BoxRec

While I think Teddy007 (on the PAvlik - Lockett) thread is being overly harsh I'm not sure about the "fair play to Lockett, he have it his best show and had a go" brigade either.

For me Lockett realised pretty early that he had no business being there and got out as early and as safely as he could without actually lying down. Sensible? Yes but not really what you come to expect of a fighter getting the biggest chance of his life after telling us that until now he had never got the oppurtunities he deserved.

People gave Duddy some stick when he was mentioned as an oppnoet for Pavlik, would he last any longer? Probably not, in fact he might get KO'd quicker but you get the impression that Duddy would at least lay it all on the line and go out like a kamikaze pilot as opposed to the anti climactic note Lockett went out on.

So you might ask would I rather Lockett got knocked cold rather than taking a knee and thinking "sod this, I can always to back to Cardiff and defend my WBU world title. At least Mrs. Jones next door think's I'm a real world champ."

Well to be truthful, yes I would have liked to see him go out on his shield. It may not sound very PC but isn't that why people stayed up until the small hours, to see one of our own give it a real go at one of the worlds best. People still talk about the "get in there Frank" moments of TYson - Bruno 1. I think it's highly doubtful that too many wil remember Lockett's challenge in the decades to come.

If that was his best shot then that's a travesty. I mean he went down with basically the first half-flush shot and then quit - he would've carried on but you could see he wanted to quit like Cintron vs. Margarito first time around.

I think Duddy would have got seriously brualised. He probably would have stood up to the shots longer than Lockett, and taken way more damaged. Duddy shouldn't be let anywhere near Pavlik. This fight won't ever happen.

Autobarn wrote:I think Duddy would have got seriously brualised. He probably would have stood up to the shots longer than Lockett, and taken way more damaged. Duddy shouldn't be let anywhere near Pavlik. This fight won't ever happen.

I wasn't advoacting for the fight. I actually agree with you in that Duddy would have got brutalised but my point was that as least he would have "given it a go". For my money Lockett's attempt was a pretty half hearted one.

I actually believe a John Duddy fight might not be be a total mismatch. Duddy has a granite chin and although he wouldn't be able to take those big right hands all night long, I think it would take a few before he goes over. Plus Duddy is a wicked body puncher and Pavlik being 6ft 2in you would think Duddy would find some of that body to hit. Duddy also showed in his last fight he can box with his jab when the going gets tough. Let me make it clear in saying I don't think Duddy would beat Pavlik, but I believe he could make it interesting for five or six rounds before getting stopped.

If it is true about Lockett not being in love with boxing then no he didn't give it his all, because you can't possibly perform at a high level if you don't enjoy what you are doing.

If this is the general consensus I'm really disappointed.

Firstly, virtually everyone on here criticised Enzo Calzaghe when he didn't pull Gavin Ress out when he was getting battered against Kotelnik, now we complain when he does (Lockett didn't quit, the towel was thrown in).

Secondly, if I was getting hit in the head and felt like my balance had gone, I'd sure as shit stinks take a knee to prevent myself being knocked out so I still had some chance of landing a punch that might cause some damage.

Thirdly, if I have a family to provide for like Gary does I'm not gonna think "Ooh, the fans want to see me fcked up, so that's what I must do. I'll just stand here and let him keep winging on me and hope I don't end my career with this fight"

Had he not stated that he didn't like Boxing, ala Jermain Taylor, I bet people wouldn't be questioning his performance. I have a job (believe it or not, boxing is a job for these people as it's usually their main occupation) but I don't love it. Quite a lot of people don't. But I'm good at it and it keeps Spam on the table.

Rees wasn't hurt until about a minute and a half away from the end. And everytime Lockett got hit he went down - I think that proved that his heart wasn't in the fight when it should've been because he will never get a chance like that again. He knew before the fight he was going to get beat, no doubt, hence his mauling.

I think Lockett went in with the best intentions, and then the realisation of what he was up against hit home very quickly - He was heading for a KO, but was saved by the towell. As we have seen in the past it can be a fine line between a corner intervention and a brutal KO.

If we are being critical of performances then Woods the other week was a far worse showing than Lockett - The sensible amongst us knew Lockett was way out of his depth, it was only the Lockett fans making a noise about his chances. There is no reason why anyone should be complaining or suprised that Lockett capitulated/surrendered within 3 rounds.

It was a mismatch.

fatton wrote:

Autobarn wrote:I think Duddy would have got seriously brualised. He probably would have stood up to the shots longer than Lockett, and taken way more damaged. Duddy shouldn't be let anywhere near Pavlik. This fight won't ever happen.

I wasn't advoacting for the fight. I actually agree with you in that Duddy would have got brutalised but my point was that as least he would have "given it a go". For my money Lockett's attempt was a pretty half hearted one.

Lockett was just out of his depth. The best shots he threw were all blocked by Pavlik. Gary's face was getting absolutely hammered - his face will have looked terrible in the days after the fight. I wouldn't have liked to have seen that go on much longer. He was being stunned with every shot. Even when Gary tried to block shots, he still took the shots flush. Nothing had worked for him and it was best to get him out of there. He was surrounded by punches and it got to the point where he couldn't protect himself. He tried but nothing worked and Enzo Cal ended it, very wisely.

