BoxRec

How would you order these fighters?

Pinklon Thomas
Trevor Berbick
Tim Witherspoon
Gerrie Coetzee
Mike Weaver
Renaldo Snipes
James Smith
Michael Dokes
Gerry Cooney
Carl Williams
Greg Page
Tony Tubbs

Spoon 498.05
Tubbs 495.63
Thomas 461.10
Dokes 458.57
Page 458.05
Weaver 455.10
Smith 433.94
Berbick 428
Coetzee 406.47
Williams N/A
Cooney N/A
Snipes N/A

The Great John L wrote:Page
Spoon
Tubbs
Thomas
Dokes
Weaver
Smith
Berbick
Coetzee
Williams
Cooney
Snipes

Page first????

dempseyfire wrote:Page first????

Yes, that was a little careless. I've updated the post and sorted them properly.

The Great John L wrote: Spoon 498.05
Tubbs 495.63
Thomas 461.10
Dokes 458.57
Page 458.05
Weaver 455.10
Smith 433.94
Berbick 428
Coetzee 406.47
Williams N/A
Cooney N/A
Snipes N/A

I think what Pundit meant was a ranking by ability, not by weight.

wouter wrote:

The Great John L wrote: Spoon 498.05
Tubbs 495.63
Thomas 461.10
Dokes 458.57
Page 458.05
Weaver 455.10
Smith 433.94
Berbick 428
Coetzee 406.47
Williams N/A
Cooney N/A
Snipes N/A

I think what Pundit meant was a ranking by ability, not by weight.

They weren't all chubby...

At their best, Tubbs beats them all.

Then Greg Page.

The Witherspoon.

Rest are also rans.

big frank in there too cum on

the eighties was a pretty por ere of HW'S IMO. only holmes and later Tyson stand out.

Personally, I would go with Witherspoon as the top, but Page beats them all in best vs best confrontation.

At his very best, Michael Dokes beats all of them. But I got to go with Tim Witherspoon.

1. Witherspoon
2. Coetzee
3. Dokes
4. Weaver
5. Thomas
6. Berbick
7. Page
8. Cooney
9. Tubbs
10. Smith
11. Williams
12. Snipes

[quote="RazorKO"]1. Witherspoon
2. Coetzee
3. Dokes
4. Weaver
5. Thomas
6. Berbick
7. Page
8. Cooney
9. Tubbs
10. Smith
11. Williams
12. Snipes[/quote]


How about George Foreman? - he was 18 - 0 in the 1980s and knocked out the number 8 on this list in 2 rounds on Jan. 15, 1990

1. Michael 'Dynamite' Dokes/ "Terrible" Tim Witherspoon (tie)

Randall Tex Cobb once said Dokes had the fastest hands in the business, and that's coming from a man who was beaten so one-sidedly by Larry Holmes that Howard Cosell retired from announcing. Dokes at his best could have beaten any of the 1980's contenders/pretenders. His own worst enemy, with his last great battle against Evander Holyfield who had just moved up from Cruiserweight.

2x HW champion Tim Witherspoon was the WBA and IBF champion, being in a class with Ali, Patterson, Holyfield, Lewis, Ruiz (ick!) and Wladimir Klitschko (does the WBO belt count?) as the only men to regain the title. Longetivity, solid mad skills, gave Holmes hell when he only had 15 bouts. Unfortunately never got to have mega fights with the divisions very best (Tyson, Holyfield as example).


2. 'Giant' Gerry Cooney

Before Mike Tyson came around Gerry Cooney was the hardest hitting HW of the early 1980's. Had he taken a few more tune ups, or just avoided Larry Holmes altogether and faced WBA champion gerrie Coetzee instead, history would be alot different, with Cooney in the books as one of the champions of the world. While this is all guess work, and while its true Cooney fought a bunch of over the hill ex ex legends to his title shot, none came bigger and harder hitting than 'Gentleman' Gerry.

3. Tony "TNT" Tubbs

Looking at his overall career, Tubbs might have been a let down in the 1980's, but his longetivity (still going strong at 49) beating guys like Brian Minto and losing only to top guys (generally) makes him one of the top men of the 1980's. Very good boxer, quite fast for a heftier man, lacked power though as his kayo percentage is low.

