tegenm wrote:Tiny Herman (or Tiny Jim Herman) out of Astoria should also be mentioned. He was probably top 15 or top 20 at his peak during the mid-1920s. Victor McLaglen also started out in Vancouver.
Herman had success in the first few years of his career but took a nose dive in the latter half.
Unless McLaglen fought under another didn't appear to have many fights (10-6) especially for those times. Wild Bill Boyd boxed sucessfully but only for 4 years and in 1941 was beat up twice in 20 days and wisely ended his career.
granberry wrote:I seem to remeber the NW produced a number of top light heavyweights.
Anybody care to name some?
Here is a list of guys who were rated in the top 10 at some point in their careers in no particular order:
Frank Farmer
Leo Lomski
Fred Lenhart
Wesley (KO) Ketchell
Young Firpo
Tiger Jack Fox
Joe Kahut
Harry (Kid) Matthews
Eddie Cotton
Kirk Barrow
Larry Buck
Andy Kendall
Roger Rouse
Light Heavyweight is the Northwest's premier class for producing top fighters. In Spokane and Portland, the division was most responsible for the success of boxing in those regions prior to 1950.
granberry wrote:I seem to remeber the NW produced a number of top light heavyweights.
Anybody care to name some?
Here is a list of guys who were rated in the top 10 at some point in their careers in no particular order:
Frank Farmer
Leo Lomski
Fred Lenhart
Wesley (KO) Ketchell
Young Firpo
Tiger Jack Fox
Joe Kahut
Harry (Kid) Matthews
Eddie Cotton
Kirk Barrow
Larry Buck
Andy Kendall
Roger Rouse
Light Heavyweight is the Northwest's premier class for producing top fighters. In Spokane and Portland, the division was most responsible for the success of boxing in those regions prior to 1950.
A number also fought heavyweight (Matthews, Lomski, Lenhart, Farmer) as was the case in those days but they certainly had their greatest days as LHW.
Eddie Cotton held a version of the title for a while in the 60's
Leo Lomski knocked Tommy Loughran down twice in the first round of a title fight, quite a feat.
But Loughran came back to win the decision and keep his title.
Tiger Jack Fox was stabbed shortly before a title fight with Melio Bettina. His stab wound started bleeding during the fight and it was stopped.
Fox was a great puncher. Tiger Jack Fox KNOCKED OUT Jersey Joe Walcott in 8 rounds in 1937. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He also stopped double champion Lou Brouillard.
He also beat Walcott a second time by decision.
Harry (Kid) Matthews was good. But he ran into two left hooks from Marciano.
Eddie Cotton beat the hell out of Jose Torres for 15 rounds and was robbed in one of the worst decisions in the history of boxing,
Cotton broke Torres in half with body shots, even though Torres was supposed to be the body puncher.
Cotton gave Torres an ass-whipping--and they gave Torres the decision.
Andy Kendall was a strong guy who lost to Bob Foster.
Roger Rouse lost twice to Bob Foster and once to Dick Tiger (which surprised me. I expected Rouse to beat Tiger).
Bob Foster said Rouse hit him the hardest he was ever hit.
how would you rate them tegenm, or anyone else for that matter...I don't them apart from a few , Mathews, Lenhart, Young Firpo,
Tiger Jack Fox, Cotten, Rouse and Kahut.
I rate Lomski, Matthews, Fox, and Cotton in the top four.
As far as an order, I might favor Lomski as the best, because I regard his era in the Light Heavyweight division to have been very good. His prime though was relatively short compared to the other fighters though because of a bad right hand (his power hand) and too many tough fights against top fighters back east, and even in the Northwest.
Young Firpo is kind of a wildcard. At his peak in 1934 beating Fox and drawing with John Henry Lewis would indicate that he could have potentially gotten to the top, or right on the cusp of it; had he not been hindered by injuries and inactivity. One reason though I don't have him in that top group though is he lost four out of four to Lenhart, who may have presented a style problem for him (southpaw, boxing out of a crouch). He also got kayoed by Lomski, and barely beat him in the second fight when Lomski was past his prime.
1. Boone Kirkman
2. Pat McMurtry
3. Joe Hipp
4. Thad Spencer
5. Kenny Keene
6. Harry "Kid" Matthews
7. Pete Rademacher
8. Gordie Racette
9. Ibar Arrington
10. George Logan
11. Pat Duncan
12. Terry Hinke
13. Joe Kahut
The book is out on currently active Chauncey Welliver. Acting as his own manager he doesn't appear to want to test himself and fight the best as the others on the list did. He will be appraised in the future.
I hope to one day have my name in with these guys. It's not that I don't want to fight anybody around, just that the heavyweight division is dead!
actjac wrote:
I hope to one day have my name in with these guys. It's not that I don't want to fight anybody around, just that the heavyweight division is dead!
