De La Hoya-Hopkins getting closer...

Ulysses · Post by **Ulysses** » 18 Feb 2004, 04:43

USA Today are reporting that Oscar De La Hoya and Bernard Hopkins may share the June 5 PPV date fighting middleweights Felix Sturm (WBO champ) and Robert Allen respectively.
Then later in the year the mega-fight will be on, De La Hoya to earn $30m+ and Hopkins $10m+.
This would be a real tough fight to call, at the moment I'd favour Hopkins... just.

knockout artist · Post by **knockout artist** » 18 Feb 2004, 04:49

Hopkins, too powerful, too strong, too classy, too good, for DLH.

Hopkins by late KO, in a great fight.

This is IMO the most eagerly anticipated fight of the year.

If it can be made at 157lbs its a good matchup, but IMO Hopkins is truly great and is just better than Oscar.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 18 Feb 2004, 04:57

Hopkins would rip DLH to shreds.

Chambers · Post by **Chambers** » 18 Feb 2004, 11:22

I would pick Hopkins to comfortably beat DLH, I would much prefer to see Bernard put a stone on and fight RJJ

J · Post by J » 18 Feb 2004, 11:34

agree totally Behrnhard got too much for him, but why shoudl he put a stone on to fight a naturally bigger man, its a shame but the fight will never happen, RRJJ stuggling to make light heavy and Hopkins looks pretty comfortable to me at middle, he isnt a concussive puncher at middleweight so why on earth would he go up to light heavy? Same goes for Calzaghe / Toney or anyone else calling out hopkins. If you arent in the same weight class get off the guys back cos it wont happen.

Chambers · Post by **Chambers** » 18 Feb 2004, 11:58

J wrote:agree totally Behrnhard got too much for him, but why shoudl he put a stone on to fight a naturally bigger man, its a shame but the fight will never happen, RRJJ stuggling to make light heavy and Hopkins looks pretty comfortable to me at middle, he isnt a concussive puncher at middleweight so why on earth would he go up to light heavy? Same goes for Calzaghe / Toney or anyone else calling out hopkins. If you arent in the same weight class get off the guys back cos it wont happen.

IMO the 2 best pound for pound fighters are BH and RJJ, so I would naturally like to see them fight each other if possible and the most realistic weight for them to fight at is Light Heavy.

hitman_hatton1 · Post by **hitman_hatton1** » 18 Feb 2004, 12:03

boxing needs this fight

i'm well pleased it looks likely and lets hope de la hoya shuts him up for good

eastman is out in the cold though

looks like some of u guys were right when u thought he should have gone for the wbo title

nevermind maybe he'll fight the winner.

J · Post by J » 18 Feb 2004, 12:24

chambers mate, totally agreee Im just saiyng it wont happen mate, Roy is now a natural light heavy, Bernhard isnt and I just cant see him being willing to do it. Agree with you though, its a shame they couldnt have got it on at super middle a year or two ago.

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 18 Feb 2004, 12:43

The mere fact of them appearing together on the same card (and even that is just talk at this point) means f*ck-all as far as them ever facing each other. DLH would only dream of taking on a guy like Hopkins if he started seeing clear signs of deterioration in Nard's game - and that hasn't happened yet.

I'm disappointed that the talk of a possible Hopkins/Tarver fight never went anywhere - Tarver said on last week's FNF show that Hopkins stipulated Tarver come in no heavier than a catchweight of 170, at which Tarver said "no way." So it's OK for Jones to drop back down from around 200 lbs. to face Tarver, but not for Tarver to drop 5 lbs. to face the smaller Hopkins? Does that strike anyone besides me as disingenuous? Besides the intrigue such a matchup would've provided in and of itself, it would've natural for the winner to get a rematch with Jones. But from Hopkins' perspective, the safer money surely would be to look directly for a megafight rematch with his old foe, rather than risk losing to the bigger, dangerous Tarver.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 18 Feb 2004, 12:54

To be fair to Tarver, he walks around at 208, so making 170 would probably have been totally beyond him.

Jones chose to drop down, nobody forced him, he wanted his light heavyweight belts back, and therefore had no choice to make 175,
it was make the weight or it was a non-title bout.

Tarver was already talking about moving up in weight, he's a massive light heavyweight and I don't think it was that out of order insisting Nard come up to meet him.

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 18 Feb 2004, 13:26

Eric the Viking wrote:DLH would only dream of taking on a guy like Hopkins if he started seeing clear signs of deterioration in Nard's game - and that hasn't happened yet.

Not sure if this is a dig at DLH but don't forget Oscar put it all on the line against Ike Quartey and Felix Trinidad in the same year.