4. Gerry "The Bionic Hand" Coetzee

1st in line for the WBA title after Ali regained it from Spinks, he was denied his fantasy fight of fighting with "The Greatest", losing eventually to "Big" John Tate, only to beat Michael Dokes. Very good boxer with good power, Coetzee was also in line at getting a shot at Larry Holmes, but politics (Holmes asking for too much money) prevented the fight. Coetzee made a comeback in the 1990's only to lose to Iran "The Blade" Barkley.

5. Greg Page- Longetivity made for a solid comeback in the late 80's and 90's, only to tragically end up a cripple at the hands of Dale Crowe. Solid boxer, solid skills, good power. Almost had a super fight with Holmes, but again like the Coetzee situation, money held the fight back.

6. Mike Weaver

7. Pinklon Thomas- so much talent, but like Dokes was his own enemy and never fulfilled his full potential. Gave Tyson some trouble.

8. Trevor Berbick- Got the shot at Holmes, gave him hell, also beat up a Parkinson riddled Muhammad Ali who was butchered by Holmes the year before, wins the WBC belt only to lose it by kayo in 2 rounds to Mike Tyson who at the time never fought that great of opponents (let's be honest, James "Not So Quick" Tillis was the best of the bunch). Faded into boxing oblivion.

9. Bonecrusher Smith- Only college graduate to become a HW champion of any kind. Lost 12 round decision to Tyson. Big and could hit hard, had a late start in the sport.

10. Renaldo Snipes- What's to remember?

1. Tim Witherspoon
2. Trevor Berbick
3. Tony Tubbs
4. Greg Page
5. Pinklon Thomas
6. James Smith
7. Michael Dokes
8. Gerrie Coetzee
9. Mike Weaver
10. Gerry Cooney

HomicideHenry wrote:1. Michael 'Dynamite' Dokes/ "Terrible" Tim Witherspoon (tie)

Randall Tex Cobb once said Dokes had the fastest hands in the business, and that's coming from a man who was beaten so one-sidedly by Larry Holmes that Howard Cosell retired from announcing. Dokes at his best could have beaten any of the 1980's contenders/pretenders. His own worst enemy, with his last great battle against Evander Holyfield who had just moved up from Cruiserweight.

2x HW champion Tim Witherspoon was the WBA and IBF champion, being in a class with Ali, Patterson, Holyfield, Lewis, Ruiz (ick!) and Wladimir Klitschko (does the WBO belt count?) as the only men to regain the title. Longetivity, solid mad skills, gave Holmes hell when he only had 15 bouts. Unfortunately never got to have mega fights with the divisions very best (Tyson, Holyfield as example).


2. 'Giant' Gerry Cooney

Before Mike Tyson came around Gerry Cooney was the hardest hitting HW of the early 1980's. Had he taken a few more tune ups, or just avoided Larry Holmes altogether and faced WBA champion gerrie Coetzee instead, history would be alot different, with Cooney in the books as one of the champions of the world. While this is all guess work, and while its true Cooney fought a bunch of over the hill ex ex legends to his title shot, none came bigger and harder hitting than 'Gentleman' Gerry.

3. Tony "TNT" Tubbs

Looking at his overall career, Tubbs might have been a let down in the 1980's, but his longetivity (still going strong at 49) beating guys like Brian Minto and losing only to top guys (generally) makes him one of the top men of the 1980's. Very good boxer, quite fast for a heftier man, lacked power though as his kayo percentage is low.

4. Gerry "The Bionic Hand" Coetzee

1st in line for the WBA title after Ali regained it from Spinks, he was denied his fantasy fight of fighting with "The Greatest", losing eventually to "Big" John Tate, only to beat Michael Dokes. Very good boxer with good power, Coetzee was also in line at getting a shot at Larry Holmes, but politics (Holmes asking for too much money) prevented the fight. Coetzee made a comeback in the 1990's only to lose to Iran "The Blade" Barkley.

5. Greg Page- Longetivity made for a solid comeback in the late 80's and 90's, only to tragically end up a cripple at the hands of Dale Crowe. Solid boxer, solid skills, good power. Almost had a super fight with Holmes, but again like the Coetzee situation, money held the fight back.

6. Mike Weaver

7. Pinklon Thomas- so much talent, but like Dokes was his own enemy and never fulfilled his full potential. Gave Tyson some trouble.

