Anyone out there seen the scorecards for Ottke v Reid yet

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 11 Jan 2004, 21:29

I've tried those sites Bennie suggested with no joy, wondered if anyone out there could enlighten me?

kevo · Post by **kevo** » 12 Jan 2004, 10:15

OTTKE/REID

Guilio Mancini / Levi Martinez / Franz Marti
italy / Mexico / Switxerland

1 9-10 / 9-10 / 10-9
2 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9
3 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9
4 9-10 / 10-9 / 9-10
5 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9
6 10-10* / 9-10* / 10-9*
7 9-10 / 9-10 / 9-10
8 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9
9 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9
10 10-9 / 9-10 / 9-10
11 9-10 / 10-9 / 10-9
12 10-10 / 9-10 / 9-10

116-113 / 115-112 / 116-111

* Reid docked a point for err.... being nasty and hitting Ottke in th face
Just in case you were wondering, I have got a lot of time on my hands. :)

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:03

Good info, Kevo.

REAL_DEAL · Post by **REAL_DEAL** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:04

james the fight is on euro on thursday

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:10

Kev, where did you get to see those cards, It's important that I know, because it does confirm Jess Harding's assertion that Reid was down going into the 6th round, Christ on two cards Ottke has been given 3 of the first four rounds!

kevo · Post by **kevo** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:13

It was in the Christmas issue of Boxing news ( Dec 19/26)

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:17

Kevo wrote:It was in the Christmas issue of Boxing news ( Dec 19/26)

At the end of the day, Boxing News is still number one. allegedly ought to be ashamed of himself ridiculing an institution that supported him intently when he first appeared on the licenced scene in 1980.
How they soon forget.

kevo · Post by **kevo** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:22

Has anyone read this weeks? They printed that letter in full, then give thier responses, and ripped Warren to pieces. Even Jack Trickett sticks his oar in on the Harrison-Brodie argument. Good on 'em I say!

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:25

Ah right, I missed the Christmas issue, I can't find anywhere round here which stocks it. Thank god you told, I'd have looked a right nobend.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 12 Jan 2004, 11:35

Claude Abrams and Boxing News have always been fair to Sports Network in the past. This has blown up over an alleged personal issue between allegedly and Boxing News contributor Gavin Evans, and Boxing News has been dragged into the equation needlessly as a result. That's wrong.
Gavin Evans wrote a biography on Naz a few years ago, which Frank threatened to sue over (but didn't). Because Evans then wrote a piece on Joe Calzaghe in Boxing News recently, which Warren also took exception to, he's decided to drag Boxing News into this personal issue. Or certainly it looks that way.

Loynesy · Post by **Loynesy** » 12 Jan 2004, 12:18

Bennie - I was under the impression that Frank doesn't particularly care for Claude on a personal level: can't really imagine Claude sharing a fine wine and cigar with Mr W.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 12 Jan 2004, 12:26

Loynesy wrote:Bennie - I was under the impression that Frank doesn't particularly care for Claude on a personal level: can't really imagine Claude sharing a fine wine and cigar with Mr W.

I believe they always got on okay. The mangled letter to Boxing News came as a surprise to me. I've never picked up on anything anti-Warren in Boxing News. But when Boxing News backed Warren in the 80's (as a competitor to the Cartel, who had the game sewn up at that time), the anti-Duff reports were obvious.

Bard of Boxrec · Post by **Bard of Boxrec** » 12 Jan 2004, 12:51

they all gave Reid the 7th.

Bogus. WHY THE 7TH? Reid did not clearly win this one at all, did he? I seem to remember ottke winning the 6th through 9th as the rounds he won most clearly (although he won none clearly) so

WHY HAVE THE JUDGES ALL GIVEN REID THE 7TH?

totally made up. Also, Reid was only one point, two points and 4 points (!!!!) down on the three cards after the 6th round, he wasn't 3 rounds down on any.

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 12 Jan 2004, 14:00

I agree Riddick, it was a similar story in the Beyer-Lucas fight when Beyer failed to throw a meaningful shot in the first four rounds yet took three of them on the judges cards. The seventh round scoring wreaks of a fix, it's like some of them don't even bother watching the fight but simply know the outcome and know what there will score will be before the fight happens. Then they tot there scores into the relevant boxes and add them up to a tight looking decision 115-113, 116-112 and maybe a 114-114 for good measure. Either way Ottke/ Beyer always get the decisions, they make them tight to avoid kicking up too much of a stink.

I was watching Mario Veit-Jose Maria Guerrero the other day and Guerrero led Veit a dance for the first 5 rounds arguably 6. Then he tired and Veit took control and won the last 3 maybe 4, the scorecards had it to Veit by ridiculous scores like 9-1, 8-2 twice on rounds, in lesser fights they can get away with this level of corruption but in the big bouts they need to make the decision tighter to cause less fuss. Look at Kai Kurzawa-Lolenga Mock, all three German judges gave Kurzawa one of the most scandalous decisions ever and kept his unbeaten streak going. Mock is a journeyman who has not got the clout to cause a big stink but it was a totally corrupt score, it cannot continue or Boxing will only go backwards.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 12 Jan 2004, 14:16

1 9-10 / 9-10 / 10-9
2 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9
3 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9
4 9-10 / 10-9 / 9-10
5 10-9 / 10-9 / 10-9

Work it out

1st card, 3 rounds to Ottke, 2 to Reid, Reid 1 down
2nd Card, 4 rounds to Ottke 1 to Reid, Reid down 3
3rd Card, 4 round to Ottke, 1 to Reid, Reid down 3....

and yes, the scores are totally fictitious, because the rounds Reid is given, are either the closest ones, or the ones he didn't win. It is obvious the whole thing was prearranged, they decided.

1 Don't let Reid make contact with Ottke too often in case he knocks him out, if he looks like doing a job on him, make sure you warn him plenty, so he can be DQ'd at a moments notice.

2 Give Ottke the majority of the early rounds on 2 cards, and then Ottke will come on stronger in the 2nd half of the bout when Reid is too scared to really go for it, in case he gets DQ'd.

3 Make sure that the fight is scored close so it doesn't reek of a bad decision too much, give him some of the later rounds whatever happens to make it close.

A blatant fix.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 12 Jan 2004, 16:51

i had reid winning by 3 points

ottke had a terrible start and although he did better in the 2nd half i still felt reid won a few of those :)

the moustached fool in the middle was hopeless and the judging was terrible

it wasn't so much ottke got it, it was the margins i mean 3 points twice and 1 judge had it 5 pts :x it was a nip and tuck affair that was quite close, reid deserves a rematch but i have a feeling the IBF will fob him off with an elimination match that he probably won't win :(