How did you score it - Ali-Norton II 1973

Robinson · Post by **Robinson** » 23 Apr 2008, 03:03

I just watched it and scored it.

I had it as a draw, as sad as that sounds.
6-6 rounds a piece.
114-114 even HOWEVER I think that had it been scored on the 10 point must you could argue that the 7th could be a 8 point round for Ali as he was battered from corner to corner.

I had it Ali Round 1-5 Norton Round 6-11 and Ali stealing the last round to tip it.

How did you score it guys

Kym

elmersalsa · Post by **elmersalsa** » 24 Apr 2008, 12:37

I got NOrton winning the fight by 7 rounds to 4 one even. Ali did better this time, BUT HE LOST.

In fact, he lost all 3 fights with Kenny.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 24 Apr 2008, 12:54

elmersalsa wrote:I got NOrton winning the fight by 7 rounds to 4 one even. Ali did better this time, BUT HE LOST.

In fact, he lost all 3 fights with Kenny.

balderdash...or poppycock....or perhaps just a dose of old fashioned BS.

SteveO · Post by **SteveO** » 24 Apr 2008, 14:57

12-0 Ali!!

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 24 Apr 2008, 16:42

This was my round by round posted in an earlier thread:

"Here we go:

Rounds 1-3: Ali dancing, feet as fast as before the layoff. Norton stalking, landing occasional hard body shots that pay later dividends. Round 2 closer as neither fighter lands much but Norton lands the harder shots. Ali showing some beautiful foot-speed and a hard consistant jab. I score all rounds Ali.

Round 4: Ali dancing, still throwing the hard jab. Norton focusing on the body. Ali lands some nice combinations. Norton comes on in last 20 seconds, lands best punch of the night so far, a right hand, at the bell but still Ali outlanded him for most of the round. Round to Ali

Round 5: Ali still dancing, but not throwing the jab as much . .Norton steps up the pace and starts to throw and land the jab much more often. His pressure is getting to Ali. Lands some hard body shots against the ropes. Ali steps it up in the last 20 seconds but Norton comes back with hard left hooks. Norton round

Round 6: Ali looking more tired. Norton easily slipping Ali's jabs and countering with his own jab. Ali lands his best punches in the final minute with a sharp right hand and left hook, but it only stirs Norton to anger who comes back with his jab. Closer round, but I edge it to Norton.

After 6 I have it Ali: 4 Norton: 2

Round 7: Ali again tired. Norton pressing, landing good combinations on the ropes. Last minute, Norton starts really working Ali over on the ropes. Ali hurt. Norton's best round by far so far; Round to Norton.

Round 8: Ali still dancing but not as fast. Ali lands some nice counters flat-footed. Norton landing a few good shots while Ali's on the ropes. A closer, quieter round. Norton lands a HARD left hook and right hand combination in the final 30 seconds, along with a final left hook at the bell that gives him the round; Round to Norton.

Round 9: Norton slipping most of Ali's jabs. Landing his own jab. Good right hand from Norton. Norton working over Ali's body against the ropes again. Ali lands a couple of right hands which stun Norton, but it's not enough to pull the round and Ken comes back with his own shots: Round to Norton

Round 10: Ali opens up with a beautiful one-two. Ali coming back with movement and the jab. Norton is tired. Norton in the last minute begins to land with Ali on the ropes, including two big left hooks. Close round, I give it to Ali. Round to Ali.

After 10 I have it Ali 5 Norton: 5

Round 11: Ali starts off the round strong. They stand toe to toe. Norton hurts Ali to the body and starts really working Ali over. Both fighters tired. Ali able to avoid Norton's follow-up. Norton lands a good uppercut to Ali. Ali evades Norton and makes a mini-comeback in the final 10 seconds. Round to Norton.

Round 12: Ali giving it all he has. Lands some great combinations. Norton dead tired. Norton comes on in final minute to lands some hard hooks but it's not enough to win the round. Round to Ali.

Final score is 6-6. Dead even. I wouldn't have a problem with someone scoring the 6th for Ali nor would I have an issue with round 4 even as the commentators did.

Final Verdict: Close fight that could have gone EITHER WAY."

raylawpc · Post by **raylawpc** » 24 Apr 2008, 16:51

I had Norton winning by a slim margin (7-5), but two or three of the rounds could have gone either way, and so I have no issue who anyone who scored it close for Ali, or as a draw.

Collins2000 · Post by **Collins2000** » 24 Apr 2008, 18:56

raylawpc wrote:I had Norton winning by a slim margin (7-5), but two or three of the rounds could have gone either way, and so I have no issue who anyone who scored it close for Ali, or as a draw.

How about:
Norton - 10 rounds
Ali - 1 round
Even - 1 round

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 24 Apr 2008, 21:25

Collins wasn't that the scorecard for the third fight that someone shared a few weeks ago? Or was that for fight II?

elmersalsa · Post by **elmersalsa** » 24 Apr 2008, 21:50

BoxBuzz wrote:
elmersalsa wrote:I got NOrton winning the fight by 7 rounds to 4 one even. Ali did better this time, BUT HE LOST.

In fact, he lost all 3 fights with Kenny.
balderdash...or poppycock....or perhaps just a dose of old fashioned BS.

YEAH, watch the fight again, Ali lost just like the first fight, maybe worse.

Ali is the only fighter in history that CLEARLY LOSES THE FIGHT, and still is the "winner".

Goodnight, Irene · Post by **Goodnight, Irene** » 24 Apr 2008, 21:54

I had it 6-5-1 for Ali. It's not unreasonable to say Ali may've lost all three fights. The first one, it was close but clear to Norton. The second one could legitimately scored either way, & the last was the most convincing of the three, definitely a Norton win.