8. Trevor Berbick- Got the shot at Holmes, gave him hell, also beat up a Parkinson riddled Muhammad Ali who was butchered by Holmes the year before, wins the WBC belt only to lose it by kayo in 2 rounds to Mike Tyson who at the time never fought that great of opponents (let's be honest, James "Not So Quick" Tillis was the best of the bunch). Faded into boxing oblivion.

9. Bonecrusher Smith- Only college graduate to become a HW champion of any kind. Lost 12 round decision to Tyson. Big and could hit hard, had a late start in the sport.

10. Renaldo Snipes- What's to remember?

Actually, Snipes was pretty decent. He is most remembered for decking Larry Holmes and having him in major trouble.
He also lost a close decision to Witherspoon that could have gone his way. On the hand he was lucky to get a decision over Coetzee in a fight in which he was decked a couple of times and almost got knocked out.
Snipes did also beat Berbick.

You do make some good observations but do have to disagree with Cooney.
Cooney doesn't deserve to be #2. Really #3 since you have Witherspoon and Dokes tied for #1) He has no significant wins in his career. He did give Holmes a decent fight but so did other guys that are ranked lower and actually had some decent wins. Cooney is more of a case of "what could have been" than what he actually did.

Ambling Alp wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:1. Michael 'Dynamite' Dokes/ "Terrible" Tim Witherspoon (tie)

Randall Tex Cobb once said Dokes had the fastest hands in the business, and that's coming from a man who was beaten so one-sidedly by Larry Holmes that Howard Cosell retired from announcing. Dokes at his best could have beaten any of the 1980's contenders/pretenders. His own worst enemy, with his last great battle against Evander Holyfield who had just moved up from Cruiserweight.

2x HW champion Tim Witherspoon was the WBA and IBF champion, being in a class with Ali, Patterson, Holyfield, Lewis, Ruiz (ick!) and Wladimir Klitschko (does the WBO belt count?) as the only men to regain the title. Longetivity, solid mad skills, gave Holmes hell when he only had 15 bouts. Unfortunately never got to have mega fights with the divisions very best (Tyson, Holyfield as example).


2. 'Giant' Gerry Cooney

Before Mike Tyson came around Gerry Cooney was the hardest hitting HW of the early 1980's. Had he taken a few more tune ups, or just avoided Larry Holmes altogether and faced WBA champion gerrie Coetzee instead, history would be alot different, with Cooney in the books as one of the champions of the world. While this is all guess work, and while its true Cooney fought a bunch of over the hill ex ex legends to his title shot, none came bigger and harder hitting than 'Gentleman' Gerry.

3. Tony "TNT" Tubbs

Looking at his overall career, Tubbs might have been a let down in the 1980's, but his longetivity (still going strong at 49) beating guys like Brian Minto and losing only to top guys (generally) makes him one of the top men of the 1980's. Very good boxer, quite fast for a heftier man, lacked power though as his kayo percentage is low.

4. Gerry "The Bionic Hand" Coetzee

1st in line for the WBA title after Ali regained it from Spinks, he was denied his fantasy fight of fighting with "The Greatest", losing eventually to "Big" John Tate, only to beat Michael Dokes. Very good boxer with good power, Coetzee was also in line at getting a shot at Larry Holmes, but politics (Holmes asking for too much money) prevented the fight. Coetzee made a comeback in the 1990's only to lose to Iran "The Blade" Barkley.

5. Greg Page- Longetivity made for a solid comeback in the late 80's and 90's, only to tragically end up a cripple at the hands of Dale Crowe. Solid boxer, solid skills, good power. Almost had a super fight with Holmes, but again like the Coetzee situation, money held the fight back.

6. Mike Weaver

7. Pinklon Thomas- so much talent, but like Dokes was his own enemy and never fulfilled his full potential. Gave Tyson some trouble.

8. Trevor Berbick- Got the shot at Holmes, gave him hell, also beat up a Parkinson riddled Muhammad Ali who was butchered by Holmes the year before, wins the WBC belt only to lose it by kayo in 2 rounds to Mike Tyson who at the time never fought that great of opponents (let's be honest, James "Not So Quick" Tillis was the best of the bunch). Faded into boxing oblivion.

9. Bonecrusher Smith- Only college graduate to become a HW champion of any kind. Lost 12 round decision to Tyson. Big and could hit hard, had a late start in the sport.

