Kell Brook
Kell Brook
I'm a fan of Kells so i'm just wondering whats next? Has anyone heard who his next opponent will be?
Re: Kell Brook
Brook has a warm-up fight this Saturday on the Rees-Kotelnik bill in Cardiff. Then it's a shot at Kevin McIntyre before the end of June.banjo wrote:I'm a fan of Kells so i'm just wondering whats next? Has anyone heard who his next opponent will be?
Re: Kell Brook
What weight does he fight at on Saturday ?bennie wrote:Brook has a warm-up fight this Saturday on the Rees-Kotelnik bill in Cardiff. Then it's a shot at Kevin McIntyre before the end of June.banjo wrote:I'm a fan of Kells so i'm just wondering whats next? Has anyone heard who his next opponent will be?
I had heard rumours that he'd been on the biscuits again
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twenty six
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 3574
- Joined: 17 Jun 2006, 13:43
Kell has had a few fighters pull out of eliminators with him including Doherty. It is hardly his fault that he has not been able to fight anyone decent for the mandatory position.stujones wrote:I personally think the winner of the Doherty vs Jones fight would be more worthy - but Kel looks good and a fight with McIntyre would be tough to call.
Maybe not but he has been made the mandatory challenger by the BBoC so we can't argue.stujones wrote:Not denying that, but does his resume warrant an eliminator - ahead of the likes of Watson, Hatton, Doherty, McNeil etc.
No problem, if he does beat McIntyre, which most people think he won't, then Watson, Hatton Doherty, McNeil etc. can always try to take the title from him.
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Hot Tub Man#1
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 38
- Joined: 02 Apr 2006, 14:03
It's true to say the Kell's resume does not of itself warrant a shot, but the reason that his resume is bare is because Gary Young, John O'Donnell, Tony Doherty and Mark Thompson have all pulled out of fights with him.
The fight on Sat will be a bit than a warm-up, to be honest, from what i hear. If my sources are right it will be a significant step up against genuine big welter / light middle who can bang (but not take a great shot).
The fight on Sat will be a bit than a warm-up, to be honest, from what i hear. If my sources are right it will be a significant step up against genuine big welter / light middle who can bang (but not take a great shot).
Doherty pulled out of a fight with him already, Hatton pulled out of numerous English title fights, McNeil has lost recently and has been inactive.stujones wrote:Not denying that, but does his resume warrant an eliminator - ahead of the likes of Watson, Hatton, Doherty, McNeil etc.
Fighters don't seem to want to fight Brook in eliminators, so why should the BBBofC punish Brook for that?
McIntyre needed a mandatory challenger and seemingly no one was willing to go past Brook to become that challenger, so they gave the position to brook. It sounds fair enough to me.
Just my take on things.
In an ideal world, Kel would have fought the fights up to Karl David,that was a step up, a good learning fight..then moved upto fight someone on the same level as kel..a fellow contender. A Docherty, Young sort of fight.
That was what we wanted. That was what Kel himself wanted.
Those fights were made by Kel's Promoter,he did his job, kel was in shape and had done his job, but because this isn't an ideal world those fights didn't happen.
So the board make a final eliminator with him and Thompson. Bingo!
A fellow contender, fellow prospect a good learning fight.
Kel couldn't wait.
Unfortunately the fight was called off and once again Kel was left without a meaningful fight. But thats boxing and you just have to get on wit it as things like this happen all the time.
So Kel is made mandatory for the title. A straight shot. What are we supposed to do? Turn it down ? Then Kel gets slagged for turning the opportunity of a real fight down! Don't think so.
Remember, Kel has accepted fights against Docherty,Young, Thompson, Mcneil and K-9 Bundrage(for a slot on the contender show) and now against a British champion in McIntyre. Not bad for a kid that as many rightly say hasn't fought anyone.
Kel will fight anyone, he is just desperate to fight and prove to people he can fight. Plenty of young boxers would go off the rails after having the big fights he's had called off at the last minute..He hasn't.
He's only 21 and is still a baby when you line up the ages of his fellow contenders.
The McIntyre fight is going to happen whether people like it or not. . . Then when its over, we'll know if he deserved his shot or not.