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 18 Feb 2004, 15:04

Kilburn wrote:
Eric the Viking wrote:DLH would only dream of taking on a guy like Hopkins if he started seeing clear signs of deterioration in Nard's game - and that hasn't happened yet.

Not sure if this is a dig at DLH but don't forget Oscar put it all on the line against Ike Quartey and Felix Trinidad in the same year.

Only his taking on Trinidad is even remotely comparable to taking on a guy like Hopkins. Quartey was a much-smaller man, at the end of his career, and Oscar was lucky to escape with a narrow decision. Trinidad was a dangerous puncher, but somewhat one-dimensional and with a suspect chin - and let's not forget that Oscar ran like a little bitch (or someone who assumed the cards were stacked in his favor, as the house fighter) for the last 6 rounds of that fight, then whined like a spoiled brat about not getting the decision (gee, that sounds strangely familiar...). DLH's other most-notable wins (Whitaker and Chavez) were both against smaller guys well past their primes (and there agin, DLH arguably got a gift vs. Sweet Pea.) None of these guys posed anywhere near the risk that facing a guy like Hopkins (even at nearly age 40) would - or will, if this fight really is on. I hope it is and will give DLH much more respect in that case, but I'll believe it when I see it.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 18 Feb 2004, 15:23

I'm actually looking forward to the starter (if this all happens). Robert Allen is a good boxer, who I believe is better than William Joppy at this moment in time - some people gave Joppy a chance, I give Allen a similar chance as I gave Joppy. Its slim, but you never know.

Felix Straum is a better warm up than Yori Boy Campus was for DLH's next superfight. It also gives us the chance to see what DLH can do at Middle, and DLH to add yet another belt to his list - although it will be even less recognised than his WBO Superfeather Belt.

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 18 Feb 2004, 15:36

stujones wrote:Felix Straum is a better warm up than Yori Boy Campus was for DLH's next superfight. It also gives us the chance to see what DLH can do at Middle, and DLH to add yet another belt to his list - although it will be even less recognised than his WBO Superfeather Belt.

We don't know that, because Sturm is completely untested against top-10 competition. He and Campas are equally over the hill, just on opposite sides. And you can bet the DLH hype machine will be crowing about that "World Title in an unprecedented 6th weight division" all the way to the IBHOF. What a load of rubbish. IF he actually winds up taking on Hopkins, and IF he actually beats him (both of those are really big ifs, BTW), he should get credit for 5, which would be darn good. But winning the crappy WBO belt from a green-behind-the-ears youngster who beat a barely-top-20 guy for it? Spare me...

Ulysses · Post by **Ulysses** » 18 Feb 2004, 18:50

Eric the Viking wrote:
stujones wrote:Felix Straum is a better warm up than Yori Boy Campus was for DLH's next superfight. It also gives us the chance to see what DLH can do at Middle, and DLH to add yet another belt to his list - although it will be even less recognised than his WBO Superfeather Belt.
We don't know that, because Sturm is completely untested against top-10 competition. He and Campas are equally over the hill, just on opposite sides. And you can bet the DLH hype machine will be crowing about that "World Title in an unprecedented 6th weight division" all the way to the IBHOF. What a load of rubbish. IF he actually winds up taking on Hopkins, and IF he actually beats him (both of those are really big ifs, BTW), he should get credit for 5, which would be darn good. But winning the crappy WBO belt from a green-behind-the-ears youngster who beat a barely-top-20 guy for it? Spare me...

People will believe what they wanna believe, all boxers have their knockers (just like Jordan!)

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 18 Feb 2004, 20:11

Ulysses wrote:People will believe what they wanna believe, all boxers have their knockers (just like Jordan!)

...And some boxers have bigger knockers than others (just like Kirk Johnson and his flapping man-titties!) :P

Kilburn · Post by **Kilburn** » 19 Feb 2004, 06:03

Eric the Viking wrote:
Only his taking on Trinidad is even remotely comparable to taking on a guy like Hopkins. Quartey was a much-smaller man, at the end of his career, and Oscar was lucky to escape with a narrow decision. Trinidad was a dangerous puncher, but somewhat one-dimensional and with a suspect chin - and let's not forget that Oscar ran like a little bitch (or someone who assumed the cards were stacked in his favor, as the house fighter) for the last 6 rounds of that fight, then whined like a spoiled brat about not getting the decision (gee, that sounds strangely familiar...)

Quartey had already been fighting at 147 for 6 years and somehow he's a "much smaller man" than De La Hoya? Er I think not.

Regardless of how people scored the fights with Ike & Tito, there's no getting away from the fact that Oscar took on the 2 most dangerous men in his division in the same year. Both were young, unbeaten, hungry, confident, big hitting legit welterweight champions.

Say what you like about De La Hoya but never accuse him of avoiding a challenge.