10. Renaldo Snipes- What's to remember?

Actually, Snipes was pretty decent. He is most remembered for decking Larry Holmes and having him in major trouble.
He also lost a close decision to Witherspoon that could have gone his way. On the hand he was lucky to get a decision over Coetzee in a fight in which he was decked a couple of times and almost got knocked out.
Snipes did also beat Berbick.

You do make some good observations but do have to disagree with Cooney.
Cooney doesn't deserve to be #2. Really #3 since you have Witherspoon and Dokes tied for #1) He has no significant wins in his career. He did give Holmes a decent fight but so did other guys that are ranked lower and actually had some decent wins. Cooney is more of a case of "what could have been" than what he actually did.

I think you're really over-rating Dokes and under-rating Weaver.

Here is my attempt. It's not easy.

1. Tim Witherspoon
2. Pinklon Thomas
3. Mike Weaver
4. Michael Dokes
5. Trevor Berbick
6. Gerry Cooney
7. Tony Tubbs
8. Gerrie Coetzee
9. Greg Page
10. James Smith
11. Renaldo Snipes
12. Carl Williams

Just out of curiosity, does anyone think that if Spoon was active and in his prime now, he would be able to unify the 4 main HW titles? Of course, that’s assuming that he actually trained for the four fights.

The Great John L wrote:Just out of curiosity, does anyone think that if Spoon was active and in his prime now, he would be able to unify the 4 main HW titles? Of course, that’s assuming that he actually trained for the four fights.

I think he could. If he'd have been in the right mindset he could have done it back then.

I can't really rank these guys with any conviction. They were all psychologically frail and too inconsistent.

Witherspoon, Thomas, Page and Dokes were the most technically gifted.

Cooney, Coetzee, Smith and Weaver had the big punch.

In each case they all seemed to be their own worst enemies.

I liked Witherspoon and like almost everyone else I guess I rank Spoon #1. However, I don't say that with a lot of conviction. These guys are very close.

Look at how Witherspoon did against the others:
Stopped Bruno in a tough fight
Split fights with Bonecrusher
Lost a close decision to Thomas

Won close decisions against Tubbs,Snipes,Page and Carl Williams.
Witherspoon is the consensus #1 and struggled with all 7 of the top guys that he fought.

You really could pull most the names of the guys out of a hat that are mentioned on this thread and rank them. They are that close.

Ambling Alp wrote:I liked Witherspoon and like almost everyone else I guess I rank Spoon #1. However, I don't say that with a lot of conviction. These guys are very close.

Look at how Witherspoon did against the others:
Stopped Bruno in a tough fight
Split fights with Bonecrusher
Lost a close decision to Thomas

Won close decisions against Tubbs,Snipes,Page and Carl Williams.
Witherspoon is the consensus #1 and struggled with all 7 of the top guys that he fought.

You really could pull most the names of the guys out of a hat that are mentioned on this thread and rank them. They are that close.

Thanks for sparing us the trip to the boxrec listings.

I remember most of these fights pretty well, as well as many of the other fights between the guys mentioned. Most of these guys really looked good at times, and at other times not so good at all. Sometimes in the same fight. all of these guys had their ups and downs. There is certainly a lot of parity here.

John Tate is another guy who was a factor for a while. He beat Coetzee. He had Weaver beat easily until he got clocked in the last round. He didn't rebound well after that loss. The Berbick fight was pretty funny when he tried to run away. After that for some reason he never fought anyone good again.

With a little bit of luck, Carl Williams and Renaldo Snipes would be as remembered as well as the "alph champs".

Ambling Alp wrote:I remember most of these fights pretty well, as well as many of the other fights between the guys mentioned. Most of these guys really looked good at times, and at other times not so good at all. Sometimes in the same fight. all of these guys had their ups and downs. There is certainly a lot of parity here.

John Tate is another guy who was a factor for a while. He beat Coetzee. He had Weaver beat easily until he got clocked in the last round. He didn't rebound well after that loss. The Berbick fight was pretty funny when he tried to run away. After that for some reason he never fought anyone good again.

With a little bit of luck, Carl Williams and Renaldo Snipes would be as remembered as well as the "alph champs".

You also remeber Tate at the 1976 Olympics?

I don't remember him fighting in the Olympics. I do remember the Spinks brothers, Howard Davis and Leonard.