that I have ever imagined!!!

Besides...your post makes no sense whatsoever...the comment wasn't about who they fought...it was about chins...LOL...try to keep up if you can!!!

And for the record...the most that Tunney ever weighed for a bout with Greb was 181...do you consider 181 to be a full-fledged heavyweight...because I don't...200+ pounds is a full-fledged heavyweight. Perhaps next time you might want to buy, or get a clue before making any silly, idiotic comments!!! Tunney...a full-fledged heavyweight when he fought Greb...now that is the funniest sentence that I have ever read...and that is saying a hell fo a lot with some of the doozys that are stated on forums!!!

Tunney's weight in his bouts versus Greb:

Bout one: Tunney 174 1/2
Bout Two: Tunney 175, or less since it was for the American Light Heavyweight title.
Bout Three: Tunney 175
Bout Four: Tunney 175
Bout Five: Tunney 181

Full-fledged heavyweight my ass!!!!!

Also for the record...as was stated...Hagler was never dropped...Greb touched down on more than one occasion...not exactly sure how many, but it was more than Hagler ever went down!!!! In the future, please try to refrain from making comments on topics that you so clearly demonstrated knowing nothing about!

Anyone who thinks Hagler is an ATG or anything more than a guy who made a career out of fighting blown up LWs,WWs, and LMWs......is the one who dosen't understand or get it. Never will either. :( :(

Oh my God...from one ridiculous statment to another!!!!

Fully Obelmejias, Juan Roldan, Marcos Geraldo, Tony Sibson, Wilford Sypion, Ray Seales, Johnny Baldwin, Bobby Watts, Willie Monroe, Vito Antuefermo, Alan Minter, Mustafa Hamsho and Caveman Lee...they were all full middleweight...as was Hart, Mugabi, and Hearns. Leonard was mainly a welterweight, but he was a special welterweight...like Ray Robinson. Hell...Jr. Middleweight should never have been a division, but if you like all the bogus ABC groups and the 17 weight classes then I suspect that Jr. Middleweight is right up your alley, but sorry...six pounds difference makes little difference!!!

If you don't think that Hagler is an all-time great then you have a hell of a lot of studying to do...many years, because you clearly don't know shit! Which that is pretty obvious with comments like Tunney was a fully grown heavyweight and comments like Hagler made a career of fighting LW, WW and Jr. Middleweights. Learn the sport and then try to comment!!!