Claude Abrams...

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 23 Jan 2004, 12:49

Some of you may have wondered, as I did, why Claude Abrams never returned to the Beeb after recovering from his torn achilles heel. I thought he worked well with Bunce as the straight man, and had more insights to offer than Richie Woodhall.
Well, the answer is, there is no answer. The Beeb just replaced Claude with Woodhall, and have never contacted Abrams again. It's not because they don't think Claude is any good. It's because they just don't care.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 23 Jan 2004, 12:54

The thing is the beeb go for style over content, people like Bunce, Woodhall, Glenn McCrory fit the perceived profile of what boxing people are like.

Claude is a bit too erudite and articulate for the muppets at the Beeb to appreciate, they'd rather have Duke McKenzie whining like a dentist's drill and getting everyone's name wrong.

knockout artist · Post by **knockout artist** » 23 Jan 2004, 13:18

jamesmcdonnell wrote:The thing is the beeb go for style over content, people like Bunce, Woodhall, Glenn McCrory fit the perceived profile of what boxing people are like.

Claude is a bit too erudite and articulate for the muppets at the Beeb to appreciate, they'd rather have Duke McKenzie whining like a dentist's drill and getting everyone's name wrong.

Leave Duke alone, he's sound.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 23 Jan 2004, 13:21

jamesmcdonnell wrote:The thing is the beeb go for style over content, people like Bunce, Woodhall, Glenn McCrory fit the perceived profile of what boxing people are like.

Claude is a bit too erudite and articulate for the muppets at the Beeb to appreciate, they'd rather have Duke McKenzie whining like a dentist's drill and getting everyone's name wrong.

Good one McDonnell!

bigfatjourneyman · Post by **bigfatjourneyman** » 23 Jan 2004, 13:49

Did Claude actually tell you this first hand Bennie? It just seems you are Mr anti BBC on this site. If you have any questions instead of making wild assumptions why dont you e-mail the editor of the programmes and actually get a balanced view?

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 23 Jan 2004, 14:19

bigfatjourneyman wrote:Did Claude actually tell you this first hand Bennie? It just seems you are Mr anti BBC on this site. If you have any questions instead of making wild assumptions why dont you e-mail the editor of the programmes and actually get a balanced view?

Claude told me so himself.
And I am anti-BBC boxing because they are naff.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 23 Jan 2004, 15:41

Come on Bennie I think you are being a bit harsh on the beeb... after all theyve shown some pretty good fights since theyve got involved again and they seem to have shaken ole fw

:x

up a bit... so perhaps the commentary is a bit jittery at times

and Bunce is ....well Bunce, but all in all its better than just relying on SKY :x and ole fw so I think they deserve a bit of encouragement... especially as they keep showing Gatti's fights... to be honest if they carry on showing the sort of fights that they have up till now, then I don't care if they get whispering Ted Lowe to commentate on them!. Actually thats not a bad idea really!.....

8)

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 23 Jan 2004, 15:52

My anti-BBC stance, I can assure you, is not borne out of any personal vendetta, or any political stance, but out of sheer frustration that their coverage could be so much better if they did just TWO things: 1) put the fights on earlier (obviously not the ones shown on Grandstand), and 2) replace Jim Neilly permanently with John Rawling (they're halfway there already).
That's all.
Okay, I have a go at their website, but that doesn't really bother me. Sticking boxing on past midnight bothers me, and having to put up with Jim Neilly's past tense commentary bothers me. My attitude is, if something is wrong, complain! We English tend to put up with it.

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 23 Jan 2004, 16:07

I personally think that the BBC's heart is in the right place and they have got it right on occasions especially with there foreign fights, i mean Barrera-Pacquiao, Jones Jnr-Woods, Jones Jnr-Tarver, Klitschko-Johnson, Toney-Jirov etc all for free aint bad. Plus then there's plenty of domestic and European matchups including Walker-Karmazin, Hide fights, Audley's fights, Woods-Johnson etc so i suppose compared to American coverage where you have to pay to watch the analysers talk let alone the fights, we get it pretty good over here. As much as i malign the BBC i get the feeling they could turn around and say "Well f**k you all then" and take Boxing off schedule and then we are left with even less.

The main problem i have is that they use an inept team right through from commentator to analysers to presenters and with a little more knowledge mixed in with some more professionalism and the Beeb could be much better off. I think what we should be thinking here is "Don't cut off your nose to spite your face" and keep our Beeb criticism underground

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 23 Jan 2004, 16:41

You seem to forget that the BBC received a fortune in license fees each year, so the fights aren't quite free, mind you a man sight cheaper than sky.

bigfatjourneyman · Post by **bigfatjourneyman** » 23 Jan 2004, 17:13

Can anybody seriously tell me they are disappointed when John Rawling commentates, Mike Costello reports and Bunce and Woodhall summarise.
Surely you don't get such a good all round team than that.