Dioufy wrote:Rees wasn't hurt until about a minute and a half away from the end. And everytime Lockett got hit he went down - I think that proved that his heart wasn't in the fight when it should've been because he will never get a chance like that again. He knew before the fight he was going to get beat, no doubt, hence his mauling.

I think at least half had Rees losing on here. Also I had him in trouble, as did the commentators I believe, from much, much earlier than round 12. Remember Bunce's rant about it.

I had Rees losing easily but it wasn't a "shut out" like Buncey had proclaimed. Kotelnik held a very high guard and only fought for 30 seconds in some rounds. And to be fair, when Rees walked onto that shot in the 12th, no one knew how bad he was hurt until he got up from his stumble and took a few more shots - I don't think Calzaghe should've got the towel in because we didn't even know he was hurt until near the very end, I believe Enzo had the same opinion.

Lockett was scared of Pavlik's power and he should've give him hell and threw punches galore instead of sitting back and waiting for Pavlik to catch him. Who knows, Pavlik could've walked onto a shot like Katsidis and Rees did. I believe Lockett could've done a lot more if he had more heart.

i think locket-duddy for the wbu title
locket would slice him with lanceing shots

The shots landing on Lockett looked especially painful to me. He did the right thing in getting out.

This isn't Rocky, it's a mans career and well being. Nothing Lockett could have thrown would have turned that fight around. Walter Estrada had far more left to test Mitchell with but I don't see the word bottle next to his name.

It is very easy to knock a fighter in these circumstances, particularly if you support them and may have bought a ticket to see them fight

but, if they know they are in over their head and are likley to take a battering for no reason, then I don't blame them, or their trainers if they pull out and I certainly don't blame them for taking the payday and giving it a go.

It is alright for warriors of the keyboard variety to squeal on about them being cowards but it is not them whose kids will be visiting them in hospital and no one will be feeling worse, physically or mentally about this than Gary who seems like a perfectly decent bloke

We have all accepted jobs that we were not sure we were up to in our time. Sometimes, you find you have no problems, other times you can wing it a bit and other times you get find out.

in a boxer's case, there is no where to hide and it is on show for everyone to see

The fight being for the undisputed title doesn't give a fighter like Lockett a greater chance of winning, and going out on his back would not enhance his reputation or marketability, nor would it represent a more impressive performance. As fans we did not need to see the total physical destruction of Lockett to know he was out of his depth.

The contest was as good as over by the second, Lockett had NO chance or turning it around. He was only in for more pain and suffering, but hey if that's what entertains you....

Lockett doesn't owe you jack shit, get over it.

Julius won some hearts by going out swinging versus Tyson.

That's not the way I remember it Dave. Plenty of ridicule after that one. Besides, Francis didn't even turn up in that good shape (by his standards), and went to the floor voluntarily every time.

Well we have different recollections then. I vividly remember him electing to swing, ponderously, with Tyson instead of employing the tactics he'd worked on - jab and hold. Overawed, unnerved whatever, he certainly dumped his tactics and swung some wide hooks.

Sure he was mocked, but he placed himself far more front and centre in the public consciousness - in part because Tyson was so well known I suppose - and to my mind secured a warm, rosy spot in my affections for his effort.

He was cruelly exposed, but he can say he swung for the fences. Perhap my memory is skewed. It wouldn't be the first time some romanticism had affect my version of events.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8AyF7UKWCE

Kilburn wrote:That's not the way I remember it Dave. Plenty of ridicule after that one. Besides, Francis didn't even turn up in that good shape (by his standards), and went to the floor voluntarily every time.

I was at the Tyson-Francis bout and although I never saw this myself some people have said Francis had adverts printed on the soles of his boots. Is it true?

Let's be fair.

Lockett came out for the 3rd round and tried his best to throw shots but Pavlik slipped them easily and soon started dishing it out again.
In that respect it was similar to Francis/Tyson.
Both were totally outclassed but both kept getting up.
Lockett did not quit.

banjo wrote:I was at the Tyson-Francis bout and although I never saw this myself some people have said Francis had adverts printed on the soles of his boots. Is it true?

Yes, it was a newspaper logo, The Sun I think.

Mirror.

All I know is it would be a poor call to highlight the Francis v Tyson fight as somehow the performance that Lockett should have produced. Julius went down what 5 times? But finished without a mark on him. He made damn sure he wasn't going to get hurt in there. Sure he might have thrown a few, but everytime Tyson landed anything half decent Julius was looking for the floor.

Lockett was facing someone in no particular rush, offering little target, but who just kept those horrible, hurtful long range bombs coming. Significant difference.

Point taken Kilburn, I wasn't trying to throw it forward as an aspirational bench-mark but I certainly felt, from memory, that Francis had afforded his chance more of a 'go' in the popular sense of the word.