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What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 19 Mar 2009, 18:53
by DG.
ENZO MACCARINELLI has insisted his boxing career is not over, despite a shock defeat to Ola Afolabi all but ending his world title dreams.

But, as a sensational blame game erupted during the postmortem of his devastating ninth-round stoppage, the former world champion’s future with Team Calzaghe looks far less certain.

Having initially hinted that he may be ready to quit boxing altogether after Saturday’s soul-destroying defeat, his second major loss in three fights, Maccarinelli last night confirmed he would fight on.

The 28-year-old accepted he faced an uncertain future, but claimed he wasn’t ready to hang up his gloves yet.

‘Big Macc’ did admit he was still struggling to come to terms with what happened in Manchester over the weekend.

But, while other people may now be writing him off, the Swansea fighter refuses to accept a place on boxing’s scrap heap.

“Initially I said I didn’t know if there was any way back for me,” he explained. “But I do want to continue as a boxer.

“I don’t know what the future holds for me and it’s going to be a long road back.

“But I will be back and I need to do a lot of thinking about where I go from here over the next few weeks.

“I am absolutely devastated, to be honest. It’s so tough to take as I know I can produce 100 times better than I did on Saturday.

“I have been training so hard, but I didn’t feel right. After three rounds I felt jaded and after six I had nothing left in the tank.

“I felt I could still win as I was controlling the fight. But it wasn’t to be – and it’s a tough one.

“I trained hard and was nice and fresh. But I think my lack of sparring told.”

Maccarinelli’s final comment has proved to be particularly contentious over the past 48 hours.

And, after his promoter allegedly publicly criticised an apparent lack of preparation due to the absence of sparring, his trainer Enzo Calzaghe quickly hit back and insisted he was not to take the blame for the defeat.

In Calzaghe’s mind a very different problem brought about his fighter’s downfall. The fact Maccarinelli had only fought once in the previous 12 months, against journeyman Mathew Ellis in December, was the decisive factor as far as he is concerned.

“Frank and Enzo have talked about his lack of sparring,” he said. “But no amount of sparring could ever compensate for being out of the ring for so long.

“It does not matter how good you are, you still get ring rust. And, since Enzo has only had one fight in a year, that was always going to be the case with him.

“He hadn’t had a proper fight for a year and that can’t be logical preparation for a world title shot.

“The emotions, anxiety and fear factor are entirely different when you step in the ring for real – it’s nothing like sparring or being on the pads.”

Warren was quick to respond to Calzaghe’s arguments. And, while voicing his sympathy for Maccarinelli, he didn’t pull any punches when reiterating his belief that poor preparation was the reason the world title dream all three of them share slipped away.

“Talking about the lack of fights is a pathetic excuse,” he retorted. “Enzo simply got beaten on the night by the better man.

“He didn’t spar properly and said he felt empty. That is where the problem was.

“But it is no good saying these things after the fight because beforehand I was told everyone was good. Excuses don’t do me any good after a fight.”

The disagreement is likely to put even more pressure on what is an extremely strained relationship between Warren and Calzaghe.

And, considering he signed a multi-fight contract with Warren in December, there was plenty of speculation over the weekend that it could ultimately force Maccarinelli to leave Calzaghe’s Newbridge gym.

Whether or not he is able to turn his back on the institution that made him so successful remains to be seen.

But it’s a question that, when asked, all three men were unable to give a definitive answer to.

“If I was Enzo Maccarinelli, I would take a long look in the mirror and make my decision,” was Warren’s response when asked if he wanted ‘Big Macc’ to leave the gym.

“I can’t make it for him and it has to be his call entirely.

“Whatever he decides, I will still make fights for him. I want to find a way forward for him.

“No-one is more disappointed with what happened than me. I will meet him next week and we’ll see where we go next.”

Calzaghe was equally unsure when responding to the speculation, adding: “I’m not confident he will stay with me at all. If he has to take a different path, then so be it.

“Boxers can make up their own minds and I respect their decisions.

“All I know is that I won’t accept fault from someone who is just looking for someone else to blame.”