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 23 Jan 2004, 17:14

Yes you are right of course James but i suppose adding Sky's dedication to Boxing then we do have a decent coverage over here. I mean De La Hoya fights cost anything up to $50 over in yankee land so i hear, think how much HBO would have been charging for the Don King bill we got on SKY for no extra charge.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 23 Jan 2004, 17:19

bigfatjourneyman wrote:Can anybody seriously tell me they are disappointed when John Rawling commentates, Mike Costello reports and Bunce and Woodhall summarise.
Surely you don't get such a good all round team than that.

No complaints from me. Now, if only the Beeb would stick to that team.

Lorn · Post by **Lorn** » 23 Jan 2004, 19:32

As a boxing fan who does not have sky I appreciate the Beeb offerings, I miss Claude but Richie knows his stuff too..

And please leave Buncey alone, I think hes a babe !!!

Lorn

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 23 Jan 2004, 19:36

Lorn wrote:As a boxing fan who does not have sky I appreciate the Beeb offerings, I miss Claude but Richie knows his stuff too..

And please leave Buncey alone, I think hes a babe !!!

Lorn

I wouldn't argue with you, Lorn.

Lorn · Post by **Lorn** » 23 Jan 2004, 19:40

Good, so thats that one settled then init !!!!

Lorn x

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 23 Jan 2004, 19:47

My point is that I have had years of frustration while the beeb did not show any boxing at all. Now with fighters like Mayaorga, Barrera, Manny, Toney, Gatti etc all being aired I have been pinching myself incase I ve died and gone to heaven!. While I definately miss Harry Carpenter I think the bbcs understanding of boxing is sound in the way that they have selected fights both here and abroad, certainly their have been far more turkeys shown on SKy in the last year than on the Beeb. So basically I think we as the boxing fans should support the BBCs boxing coverage rather than pandy willynilly to the allegedly cohorts who are only too happy to discredit the BBCs coverage for obvious reasons and who would like nothing better than the BBC to get discouraged and to pull out of the boxing scene again. Frank Warrens strangle hold on boxing in Britain is very unhealthy and lately he has shown what a meglomaniac he has become by launching a scathing personal attack on Claude Abrams.... the man can stand no opposition to his views or ideas and seems to think that it is his god given right to control British boxing... hence the BBCs greatest gift to us!.... being a royal pain in ole franks backside!..

.. that by itself is worth staying up past midnight for methinks!

8)

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 24 Jan 2004, 11:49

yeah i wondered why there was no claude on the beebs coverage, i just thought maybe claude had decided to not do it anymore to avoid any calls of bias, which have still been thrown his way from warren.

they miss claude i think he tells it like it is and really knows his stuff and often puts things into perspective.

Matchfixer · Post by **Matchfixer** » 24 Jan 2004, 12:27

Yes,

I wondered where Claude had gone too. I would have thought he could stand on one leg and present anyway (as painful as a torn achilles is).
It is not as though the camera would zoom in on his feet.

That said, I like Richie Woodhall too.

Out of interest, what is Mr Bunce's history? He looks like a typical English heavyweight bruiser type but I found no record of him being a boxer.

Can anyone tell me more?

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 24 Jan 2004, 13:12

i'm not sure about former heavyweight maybe former pie eating champ

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 24 Jan 2004, 13:14

Matchfixer wrote:Yes,

I wondered where Claude had gone too. I would have thought he could stand on one leg and present anyway (as painful as a torn achilles is).
It is not as though the camera would zoom in on his feet.

That said, I like Richie Woodhall too.

Out of interest, what is Mr Bunce's history? He looks like a typical English heavyweight bruiser type but I found no record of him being a boxer.

Can anyone tell me more?

He started out in the mid-80's, working as a freelance amateur boxing reporter for Boxing News. The legendary Brian Pigden covered the senior side of the game (Bunce couldn't wipe Pigden's arse), and Bunce was game enough to cover the schoolboy and junior side (and you have to be game to do that). Bunce was there when Naz was winning his schoolboy and junior titles.
Anyway, as Brian's personal life deteriorated, so Buncey moved on to the senior side for Boxing News (still freelance) and gradually got to cover the ABA championships for some of the nationals - mainly because the established hacks were retiring and the new boys struggled even to know anything about the pro scene.
Inevitably, he was soon covering the pro scene for them as well, and got a job as a staffer with one of the nationals (I don't know which one it is).
And that's about it. He started at the bottom reporting an aspect of the game where there was an opening, put himself about thereafter, and got there on sheer hard work as opposed to writing ability (he always looks knackered, don't he).
Fair play.

Matchfixer · Post by **Matchfixer** » 25 Jan 2004, 08:18

Thanks for the information.

catweazle · Post by **catweazle** » 25 Jan 2004, 21:22

He writes for The Independent.I wish he would stick to writing too,fat tart.
At least Woodall and Duke have boxed,even if they do just repeat the same things over and over and agree with each other.Bunce loves the sound of his own voice- who just heard him after the Gatti-Branco fight ? What was that nonsense about crack cocaine ! Im gonna talk to Williams and sprott about giving him a good slap !-all in the name of charity of course !! What about matching him against Warren in another celeb type affair as it seems Claude may have 'bottled it' !!!!!

Weazle to ref !

Claude Abrams...

Claude Abrams...

Claude

Re: Claude

Bunce...Dunce