In an ideal world, Kel would have fought the fights up to Karl David,that was a step up, a good learning fight..then moved upto fight someone on the same level as kel..a fellow contender. A Docherty, Young sort of fight.
That was what we wanted. That was what Kel himself wanted.
Those fights were made by Kel's Promoter,he did his job, kel was in shape and had done his job, but because this isn't an ideal world those fights didn't happen.
So the board make a final eliminator with him and Thompson. Bingo!
A fellow contender, fellow prospect a good learning fight.
Kel couldn't wait.
Unfortunately the fight was called off and once again Kel was left without a meaningful fight. But thats boxing and you just have to get on wit it as things like this happen all the time.
So Kel is made mandatory for the title. A straight shot. What are we supposed to do? Turn it down ? Then Kel gets slagged for turning the opportunity of a real fight down! Don't think so.
Remember, Kel has accepted fights against Docherty,Young, Thompson, Mcneil and K-9 Bundrage(for a slot on the contender show) and now against a British champion in McIntyre. Not bad for a kid that as many rightly say hasn't fought anyone.
Kel will fight anyone, he is just desperate to fight and prove to people he can fight. Plenty of young boxers would go off the rails after having the big fights he's had called off at the last minute..He hasn't.
He's only 21 and is still a baby when you line up the ages of his fellow contenders.
The McIntyre fight is going to happen whether people like it or not. . . Then when its over, we'll know if he deserved his shot or not.
Good points d.d wrote:Just my take on things.
In an ideal world, Kel would have fought the fights up to Karl David,that was a step up, a good learning fight..then moved upto fight someone on the same level as kel..a fellow contender. A Docherty, Young sort of fight.
That was what we wanted. That was what Kel himself wanted.
Those fights were made by Kel's Promoter,he did his job, kel was in shape and had done his job, but because this isn't an ideal world those fights didn't happen.
So the board make a final eliminator with him and Thompson. Bingo!
A fellow contender, fellow prospect a good learning fight.
Kel couldn't wait.
Unfortunately the fight was called off and once again Kel was left without a meaningful fight. But thats boxing and you just have to get on wit it as things like this happen all the time.
So Kel is made mandatory for the title. A straight shot. What are we supposed to do? Turn it down ? Then Kel gets slagged for turning the opportunity of a real fight down! Don't think so.
Remember, Kel has accepted fights against Docherty,Young, Thompson, Mcneil and K-9 Bundrage(for a slot on the contender show) and now against a British champion in McIntyre. Not bad for a kid that as many rightly say hasn't fought anyone.
Kel will fight anyone, he is just desperate to fight and prove to people he can fight. Plenty of young boxers would go off the rails after having the big fights he's had called off at the last minute..He hasn't.
He's only 21 and is still a baby when you line up the ages of his fellow contenders.
The McIntyre fight is going to happen whether people like it or not. . . Then when its over, we'll know if he deserved his shot or not.
Although it may be a long shot, if Kell does beat McIntyre no one can avoid him in the future. You may be able to dodge people on the way up but if you want to get to the top, you have to dethrone the guy sat on top of the hill.
D,
I appologies if my little opinion might have offended or being taken out of context. Not Kel fault and I do like the look of him and actually fancy his chances.
However, my main arguement was that whilst the Doherty fight was called off , I did think it maybe a tad wrong for the BBBoC to award Kel the chance and not Doherty - cause Doherty does have that sort of like mid tier victory - that as you honestly point out that Kel does lack - Taz Jones. He also ran the current champion to a very close, controvesial, points loss.
Okay, so we can say it was all Doherty's fault, he bottled it (I don't know if he did - just playing Devil's advocate) - okay make Doherty suffer. But then Watson (Nuumbembe), McNeil (Young), Hatton (Francis Jones) all have these mid tier (at least) wins that Brook lacks. Okay, maybe the same could be said for Hatton and McNeil as Doherty
Don't get me wrong, I aint being critical AT ALL of Brook or his management - he is just a baby learning his trade, and I won't be critical if it proves to be a fight too soon - cause you've got to take the risk... personally, I think he can do it. However, what I am critical is the BBBoC slightly lofty ranking of him - I personally don't think his record warrants for him to be involved in an eliminator for the BRITISH title, English title yes. Certainly he is worthy to be considered a voluntary opponent.