And, as for Maccarinelli, the man who will ultimately have the final say, only time will tell whether he stays or goes.

“I have no idea what will happen,” he said. “But I love Enzo to bits and it would be a real wrench if I did leave his gym.”


:D


:D

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 19 Mar 2009, 19:14
by hitman_hatton1
what a mess. :roll:

least he ain't gonna retire by the looks of it.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 01:23
by coneye
The trainer should have an imput , and if Calagzie felt he wasnot up for the fight due to lack off fights he should off said so. A promoter is suppossed to ensure his fighter gets the fights that build him up for these titles , so Fwanky should off got him a fight or two prior to the big one .
A fighter knows his own body best so the fighter should off known his preperation was under done and told his promoter and trainer.

Basicly there all laying the blame on each other when the facts are . HE JUST AIN'T GOOD ENOUGH AT THE ELITE LEVEL

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 05:36
by dondada
A promoter commenting on training methods is rather like a football club chairman sounding off about a manager's team selection.

Know your limits.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 05:52
by DavidPayne
Ian,

I don't think that argument stands up. True Warren isn't a trainer, never has been and has never been trained but he's been around the fight game long enough to know if a fighter is in decent shape, and that isn't even his argument - he stated he was told Enzo was in good nick before and now wonders why all the excuses are coming out afterward. Its just a scapegoat thing.

And of course, as a writer about boxing who has never fought, taking your argument to the nth degree would be an uncomfortable position too. I think Warren is qualified enough to pass an opinion on a fighter's training and it have a degree of credibility.

Either Enzo wasn't good enough or he was ill-prepared. The two Enzo's can't have it both ways can they?

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 05:53
by Carbo
Sounds to me very much as if Maccarinelli is leaving Calzaghe's gym.

Enzo came back pretty hard there when he said “Boxers can make up their own minds and I respect their decisions.All I know is that I won’t accept fault from someone who is just looking for someone else to blame.”

Doesn't sound to me like he's happy with Maccarinelli at all.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 05:54
by DavidPayne
Nah. I think its FW he's not happy with. Of course, if the fight had gone on much longer Olafabi would never have fought again.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:00
by Adamj1987
big bac needs to leave team calzaghe while he has improved in some areas hes not maximising some featcures like his reach, apart from teh brathwaite fight he tends to volume punch which isnt good i think he would benefit from buddy mcgirt i think enzo is a prime candidate to improve under him and has teh rigth style

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:05
by DavidPayne
He needs harder sparring with hungry fkkers his own size and bigger.

I simply do not know why Macca tries to be a crouching banger or volume puncher.

His frame is suited to a more orthodox style, jab, jab, jab, jab, jab.

He isn't the murderous puncher he's been told he is. He doesn't cave in top line guys does he?

America could be good for him I suppose...but its a casual, lazy assumption.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:08
by dondada
DavidPayne wrote:Ian,

I don't think that argument stands up. True Warren isn't a trainer, never has been and has never been trained but he's been around the fight game long enough to know if a fighter is in decent shape, and that isn't even his argument - he stated he was told Enzo was in good nick before and now wonders why all the excuses are coming out afterward. Its just a scapegoat thing.

And of course, as a writer about boxing who has never fought, taking your argument to the nth degree would be an uncomfortable position too. I think Warren is qualified enough to pass an opinion on a fighter's training and it have a degree of credibility.

Either Enzo wasn't good enough or he was ill-prepared. The two Enzo's can't have it both ways can they?
I'd never dream of saying I know more about training than Enzo Calzaghe - which is what Warren appears to be doing in commenting on the sparring.

Maccarinelli himself rejected the lack of sparring argument yesterday saying that even if he'd had no sparring whatsoever ever he'd 'have a couple of rounds in him' yet he felt like he had nothing left after one round.

Now he feels it might be something medical and having blood tests done.

Joe Calzaghe was as fit as f*ck throughout his career...yet since the son left the promoter the father has forgotten how to make a man match fit? Garbage.

Do you think the promoter might have another agenda? :roll: Why did Nathan Cleverly leave the stable soon after Joe Calzaghe parted with Warren?