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 19 Feb 2004, 12:42

Kilburn wrote:Quartey had already been fighting at 147 for 6 years and somehow he's a "much smaller man" than De La Hoya? Er I think not.

I was referring to DLH's significant height and reach advantage over the 5'7" Quartey - obviously they were at roughly the same weight for the fight.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 19 Feb 2004, 12:52

And what significance does that have, your point is exactly?

What DLH was wrong for taking on a shorter opponent? What's he supposed to do, give his opponents bloody stilts to wear, he's fairly tall for a welterweight.

That's a pretty pointless statement you made there Eric, are you going to criticise the entirety of Thomas Hearns' career then, I guess his win over Roberto Duran doesn't count then, seeing as Duran was the far smaller man?

mickeybeard · Post by **mickeybeard** » 19 Feb 2004, 12:53

J wrote:agree totally Behrnhard got too much for him, but why shoudl he put a stone on to fight a naturally bigger man, its a shame but the fight will never happen, RRJJ stuggling to make light heavy and Hopkins looks pretty comfortable to me at middle, he isnt a concussive puncher at middleweight so why on earth would he go up to light heavy? Same goes for Calzaghe / Toney or anyone else calling out hopkins. If you arent in the same weight class get off the guys back cos it wont happen.

Completely agree, but I'd point out that Hopkins has spent a fair amount of his time calling out guys at lower weights to him.

J · Post by J » 19 Feb 2004, 13:12

yeah agree mate but do you think thats cos Hopkins is aware of his lack of a ko punch as such? Mind you having said that I cant see any of middles out there giving him any trouble 39 yrs old or not.

knockout artist · Post by **knockout artist** » 19 Feb 2004, 14:03

I am praying for this fight to happen.

I've just read in the London Evening Standard that Warren is still hopeful of a career defining fight for Calzaghe with Hopkins.

You are a 168lb title holder for six years, you have not had a single unification fight in that time and you think you can define your career by beating a guy one division below you, near the end of his career, who could easily make 154lbs.

GET REAL CALZAGHE.

LAST WEEK YOU WERE MOVING UP TO LIGHT HEAVY.

STOP FAFFING AROUND THERE RE LOADS OF FIGHTS AT 168

OTTKE
REID
MUNDINE
ECHOLS

Fight one of them.

Stop being a bully trying to fight a man samller than you.

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 19 Feb 2004, 14:49

jamesmcdonnell wrote:And what significance does that have, your point is exactly?

What DLH was wrong for taking on a shorter opponent? What's he supposed to do, give his opponents bloody stilts to wear, he's fairly tall for a welterweight.

That's a pretty pointless statement you made there Eric, are you going to criticise the entirety of Thomas Hearns' career then, I guess his win over Roberto Duran doesn't count then, seeing as Duran was the far smaller man?

My point was that Quartey was past his prime, and that DLH has made a career of keeping typically shorter opponents at bay with his jab and using his outside boxing skills to win fights. In other words, Quartey was tailor-made for DLH - impressive credentials, but really few ways to beat a guy like Oscar at that point. You'll surely be tempted to say that Mosley is also shorter than De La Hoya, but Mosley has very fast hands, a greater reach and was in his prime when he and DLH first met. So that was a risky fight for Oscar - and guess what, he lost it. In fact, every time in his career Oscar has faced a similarly-skilled-and-aged guy he didn't have a significant height & reach advantage over, he's lost. What exactly is so impressive about that?

And no, I don't think Hearns' win over Duran was as impressive as beating someone like Hagler or Leonard would've been. Or like Oscar beating someone like Hopkins would be, compared to his win vs. Ike.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 19 Feb 2004, 16:41

Eric,

You say that many of DLH's fighters are past their prime, whilst I agree most of them were still #1 in their devision at the time of their meeting. DLH couldn't help his date of birth.

Guys like Chavez, Whittikar and Quartey (who I don't believe was past his prime) were still unbeaten for years - Chavez going on to a respectable draw with Gonzales. These were the champions and Whittikar and Chavez were both considered the #1 in the devision at the time - DLH can't do much more than that can he.

Fair enough, you can criticise the some of his opponents (i.e. Camacho and Campas) for being over the hill, especially as they hadn't held a recognised belt for a number of years. However, in Whittikar and Chavez DLH faced the #1 in the devision.

Would you be saying the same thing if Hatton KO'd Tszyu.

Twinkle Toes · Post by **Twinkle Toes** » 19 Feb 2004, 17:33

mickeybeard wrote:
I'd point out that Hopkins has spent a fair amount of his time calling out guys at lower weights to him.

I have also noticed this, and am a little surprised it isn't picked up on more than it has been. I'm obviously missing something with Hopkins, because he doesn't impress me like he has impressed some fight fans.