Surely Watson, Jennings (although is he eligable with his WBU belt), Mutley, should have been the next in line.
I don't want want you to take this the wrong way cause I appreciate that you have tried to get the appropriate fight - but just judging the record alone then, whose next to get a mandated shot, Curtis Woodhouse?
The Depth in the Welterweight devision is fantastic even the War horses like the Taz and Francis Jones, Sinclair, Magee, Tak? all probably would have craved to be mentioned in the title mix. I just think the BBBoC and Brook, in the long term, would have been better just to someone, even if it was someone decent but Brook would have started a healthy favourite against (e.g. Michael Lomax, David Walker) - then I think Brook would have got the mid tier win he needs and there would be no complaints - as he would be as worthy as all except Watson, Jennings and Mutley.
I just think when there as many as 20 fighters all thinking a British title shot could be very soon in their grasp and even winnable - that an eliminating fight would have helped sort out the devision. But to offer it to one of the least experience as a mandatory - I just think the BBBoC could have handled it better and help sort out the devision. Cause there is such a great depth to the devision.
But good luck to Brook, I think he'll do it - doesn't mean I think he deserves his shot.
I appologies if my little opinion might have offended or being taken out of context. Not Kel fault and I do like the look of him and actually fancy his chances.
However, my main arguement was that whilst the Doherty fight was called off , I did think it maybe a tad wrong for the BBBoC to award Kel the chance and not Doherty - cause Doherty does have that sort of like mid tier victory - that as you honestly point out that Kel does lack - Taz Jones. He also ran the current champion to a very close, controvesial, points loss.
Okay, so we can say it was all Doherty's fault, he bottled it (I don't know if he did - just playing Devil's advocate) - okay make Doherty suffer. But then Watson (Nuumbembe), McNeil (Young), Hatton (Francis Jones) all have these mid tier (at least) wins that Brook lacks. Okay, maybe the same could be said for Hatton and McNeil as Doherty
Don't get me wrong, I aint being critical AT ALL of Brook or his management - he is just a baby learning his trade, and I won't be critical if it proves to be a fight too soon - cause you've got to take the risk... personally, I think he can do it. However, what I am critical is the BBBoC slightly lofty ranking of him - I personally don't think his record warrants for him to be involved in an eliminator for the BRITISH title, English title yes. Certainly he is worthy to be considered a voluntary opponent.
Surely Watson, Jennings (although is he eligable with his WBU belt), Mutley, should have been the next in line.
I don't want want you to take this the wrong way cause I appreciate that you have tried to get the appropriate fight - but just judging the record alone then, whose next to get a mandated shot, Curtis Woodhouse?
The Depth in the Welterweight devision is fantastic even the War horses like the Taz and Francis Jones, Sinclair, Magee, Tak? all probably would have craved to be mentioned in the title mix. I just think the BBBoC and Brook, in the long term, would have been better just to someone, even if it was someone decent but Brook would have started a healthy favourite against (e.g. Michael Lomax, David Walker) - then I think Brook would have got the mid tier win he needs and there would be no complaints - as he would be as worthy as all except Watson, Jennings and Mutley.
I just think when there as many as 20 fighters all thinking a British title shot could be very soon in their grasp and even winnable - that an eliminating fight would have helped sort out the devision. But to offer it to one of the least experience as a mandatory - I just think the BBBoC could have handled it better and help sort out the devision. Cause there is such a great depth to the devision.
But good luck to Brook, I think he'll do it - doesn't mean I think he deserves his shot.
I totally understand what you are pointing out.stujones wrote:D,
I appologies if my little opinion might have offended or being taken out of context. Not Kel fault and I do like the look of him and actually fancy his chances.
However, my main arguement was that whilst the Doherty fight was called off , I did think it maybe a tad wrong for the BBBoC to award Kel the chance and not Doherty - cause Doherty does have that sort of like mid tier victory - that as you honestly point out that Kel does lack - Taz Jones. He also ran the current champion to a very close, controvesial, points loss.
