BoxRec

Who in your view would have been the greatest boxer, pound per pound, of all-time if he had....

For example

The great Thomas Hearns would have been the greatest figther ever if he would have a chin and not lose to the greats Sugar Ray Leonard and Marvin Hagler.

Who you think would have been the best fighter ever in your lifetime or any time?

Ali if he had beaten Frazier the first time and retired after Foreman.

Lynch if he'd stayed off the booze.

Duran if he's stayed off the pies and retired 15 years earlier.

As much as I like Hearns I'm going to have to add that his loss to Hagler, couldn't just be attributed to his chin. If you go back and watch those vicious exchanges, you can clearly see that Hagler broke him down with plenty of bodyshots.

If boxing had been 12 rounds instead of 15 Hearns would have also benefited. Still would have lost to Hagler though.

If Chavez had been a bit more of a banger (could really punch anyway) I think he'd have been virtually unbeatable. He may well have been anyway in his prime.

Duran definitely needed to be kept away from the pies and booze.

Eubank if he had a higher punch output.

Emile Griffith needed just a little more tenacity.

Ezzard wrote:Eubank if he had a higher punch output.

Also, if he hadn't fought Watson the second time IMHO.

Give punching power to pretty much any top fighter with a low ko ratio and it would make him great. Imagine Ottke, Whitaker, or even Camacho with a punch like the Prince...

Ike Quartey would be the greatest boxer if he had to left arms... :P

The greatest boxer of all time should’ve been Hector Camacho if he only had a heart and power. He had all the tools of speed, defense, ring generalship and has never been KO despite fighting some of pretty powerful punchers. (Rosario, Mancini, Chavez, Trinidad, and DLH)

I am already expecting criticism but if zab judah had a brain or a chin he definitely could've been great.

He had all the tools needed just wasn't that bright.

Seamus wrote:As much as I like Hearns I'm going to have to add that his loss to Hagler, couldn't just be attributed to his chin. If you go back and watch those vicious exchanges, you can clearly see that Hagler broke him down with plenty of bodyshots.

Agreed. I think his biggest problem there was that he didn't bring his movement and fluidity up from the lower weights. He went from being a very quick and mobile boxer, to being a "either I take you out, or you take me out" kind of fighter. Hence his losses to Barkley as well.

And to answer the original question...

Perhaps Kid Gavilan, if he had a big punch (though I suppose that claim could be made about any of the lesser hitting greats).

Borinken25 wrote:The greatest boxer of all time should’ve been Hector Camacho if he only had a heart and power. He had all the tools of speed, defense, ring generalship and has never been KO despite fighting some of pretty powerful punchers. (Rosario, Mancini, Chavez, Trinidad, and DLH)

Camacho did not had a heart?...Are you kidding me?

Well this discussion hinges on "potential". Which many of us fall short of.

Greg Page comes to mind. Maybe Dokes as well. Two guys who perhaps had it in them but couldn't quite "mine the gold". I wonder if it was because it was in the wake of the "golden era" and neither could find the motivation to do their best?

It's a mystery.

Sweet Pea with more power.

Everyone loses at some point, I don't know that the loss to Frazier kills Ali's chances of being named the best of all time. He should have been more consistently in shape, he should have retired after the third Frazier fight; that might get him close. Or if there had been no layoff maybe he could have had the "dominance" that some claim that he didn't have; as if beating Jimmy Ellis in a non-title bout means less than beating Johnny Paycheck in a title bout.

Or, if you just want to make stuff up, give Ali more power; same as with some other fighters here who were great but didn't have serious punching power. And maybe give him better defensive skills in the 70s.

Sam Langford if he had Harry Wills' or Lennox Lewis' height .Game eff'n over for any heavyweight , anytime.

I Feel Fine wrote:Everyone loses at some point. . .

Marciano didn't.

How about Ezzard Charles if he could have gotten a shot at the Light Heavyweight title and had been a dominant champion at that weight class like Archie Moore ended up being after he eventually got his shot. Maybe he could have then moved up to Heavyweight and become two division champion.

Or how about Patterson if he had been able to have stayed at Light Heavyweight and had dominated that division. He was great at Heavyweight and usually only lost because he couldn't take a Heavyweight punch or was so much smaller than the opponent, that wouldn't be the case at 175.

raylawpc wrote:

I Feel Fine wrote:Everyone loses at some point. . .

Marciano didn't.

Not in boxing, but he did get on the wrong plane.

raylawpc wrote:

I Feel Fine wrote:Everyone loses at some point. . .

Marciano didn't.

Haha, cute.

That's because Rocky never had to come back from three year layoffs and didn't have Ali's desire to stay in the sport for as long as he did. And Ali of course knocked out men who could have slaughtered Rocky.

Again; accurrate statement, frivolous comparison.

I Feel Fine wrote:

raylawpc wrote:

I Feel Fine wrote:Everyone loses at some point. . .

Marciano didn't.

Haha, cute.

That's because Rocky never had to come back from three year layoffs and didn't have Ali's desire to stay in the sport for as long as he did. And Ali of course knocked out men who could have slaughtered Rocky.

Again; accurrate statement, frivolous comparison.

When did I compare him to Ali? You're the guy making the comparison. I stated a simple historical fact: The guy never lost a professional fight. No other heavyweight champion can say that.

No other Heavyweight champion needs to say that because its an overrated accomplishment.

And it is a comparison, because you are comparing him to other Heavyweight champions, or to other fighters who happened to have losses.

I Feel Fine wrote:No other Heavyweight champion needs to say that because its an overrated accomplishment.

And it is a comparison, because you are comparing him to other Heavyweight champions, or to other fighters who happened to have losses.

Look at what I wrote. Who did I compare him to? It is a historical FACT that Marciano is the only undefeated heavyweight champion in the history of boxing in the Queenberry era.

Now I will make a comparison - just to make you happy. What other heavyweight champion fought everybody the press and boxing public asked him to fight and retired undefeated?

It's an accurate statement but its significance is minimal. If I were to say "Ali beat Foreman" and someone were to interject and say "So did Shannon Briggs" it would be a correct statement, and still a frivolous and stupid one. Other Heavyweight champions may not have been undefeated, but that's because they weren't fighting dead men, old men or smaller men as their only prominent opponents. When Tyson knocks out Holmes and Spinks I don't find it particularly mind blowing either.

Ok I get the premise better now. My suggestions were not really for this catagory.

I can't add any new names to this list. It's always going to be one of the usual suspects with a slight enhancement. In other works the Robinson's, Ali's, Benny Leonard's, Armstrongs, Willie Peps' etc.

I Feel Fine wrote:It's an accurate statement but its significance is minimal. If I were to say "Ali beat Foreman" and someone were to interject and say "So did Shannon Briggs" it would be a correct statement, and still a frivolous and stupid one. Other Heavyweight champions may not have been undefeated, but that's because they weren't fighting dead men, old men or smaller men as their only prominent opponents. When Tyson knocks out Holmes and Spinks I don't find it particularly mind blowing either.

I repeat, "What other heavyweight champion fought everybody the press and boxing public asked him to fight and retired undefeated?" And how is it of "minimal significance" to accomplish that feat?