How much has Eastman declined??

thepocketrocket · Post by **thepocketrocket** » 16 Dec 2007, 11:30

I was thinking post Duddy and ive come to the conclusion not that much....

John beat him with workrate and a good jab..there were times in the fight when Eastman did good work, that uppercut was lovely but there just wasnt enough work..

The general consensus is that Howard was on the slide and that Duddy, although proving himself to an extent is far from world class..

But if you look at it really, Howard has ALWAYS been quite slow and ALWAYS had a poor workrate...

IMO Duddy would beat Howard on any night of his career...

Cannibal · Post by **Cannibal** » 16 Dec 2007, 11:37

I had Eastman winning by 2 and reckon a prime Eastman would of destroyed Duddy.

It wasn't only the uppercut that was working to great success but he had that left, right combo working all night.

Eastman has declined but he is still enough of a threat to be a very good measuring stick for up and comers.

thepocketrocket · Post by **thepocketrocket** » 16 Dec 2007, 11:58

Cannibal wrote:I had Eastman winning by 2 and reckon a prime Eastman would of destroyed Duddy.

It wasn't only the uppercut that was working to great success but he had that left, right combo working all night.

Eastman has declined but he is still enough of a threat to be a very good measuring stick for up and comers.

Though im not wanting to discuss the scoring(most had Duddy winning, it is subjective however) im still struggling to find where Eastman has declined????

Great win for Duddy, hes no Andy Lee but deserves respect

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 16 Dec 2007, 12:00

I never saw what was so good about Eastman except for his power.

He's always been a plodder and always been slow.

thepocketrocket · Post by **thepocketrocket** » 16 Dec 2007, 12:02

Southpaw Stylist wrote:I never saw what was so good about Eastman except for his power.

He's always been a plodder and always been slow.

Thats my point, his quality of work can beat people and he punches very hard, but he could always be outslicked and he could always be outworked..

We saw the latter last week

REAL_DEAL · Post by **REAL_DEAL** » 16 Dec 2007, 16:41

Eastman never been the same since he got rid of his yellow beard, it was part of his character and must of came him special powers

:P

Twinkle Toes · Post by **Twinkle Toes** » 16 Dec 2007, 18:15

Lost 5 of his last 7 and age 37 - He's certainly on the decline :)

overhand_right · Post by **overhand_right** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:06

Sorry guys but in 2001 a world class champion like William Joppy had to work his arse off all night & climb off the floor to contain Howard Eastman- who was more intent of posturing & posing- and still only win an MD.

Remind me who beat Joppy in his day? Oh yeah- Felix Trinidad and Bernard Hopkins. That puts Eastman somewhere in the orbit of a very, very decent class.

At 37 he is very obviously not the same guy of 1998-2005 & dropping a decision to Duddy who was there all night proves that.

PocketRocket we all know you blindly love Irish fighters and your agenda here is very, very clear.

thepocketrocket · Post by **thepocketrocket** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:18

overhand_right wrote:Sorry guys but in 2001 a world class champion like William Joppy had to work his arse off all night & climb off the floor to contain Howard Eastman- who was more intent of posturing & posing- and still only win an MD.

Remind me who beat Joppy in his day? Oh yeah- Felix Trinidad and Bernard Hopkins. That puts Eastman somewhere in the orbit of a very, very decent class.

At 37 he is very obviously not the same guy of 1998-2005 & dropping a decision to Duddy who was there all night proves that.

PocketRocket we all know you blindly love Irish fighters and your agenda here is very, very clear.

Well I was never a big fan of Joppy, long running champ but never really beat anyone, he was good but not that good...

Plus when he fought Eastman he was coming off his destruction by CHEATO Trinidad and his illegal hand wraps, he was damaged goods, this was proven by not only his losses to Hopscotch and Taylor but also his uncompetetive performances..

Joppy pre Trinidad was not the same guy who fought Eastman....

Eastmans losses to Hopkins, AA and Miranda are understandable, they are all class and would probably beat Duddy at the moment, no worries there....

Then its Elcock and duddy, one slick, one with a high workrate...Once again I dont this Eastman has declined that much

Then its Elcock and Duddy,

Old bones Ian · Post by **Old bones Ian** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:22

They say the last thing a boxer losses is his punch, not in the case of Eastman, since 2003 he's only scored 1 KO, and that was in the 12th round against Richard Williams, more to do with Williams being knackered than a big punch.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:27

thepocketrocket wrote:
overhand_right wrote:Sorry guys but in 2001 a world class champion like William Joppy had to work his arse off all night & climb off the floor to contain Howard Eastman- who was more intent of posturing & posing- and still only win an MD.

Remind me who beat Joppy in his day? Oh yeah- Felix Trinidad and Bernard Hopkins. That puts Eastman somewhere in the orbit of a very, very decent class.

At 37 he is very obviously not the same guy of 1998-2005 & dropping a decision to Duddy who was there all night proves that.

PocketRocket we all know you blindly love Irish fighters and your agenda here is very, very clear.
Well I was never a big fan of Joppy, long running champ but never really beat anyone, he was good but not that good...