Okay, so we can say it was all Doherty's fault, he bottled it (I don't know if he did - just playing Devil's advocate) - okay make Doherty suffer. But then Watson (Nuumbembe), McNeil (Young), Hatton (Francis Jones) all have these mid tier (at least) wins that Brook lacks. Okay, maybe the same could be said for Hatton and McNeil as Doherty
Don't get me wrong, I aint being critical AT ALL of Brook or his management - he is just a baby learning his trade, and I won't be critical if it proves to be a fight too soon - cause you've got to take the risk... personally, I think he can do it. However, what I am critical is the BBBoC slightly lofty ranking of him - I personally don't think his record warrants for him to be involved in an eliminator for the BRITISH title, English title yes. Certainly he is worthy to be considered a voluntary opponent.
Surely Watson, Jennings (although is he eligable with his WBU belt), Mutley, should have been the next in line.
I don't want want you to take this the wrong way cause I appreciate that you have tried to get the appropriate fight - but just judging the record alone then, whose next to get a mandated shot, Curtis Woodhouse?
The Depth in the Welterweight devision is fantastic even the War horses like the Taz and Francis Jones, Sinclair, Magee, Tak? all probably would have craved to be mentioned in the title mix. I just think the BBBoC and Brook, in the long term, would have been better just to someone, even if it was someone decent but Brook would have started a healthy favourite against (e.g. Michael Lomax, David Walker) - then I think Brook would have got the mid tier win he needs and there would be no complaints - as he would be as worthy as all except Watson, Jennings and Mutley.
I just think when there as many as 20 fighters all thinking a British title shot could be very soon in their grasp and even winnable - that an eliminating fight would have helped sort out the devision. But to offer it to one of the least experience as a mandatory - I just think the BBBoC could have handled it better and help sort out the devision. Cause there is such a great depth to the devision.
But good luck to Brook, I think he'll do it - doesn't mean I think he deserves his shot.
My response wasn't one that was aimed at claiming you are wrong or because we were offended or anything, just wanted to make some points on the subject.
You mention maybe a shot at the English first. Well the board actually did go down that route first..John O'Donnel was the champ,the board made Kel Mandatory for that and what happened? Mr. O'Donnel gave up the title rather than fight Kel!
So i guess with all the fingers pointing at Kel about him not fighting anyone, i just wanted to point out that he has accepted every challange.
It is a difficult one as how long do you wait trying to get a meaningful fight when no one goes thru with it? Docherty was Mandatory i believe but then got beat so we were tied in an eliminator and that fell through so maybe,just maybe the board thought 'to hell with it' just let the kid have a straight shot through default! I don't know mate but we are not saying Kel deserves his shot more than anyone else, all we are saying is he HAS his chance. He will take it. And then everyone will fight Kel because they want to be British Champ.
As you mentioned Matthew Hatton, may i point out that maybe after having towards 40fights he is ready for a shot, i would hope so. But then maybe his management hasn't pushed his name for a shot as his career lately has seen him on his brothers big undercard shows in the U.S.
You cant really have a British Title fight in Vegas can you?
Now he maybe back over here i expect his name to come up and Kel as champion would love the fight.
Fair points all - no you're fault at all. I was just looking at the Boxrec ratings at there are as many 20 fighters (and I would include Kel in that list, although maybe not in the upper echalon of that list based on his resume alone - not natural ability) who I would deem eliminator worthy. Surely the BBBoC could have just kept giving options. I'm sure many of these fighters would like a straight title shot because they are one defeat away from oblivion (the likes of Magee, Walker etc)... but I am sure tough guys like Taz and Francis Jones would have felt honoured that the BBBoC nominated them.d wrote: I totally understand what you are pointing out.
My response wasn't one that was aimed at claiming you are wrong or because we were offended or anything, just wanted to make some points on the subject.
You mention maybe a shot at the English first. Well the board actually did go down that route first..John O'Donnel was the champ,the board made Kel Mandatory for that and what happened? Mr. O'Donnel gave up the title rather than fight Kel!
So i guess with all the fingers pointing at Kel about him not fighting anyone, i just wanted to point out that he has accepted every challange.