Chauncy....start campaining for a fight with some of the "old lions". Evander Holyfield, Oliver McCall etc. and start moving into the limelight.
actjac wrote:
I hope to one day have my name in with these guys. It's not that I don't want to fight anybody around, just that the heavyweight division is dead!
Chauncy....start campaining for a fight with some of the "old lions". Evander Holyfield, Oliver McCall etc. and start moving into the limelight.
Working on a Ray Mercer fight now. If not him, some sort of step up will be coming.
Also got a Cliff Couser fight coming up! Not a huge step up, but a decent opponent all the same.
Shawn Hawk might have to be added to this list soon enough. He is listed out of Idaho having fought the majority of his fights in the state. Though he apparently is a small heavyweight he is 16-0 and only 23 years old.
I used to spar with a Navy amateur heavyweight by the name of Gary Young in San Diego. He was from the Northwest(Oregon). He was very high on Boone Kirkman. They were friends. He was disappointed when Boone didn't show much against Foreman.
dagosd2000 wrote:I used to spar with a Navy amateur heavyweight by the name of Gary Young in San Diego. He was from the Northwest(Oregon). He was very high on Boone Kirkman. They were friends. He was disappointed when Boone didn't show much against Foreman.
Notice how Foreman uses the two handed push (as he also did against Joe Frazier)
actjac wrote:Rankings of all-time NW heavyweights ....adding Amos Lincoln
1. Boone Kirkman
2. Pat McMurtry
3. Joe Hipp
4. Thad Spencer
5. Kenny Keene
6. Harry "Kid" Matthews
7. Pete Rademacher
8. Amos "Big Train" Lincoln
9. Gordie Racette
10. Ibar Arrington
11. George Logan
12. Pat Duncan
13. Terry Hinke
14. Joe Kahut
Consideration can be given to Frank Van Hee as well as Leo Lomski who fought the last five years of his career as a HW.
The book is out on currently active Chauncey Welliver. Acting as his own manager he doesn't appear to want to test himself and fight the best as the others on the list did. He will be appraised in the future.
Also noted is Young Dempsey who was managed by George Chemeres. He retired with a 16-1 record but never beat an opponent with a winning record.
I'd probably rank Spencer over Kirkman and definetely over Hipp.
actjac wrote:Rankings of all-time NW heavyweights ....adding Amos Lincoln
1. Boone Kirkman
2. Pat McMurtry
3. Joe Hipp
4. Thad Spencer
5. Kenny Keene
6. Harry "Kid" Matthews
7. Pete Rademacher
8. Amos "Big Train" Lincoln
9. Gordie Racette
10. Ibar Arrington
11. George Logan
12. Pat Duncan
13. Terry Hinke
14. Joe Kahut
Consideration can be given to Frank Van Hee as well as Leo Lomski who fought the last five years of his career as a HW.
The book is out on currently active Chauncey Welliver. Acting as his own manager he doesn't appear to want to test himself and fight the best as the others on the list did. He will be appraised in the future.
Also noted is Young Dempsey who was managed by George Chemeres. He retired with a 16-1 record but never beat an opponent with a winning record.
I'd probably rank Spencer over Kirkman and definetely over Hipp.
Shouldn't Matthews be higher?
Matthews was really a middleweight and a light heavy at best. I would not rank Spencer any higher. Hipp held a North American title and fought well in an attempt for a world heavyweight championship.
granberry wrote:Tiger Jack Fox was stabbed shortly before a title fight with Melio Bettina. His stab wound started bleeding during the fight and it was stopped.
Fox was a great puncher. Tiger Jack Fox KNOCKED OUT Jersey Joe Walcott in 8 rounds in 1937. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Glad to see this thread up and running again, very informative.
I know it doesn't mean a huge amount in the long run but, like with Harold Johnson, I've always though Tiger Jack Fox had one of the most impressive physiques of fighter.
granberry wrote:Tiger Jack Fox was stabbed shortly before a title fight with Melio Bettina. His stab wound started bleeding during the fight and it was stopped.
Fox was a great puncher. Tiger Jack Fox KNOCKED OUT Jersey Joe Walcott in 8 rounds in 1937. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Glad to see this thread up and running again, very informative.
I know it doesn't mean a huge amount in the long run but, like with Harold Johnson, I've always though Tiger Jack Fox had one of the most impressive physiques of fighter.
The amazing thing about Fox, is that he was not well known even in his prime for training hard, and conditioning was always a weakness for him. But as someone who exercises regularly, you realize that some people have better genes than you when it comes to looking cut.
Absolutely, I know guys how seem to get bigger from tying their shoe laces, and then other guys who I know are absolute training animals and just basically looked lean but not particularly cut.