Plus when he fought Eastman he was coming off his destruction by CHEATO Trinidad and his illegal hand wraps, he was damaged goods, this was proven by not only his losses to Hopscotch and Taylor but also his uncompetetive performances..

Joppy pre Trinidad was not the same guy who fought Eastman....

Eastmans losses to Hopkins, AA and Miranda are understandable, they are all class and would probably beat Duddy at the moment, no worries there....

Then its Elcock and duddy, one slick, one with a high workrate...Once again I dont this Eastman has declined that much

Then its Elcock and Duddy,

If he hasnt declined why has he lost 5 of his last 7???.... you only need to watch some of his earlier fights to see the difference. Eastman has always had a relaxed style, people say he's 'lazy' but thats just his style, now he's got older he struggles to make the pace, the punches dont come out like they did a few years back and he's getting caught by shots he used to dodge. You only need to look at how Howard was in his corner between the rounds to see how knackered he was after a few rounds, but he stuck in there and still gave Duddy a hard fight, the Howard of some years back though would have thrown more and beaten Duddy. I was actually impressed with Duddys gameness and chin, he's better than when I saw him a while back, but to say that he would have beaten a young Eastman is off the mark imo...

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:30

Terry D wrote:Joppy was not world class. He stepped into it and got battered. If anything Eastman-Joppy exposed the limitations of both.

So Hamed was never world class either, then.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:37

I think people have a skewed view of what world class is or isn't.

For example, looking at the current Welterweight rankings on Boxrec, I see 7 or 8 fighters I would consider "World Class".

Looking at 168, I only see 4 of them.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:42

Funny you skipped over my other post just so you could plug: "Luckily this is the Brit forum so we think laterally"

Don't make me laugh too hard, it's still early.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:46

7 minutes between my two posts... 1.5 minutes between my 2nd post and yours... It took you over a minute and a half to type that response? You Brits think slowwwwwly, too.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 17 Dec 2007, 07:51

It depends what you class as 'world class' ....Joppy was certainly world class imo, but not elite world class. Eastman was simply overcondfident in their fight and gave away the last round (and the fight) fooling around. At his best though Eastman was head and shoulders above the rest of the Euro and domestic middles for a good few years, and that Eastman would have beaten Elcock, Duddy and possibly Abrahams I think....

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 17 Dec 2007, 08:01

Now now, season of good will and all that boys!... shake hands and come out fighting!.... I'm fair but I'm firm!... no naughties with the ed!!...

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 17 Dec 2007, 08:03

Silkov's firm, Terry's fast and hard...

This thread's quickly turning into a porno.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 17 Dec 2007, 08:06

Hey, atleast I'm flaccid. 8)

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 17 Dec 2007, 09:00

I'm going to have to take a point off for that one!.... 8)

Arbachakov · Post by **Arbachakov** » 17 Dec 2007, 13:19

Eastman only really dominated at Euro level because the division was a wasteland.

he's the worst British middleweight that fought for a world title i've ever seen by a long way.

overhand_right · Post by **overhand_right** » 17 Dec 2007, 14:34

Eh? How???

Many people round here knock Eastmans dedication/work rate, not many dispute his talent.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 17 Dec 2007, 15:12

Arbachakov wrote:Eastman only really dominated at Euro level because the division was a wasteland.

he's the worst British middleweight that fought for a world title i've ever seen by a long way.

I disagree totally, Eastman gave Hopkins a decent fight, hardly the form of a bum, he was a good fighter who just fell short at world title level, hardly a disgrace imo. Eastman would have given Benn, Eubank, Sibbo and Kaylor all tough fights imo.... I'd pick him to beat Sibbo and Kaylor in fact....

Arbachakov · Post by **Arbachakov** » 17 Dec 2007, 15:26

Sibbo was better than him in almost every respect(and i'm not a sibbo fan), he had for more offense, workrate and speed than Howard.

Eastman is painfully slow and has pretty bad balance and limited skills.Even Kaylor was better and much quicker and tidier offensively.

I'd also strongly disagree he gave Hopkins a decent fight.He fought in slow motion and did nothing of note, falling off-balance everytime Hopkins moved off to the side after punching.It was a terrible fight.

All that said i have always liked Howard, despite not thinking much of his talent as a world class fighter.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 17 Dec 2007, 15:38

Arbachakov wrote:Sibbo was better than him in almost every respect(and i'm not a sibbo fan), he had for more offense, workrate and speed than Howard.

Eastman is painfully slow and has pretty bad balance and limited skills.Even Kaylor was better and much quicker and tidier offensively.

I'd also strongly disagree he gave Hopkins a decent fight.He fought in slow motion and did nothing of note, falling off-balance everytime Hopkins moved off to the side after punching.It was a terrible fight.

All that said i have always liked Howard, despite not thinking much of his talent as a world class fighter.

Youre seriously underrating Howard, this thing about his lack of speed etc is a myth, ok he's slowed down now and could be lazy in fights but a few years ago his jab was like a lance and he's always been an awkward guy to fight. Sibbo was one of my favourites but he always had trouble with awkward long armed boxers and he would come straight at Howard, I can see Howards counter punching being too much for him....
A guy doesnt go the distance with the likes of Joppy, Hopkins and Abraham without having decent talent....