It is a difficult one as how long do you wait trying to get a meaningful fight when no one goes thru with it? Docherty was Mandatory i believe but then got beat so we were tied in an eliminator and that fell through so maybe,just maybe the board thought 'to hell with it' just let the kid have a straight shot through default! I don't know mate but we are not saying Kel deserves his shot more than anyone else, all we are saying is he HAS his chance. He will take it. And then everyone will fight Kel because they want to be British Champ.
As you mentioned Matthew Hatton, may i point out that maybe after having towards 40fights he is ready for a shot, i would hope so. But then maybe his management hasn't pushed his name for a shot as his career lately has seen him on his brothers big undercard shows in the U.S.
You cant really have a British Title fight in Vegas can you?
Now he maybe back over here i expect his name to come up and Kel as champion would love the fight.
Just a bit frustrating as a fight fan, and I'm sure you are feeling the same frustration - that with so many eliminator worthy guys out there - that an eliminator contest cannot be made with so many similar level guys there.
That was Matthew Hatton's argument. He said he should be next in line for the title as hes fought better opponents then Kell.stujones wrote:D,
I appologies if my little opinion might have offended or being taken out of context. Not Kel fault and I do like the look of him and actually fancy his chances.
However, my main arguement was that whilst the Doherty fight was called off , I did think it maybe a tad wrong for the BBBoC to award Kel the chance and not Doherty - cause Doherty does have that sort of like mid tier victory - that as you honestly point out that Kel does lack - Taz Jones. He also ran the current champion to a very close, controvesial, points loss.
Okay, so we can say it was all Doherty's fault, he bottled it (I don't know if he did - just playing Devil's advocate) - okay make Doherty suffer. But then Watson (Nuumbembe), McNeil (Young), Hatton (Francis Jones) all have these mid tier (at least) wins that Brook lacks. Okay, maybe the same could be said for Hatton and McNeil as Doherty
Don't get me wrong, I aint being critical AT ALL of Brook or his management - he is just a baby learning his trade, and I won't be critical if it proves to be a fight too soon - cause you've got to take the risk... personally, I think he can do it. However, what I am critical is the BBBoC slightly lofty ranking of him - I personally don't think his record warrants for him to be involved in an eliminator for the BRITISH title, English title yes. Certainly he is worthy to be considered a voluntary opponent.
Surely Watson, Jennings (although is he eligable with his WBU belt), Mutley, should have been the next in line.
I don't want want you to take this the wrong way cause I appreciate that you have tried to get the appropriate fight - but just judging the record alone then, whose next to get a mandated shot, Curtis Woodhouse?
The Depth in the Welterweight devision is fantastic even the War horses like the Taz and Francis Jones, Sinclair, Magee, Tak? all probably would have craved to be mentioned in the title mix. I just think the BBBoC and Brook, in the long term, would have been better just to someone, even if it was someone decent but Brook would have started a healthy favourite against (e.g. Michael Lomax, David Walker) - then I think Brook would have got the mid tier win he needs and there would be no complaints - as he would be as worthy as all except Watson, Jennings and Mutley.
I just think when there as many as 20 fighters all thinking a British title shot could be very soon in their grasp and even winnable - that an eliminating fight would have helped sort out the devision. But to offer it to one of the least experience as a mandatory - I just think the BBBoC could have handled it better and help sort out the devision. Cause there is such a great depth to the devision.
But good luck to Brook, I think he'll do it - doesn't mean I think he deserves his shot.
Re: Kell Brook
Haven't got time to read the rest of the thread but just to say that a) I believe he's down to fight Manoo Salari on Sat and b) the rumours are utter rubbish then - he looked in great nick on Sunday.beagleboy wrote:What weight does he fight at on Saturday ?bennie wrote:Brook has a warm-up fight this Saturday on the Rees-Kotelnik bill in Cardiff. Then it's a shot at Kevin McIntyre before the end of June.banjo wrote:I'm a fan of Kells so i'm just wondering whats next? Has anyone heard who his next opponent will be?
I had heard rumours that he'd been on the biscuits again
I know this is a Kell thread and good luck to him. I know little about him. Seems young and seems like he's had some considerable frustration getting successful eliminators.stujones wrote:D,
I appologies if my little opinion might have offended or being taken out of context. Not Kel fault and I do like the look of him and actually fancy his chances.