There was something up with Enzo (not necessarily being 'ill-prepared') and/or he isn't good enough at that level. True.

The only relevant criticism which could be levelled at the trainer, knowing Enzo C's methods, is that he'd OVERTRAINED. The bloke's a fecking mentalist when it comes to cardio work.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:17
by DavidPayne
Yeh sure the agenda is there, obviously. But this only one round lark is a new development, after the fight Enzo said he took the opponent lightly, didn't get a video until the day of the fight and didn't have Enzo around because he was in court. And with Cleverly departed and Calzaghe retired, who the fkk could Enzo have even moved around with?

Enzo C is paid to train a fighter and present him in shape. Either Enzo M was unprepared or he isn't good enough. Now a promoter isn't going to say he isn't good enough regardless of agenda and with a new contract signed. And we've seen before Enzo C refuses to even contemplate responsibility for a fighter's defeat.

Lest we forget Enzo was out-boxing Ola on the scorecards for more than half the fight. Was he really SPEJNT after one round?

Enzo strikes me as a earnest fella, likeable and genial and maybe's a big pawn in another battle, but ultimatley if he was fkked, someone needs to acknowledge responsibility or hope the blood test throws something up.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:30
by Twinkle Toes
I agree with Ian, it is Wárrens job to promote, not to finger point when it goes wrong - Anyone can do that.

Your own promoter should be keeping his gob shut, and working on where he is taking you next.

Anyway, time and time again Wárren has stated that trainers should stick to training and promoters stick to promoting - I don't know who manages Enzo, but last I read it was Wárren. Maybe he should have been looking after his fighter's interest a bit more too then. By making sure tapes and sparring was made available, and as his promoter by keeping him more active.

It's the usual double standards being applied.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:44
by DavidPayne
I have some sympathy with Warren on this to be honest, yes Macca hasn't been active but Warren had a fight set and it fell through and did Enzo C consider Braithwaite and Dominguez good prep for Haye in which Macca was also splattered?

Then it was someone else's fault too.

The better man would accept some responsibility for a poorly prepared fighter, no matter how subjective a measurement "prepared" is.

Ola Afolobi had two fights since November 2005 before Macca at fairly mediocre level, the last being August 2008, after which time Macca was also prepared to championship level for a cancelled Banks fight, - why could Ola take shots and keep going?

As Warren said. The better man won on the night.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:52
by rhino222
i will be very surprised if the blood test shows up anything, anaemia is the most likely thing if anything. Enzo was full of life till he got clocked in the 3rd, it was the punches he took that took the energy out of him not his bloody training, maccarinelli has always had questionable whiskers and once again he found himself doing the 'birdie dance' when he felt the leather.

i think ola is much better than he has been given credit for, these sparring partner types know all the tricks in the book with regards to saving energy, rolling with punches, absorbing impact, not wasting shots etc etc....

maccarinelli needs to learn from the way ola fought, macca thinks he can load up all the time and take anyone out, when that does not work there is no plan b, against haye maccarinelli fought the correct fight because if he clocked haye he could have won, ola was not distressed when he felt enzos power, that leaves maccarinelli very disheartened as people he hits are supposed to lie down.

you only need to look at the early career of maccarinelli to pick up hints, surely a world class puncher should KO the likes of tony booth and chris woollass easily, but no, booth and woollass took him the distance......why? ... because both new how to survive, but unfortunately both did not then posess the equalizer to capitalise on enzos weaknesses. ola however, did posess that equaliser.....(and i know they were only 4 rounders, but still, do you think david haye would let the likes of booth and woollass off the hook)

and to devastating effect !!!

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 06:59
by Old bones Ian
No sparring, its not ideal preperation.
It doesn't have to be heavy sparring, it just gets you fine tuned for a fight

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 07:05
by Autobarn
Continual soft fights, inactiivty, lack of sparring, all are factors.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 07:35
by BABY BLUE
Thats jsut typical warren to blame the trainer as always. if Enzo mac wants to continue boxing then i sugest that he goes to the wild card ans spend 6 weeks ther elike khan does with roach.
he will learn alot there also his defence will improve under roach.
i though Enzo mac was moving to UFC?

