BoxRec

Who do you think was the greatest champion who never had an amateur back ground?

Jeffries

dempsey

although he wasn't a champion - he was along at the same time of the real sugar ray, who was annoyed at this guy - george sugar costner - the latter would have made it to the welter championship if he hadn't had to quit because of detached retinas.

he was the best of the welters when robinson retired.

Costner may have been just short of great, but he was close nd he never had an amateur fight.

Julian -Fillo- Echevarria -a Spanish featherweight- never fought amateur and never fought a prelim fight.

When he was a teen he was offered as a sacrifial lamb against a pro with eighteen fights. He won that fight by KO and went on to fight more than a hundred pro bouts beating Baby Arizmendi and Izzy Schwarts -both campions- and lost to Kid Chocolate and Freddie Miller on points and Lou Salica by KO.

Dwight Qawi and Joey Giardello were never amateurs.

Giardello fought amateur in the Army.

HomicideHenry wrote:Who do you think was the greatest champion who never had an amateur back ground?

- Most really really old timers had no ama background.

John L, Jeffries, Fitz, Jackson, Dempsey, Langford, JJohnson, Jeannette, Ketchel, Jimmy Barry, Dixon, Gans, McGovern, a who's who of boxing. After all, boxing was illegal generally.

Oddly enough Corbett has a quasi ama experience with numerous "sparring" sessions before he turns pro, surely boxing's first official gym rat.

BroughtonRulesRefuge wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:Who do you think was the greatest champion who never had an amateur back ground?

- Most really really old timers had no ama background.

John L, Jeffries, Fitz, Jackson, Dempsey, Langford, JJohnson, Jeannette, Ketchel, Jimmy Barry, Dixon, Gans, McGovern, a who's who of boxing. After all, boxing was illegal generally.

Oddly enough Corbett has a quasi ama experience with numerous "sparring" sessions before he turns pro, surely boxing's first official gym rat.

Actually, John L, Fitz, Corbett, and Langford all boxed as amateurs, albeit briefly. Prizefighting was illegal. Amateur boxing with gloves under the MQRs was never illegal.

raylawpc wrote:Actually, John L, Fitz, Corbett, and Langford all boxed as amateurs, albeit briefly. Prizefighting was illegal. Amateur boxing with gloves under the MQRs was never illegal.

- So was drinking in certain jurisdictions as well as gambling which never stopped it from occurring.

These weren't regulated ama programs set up for the development of boys. There was vice of every description going on including payments and/or cuts of winnings. Otherwise you're gonna have to convince me they all drank milk, didn't spit or curse, Kimbo Slice was a amateur and eagle scout and Billy Slick never had sex with that woman.

BroughtonRulesRefuge wrote:

raylawpc wrote:Actually, John L, Fitz, Corbett, and Langford all boxed as amateurs, albeit briefly. Prizefighting was illegal. Amateur boxing with gloves under the MQRs was never illegal.

- So was drinking in certain jurisdictions as well as gambling which never stopped it from occurring.

These weren't regulated ama programs set up for the development of boys. There was vice of every description going on including payments and/or cuts of winnings. Otherwise you're gonna have to convince me they all drank milk, didn't spit or curse, Kimbo Slice was a amateur and eagle scout and Billy Slick never had sex with that woman.

And Tricky Dick never engaged in a criminal conspiracy

..does anyone know if kid gavilan had any amateur fghts?

Some of Jack Dempsey's early bouts listed, were called amateur fights by Salt Lake Telegram.

jaclem2 wrote:..does anyone know if kid gavilan had any amateur fghts?

Yes, he had about 50 or 60 in Cuba. Was known as one of the country's best amateurs there.

2sense --thanks...

Billy Conn never fought am.
He said "if your gonna get punched in the head , ya might as well get paid for it".
After he fought Fritzie Zivic, he probably obtained all the fight knowledge he needed.

Senya13 wrote:Some of Jack Dempsey's early bouts listed, were called amateur fights by Salt Lake Telegram.

Do you have any specifics on which fights the Salt Lake Telegram were called as amateur fights?

I put a comment on Nov 2, 1914 fight that it was advertised as an amateur fight (Hardy Downing often put up cards where he had several pro fights preceded by several amateur bouts, sometimes wrestling matches as well). Nov. 30, 1914 fight while not called amateur explicitly, but the report ends with 'Manager Downing announced today that he would put on another "amateur night" next Monday.' So I suspect that bout might have been amateur as well.