However, my main arguement was that whilst the Doherty fight was called off , I did think it maybe a tad wrong for the BBBoC to award Kel the chance and not Doherty - cause Doherty does have that sort of like mid tier victory - that as you honestly point out that Kel does lack - Taz Jones. He also ran the current champion to a very close, controvesial, points loss.
Okay, so we can say it was all Doherty's fault, he bottled it (I don't know if he did - just playing Devil's advocate) - okay make Doherty suffer. But then Watson (Nuumbembe), McNeil (Young), Hatton (Francis Jones) all have these mid tier (at least) wins that Brook lacks. Okay, maybe the same could be said for Hatton and McNeil as Doherty
Don't get me wrong, I aint being critical AT ALL of Brook or his management - he is just a baby learning his trade, and I won't be critical if it proves to be a fight too soon - cause you've got to take the risk... personally, I think he can do it. However, what I am critical is the BBBoC slightly lofty ranking of him - I personally don't think his record warrants for him to be involved in an eliminator for the BRITISH title, English title yes. Certainly he is worthy to be considered a voluntary opponent.
Surely Watson, Jennings (although is he eligable with his WBU belt), Mutley, should have been the next in line.
I don't want want you to take this the wrong way cause I appreciate that you have tried to get the appropriate fight - but just judging the record alone then, whose next to get a mandated shot, Curtis Woodhouse?
The Depth in the Welterweight devision is fantastic even the War horses like the Taz and Francis Jones, Sinclair, Magee, Tak? all probably would have craved to be mentioned in the title mix. I just think the BBBoC and Brook, in the long term, would have been better just to someone, even if it was someone decent but Brook would have started a healthy favourite against (e.g. Michael Lomax, David Walker) - then I think Brook would have got the mid tier win he needs and there would be no complaints - as he would be as worthy as all except Watson, Jennings and Mutley.
I just think when there as many as 20 fighters all thinking a British title shot could be very soon in their grasp and even winnable - that an eliminating fight would have helped sort out the devision. But to offer it to one of the least experience as a mandatory - I just think the BBBoC could have handled it better and help sort out the devision. Cause there is such a great depth to the devision.
But good luck to Brook, I think he'll do it - doesn't mean I think he deserves his shot.
I am somewhat surprised by some of your selections of "mid tier opponents". Ali Nuumbembe I would suggest is the best boxer you mention, this would be contestable oaginst the backdrop of the Watson defeat (on cuts I might add), but Watson's what sounds like a bad defeat last week in Italy puts things in perspective for me. I could not see anyone frankly obliterating Nuumbembe in the same fashion.......(and please don't give me Olusegun as AN was boxing to save a show and make money to stay in the country at very short notice having lost a lot of weight fast).
And I don't know much about Young either due to injury/inactivity but as for Jones I think people overlook that Francis burnt Matthew Hatton's fingers at the MEN in 2003 in what for Hatton was no doubt meant to be another routine win. Francis got an away "draw" though 2 out of 2 Sky pundits said he won the 6 rounder by 2 points.
He tried to get square with Hatton but that camp were highly UNinterested. Interest resumes 15 months later when, ONE day after being beaten on points by Nuumbembe - sorry it was actually about 9 hours - an email was sent from camp Hatton offering Jones a rematch in 6 days time - Jones took it so he could whup Hatton but unfortunately his body could not repair itself sufficiently in 6 days after a full throttle battle with Nuumbembe in such short time.
IMO Hatton's lot banked on this, although they would claim the timing was coincidence. What a load of shit. It was a chicken shit strategy IMO and not untypical of how things are done in that department. See the wider picture.
Whereas Jones has readily stepped in with Nuumbembe, a Commonwealth star with a load of credentials, big punching Sinclair, who he knacked in 5 and gone just shy of 12 with a rampant Anderson.......Hatton hasn't really done all that much.
At the last look in fight 30-whatever the bloke had lost 7 out of 8 going in.
He's trying to get a title shot by default IMO but if he ever does I think he'll get found out. Francis shouldn't really be getting bracketed ALONGSIDE, let alone below Matthew Hatton. Others fit the same description I would say.
I will look forward to Kell's fights with interest, as I do the WW division in general.