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 10:26
by Coco
Enzo Cal's camp def suffered because of his court commitments

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 13:21
by BABY BLUE
Coco wrote:Enzo Cal's camp def suffered because of his court commitments

yes it did .also he did not spend enough time with enzo mac in the gym with other commitments. thats what pissed warren off. with enzo macs loss.
i think the best thing for enzo mac to go is to lA spar in the wild card Gym with freddie roach. we would see a new improved enzo mac in the ring.he needs to ditch calzaghe though as a trainer.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 14:06
by Autobarn
if enzo macca has had limited comp in world title fights, if the sparring isn't great, it's no wonder that macca's well would run dry mentally, and physically, in a crisis. ola was going to be a tough fight, one of the better opponents.

of course there is the chin factor again. all of a sudden warren's welsh fighters are inactive (for whatever reason), and they're getting caught with their chins up (something common to enzo cal fighters) when faced with tough opponent (pryce-hall as well).

enzo has a world class left hook. he had good stamina. he was a welsh fighter at the right time. is it a great time to be a welsh fighter anymore? post Joe Calzaghe, post Warren-Calzaghe fallout? (if joe is going to promote, what is there to promote? might he need to come back as fighter in order to push his promoting?)

enzo was given the world title fights, he was moved up safely. the braithwaite win may have been a bit misleading, a "right time" fight to make him look excellent.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 14:23
by Coco
I def agree that Enzo Cal is excellent

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 20 Mar 2009, 15:04
by Carbo
I believe both Warren and Calzaghe deserve some criticism for MAccarinelli's defeat.

First, it was clear that Maccarinelli needed to adjust tactics. I'm not sure what advice Calzaghe was giving him between rounds, but it certainly wasn't getting through. What Maccarinelli was doing was ineffective and was about the only way he could have been beaten. Yet he continued doing it. He should have been told to take a step back, to take a breather and beat Afolabi to the jab, with the odd right cross over his low left hand.

Second, if indeed Calzaghe could not arrange sparring for Maccarinelli, then both fighter and trainer need to have a look at the way they organize camps, because to go into a world title fight with no sparring is unforgivable bush league stuff.

Finally, Warren deserves some criticism, too. Macarrinelli is trying to rebuild post-Haye. He needed a fight or two and more then 10 rounds of confidence building stuff, and then to be kept busy and kept winning against decent opposition. Instead, he's had about six rounds in two years. Not good enough for trying to rebuild a fighter, and a recepe for disaster.

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 21 Mar 2009, 16:41
by Rocky Balboa
Allegedly Warren & Enzo Calzaghe are not exactly mates right now & probably never will be, so it was only a matter of time before something like this developed!

However, if Maccarinelli had a lack of sparring then he should have voiced his disappointment before the fight. Doing it afterwards does not change a thing - he still lost!

I also think Enzo will exit the Newbridge gym. I mean, he has signed a new contract with Warren so its in black & white. I cannot see Warren & Enzo Calzaghe coming to an agreement anytime soon so Maccarinelli's hand will be forced to make the decision!

What price for Pryce to leave the Newbridge gym next? Not so long ago Enzo Calzaghe's stable of fighters were in the best positon they had ever been in. Quite a contrast now. What is happening?

Re: What is all this about? Enzo - Fwankster and Enzo!

Posted: 21 Mar 2009, 21:01
by fluxstuff
Enzo C has some responsibility because his approach with Enzo M, who lacks the chin of his son, is to walk on in mid range, throwing lots of punches. That's fine if you're fast and tough. Enzo's speed is middling at best. he's heavy handed and delivers his best punches at long range.

So why does Enzo C tell Enzo M to fight in close?

Secondly, that tactic would have NEVER worked with Haye. He was lacking speed compared to Haye's superior firepower. If he's fought disciplined, using the jab and letting Haye tire - he could have won. But he didn't, he has a weak chin and he lacked the speed or sense to take a knee when clocked.