I thought Ali just edged him out in fight two, however.

Robinson · Post by **Robinson** » 24 Apr 2008, 22:39

I will rewatch it later but I feel it was a draw.
I shall score the third fight later.

Thanks guys.

Collins2000 · Post by **Collins2000** » 25 Apr 2008, 01:12

BoxBuzz wrote:Collins wasn't that the scorecard for the third fight that someone shared a few weeks ago? Or was that for fight II?

Buzz, go back to bed mate. The 3rd fight was a 15 rounder...

Collins2000 · Post by **Collins2000** » 25 Apr 2008, 01:15

elmersalsa wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:
elmersalsa wrote:I got NOrton winning the fight by 7 rounds to 4 one even. Ali did better this time, BUT HE LOST.

In fact, he lost all 3 fights with Kenny.
balderdash...or poppycock....or perhaps just a dose of old fashioned BS.
YEAH, watch the fight again, Ali lost just like the first fight, maybe worse.

Ali is the only fighter in history that CLEARLY LOSES THE FIGHT, and still is the "winner".

Hahahhaha, are you drunk again?

You think Ali did worse in the 2nd Norton fight than he did in the 1st?

You need to sit down with a responsible adult and have them explain to you what you are looking at.

Robinson · Post by **Robinson** » 25 Apr 2008, 09:10

I can see one arguing either way, but I am happy to sit on my draw verdict.

In my lil book that I score the fights on I have noticed that I hand out way to many 'draws'.

Ezzard · Post by **Ezzard** » 25 Apr 2008, 09:18

6-5-1 to Norton was my score watching the youtube fight. I had the 2nd round even...

I even watched the 3rd fight but not all the way through as it's not really that riveting... Anyway, Norton misses out on rounds by not really pressing the action. He stands in the middle of the ring too much and does nothing... and allows lots of the rounds to be close rather than going in there and dominating. i used to think it was a definite Norton win but now I can see how people might have been giving the close rounds to Ali. The rounds Norton wins are obvious. If it was tennis Ali's rounds would have all gone to deuce but they still count.

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 25 Apr 2008, 09:24

Goodnight, Irene wrote:I had it 6-5-1 for Ali. It's not unreasonable to say Ali may've lost all three fights. The first one, it was close but clear to Norton. The second one could legitimately scored either way, & the last was the most convincing of the three, definitely a Norton win.

I thought Ali just edged him out in fight two, however.

Really, I haven't seen it awhile but from the times I've seen their first fight it appeared that Ali barely was in the scoring. He won . .what .. .3 rounds?, mabye 1 even? I think their first fight was a pretty rubber-stamped domination by Norton, despite one judge disgracefully scoring it to Ali.

And as stated before, I wouldn't have any problem with Ali winning the rematch by a point or so.

elmersalsa · Post by **elmersalsa** » 25 Apr 2008, 16:22

The reason they gave Ali the fight was just the simple fact that they wanted his career to keep going. But they knew that Ali lost that second contests. There is no TRUE SPORTSMANSHIP, FOLKS. Norton was robbed big time.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 25 Apr 2008, 16:52

Collins2000 wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:Collins wasn't that the scorecard for the third fight that someone shared a few weeks ago? Or was that for fight II?

Buzz, go back to bed mate. The 3rd fight was a 15 rounder...

OK OK granberry jr....I meant in style only. Was not being literal and a bit in jest. I seem to remember another person basically calling all but one round for Norton a few weeks ago didn't think it was the same fight or the same contributor but maybe it was. It was the "all but one" that got my attention in this case.

3 years ago this board was being barraged with Marciano Threads...now it's Ali threads.....just a phase I suppose. I'm waiting for the Joe Jeanette wave to roll through.

Collins2000 · Post by **Collins2000** » 25 Apr 2008, 17:42

BoxBuzz wrote:
Collins2000 wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:Collins wasn't that the scorecard for the third fight that someone shared a few weeks ago? Or was that for fight II?

Buzz, go back to bed mate. The 3rd fight was a 15 rounder...
OK OK granberry jr....I meant in style only. Was not being literal and a bit in jest. I seem to remember another person basically calling all but one round for Norton a few weeks ago didn't think it was the same fight or the same contributor but maybe it was. It was the "all but one" that got my attention in this case.

3 years ago this board was being barraged with Marciano Threads...now it's Ali threads.....just a phase I suppose. I'm waiting for the Joe Jeanette wave to roll through.

I prefer to talk about fighters like Kostas Petrou or Charlie Magri.

It was Davey who had it 10 rounds for Norton, 1 for Ali and 1 even.

I had it 7 - 5 for Ali.

dempseyfire · Post by **dempseyfire** » 25 Apr 2008, 17:56

elmersalsa wrote:The reason they gave Ali the fight was just the simple fact that they wanted his career to keep going. But they knew that Ali lost that second contests. There is no TRUE SPORTSMANSHIP, FOLKS. Norton was robbed big time.

A coulda-gone-either-way fight is NOT a robbery.

Goodnight, Irene · Post by **Goodnight, Irene** » 25 Apr 2008, 22:22

"Really, I haven't seen it awhile but from the times I've seen their first fight it appeared that Ali barely was in the scoring. He won . .what .. .3 rounds?, mabye 1 even? I think their first fight was a pretty rubber-stamped domination by Norton, despite one judge disgracefully scoring it to Ali.

And as stated before, I wouldn't have any problem with Ali winning the rematch by a point or so." - DempseyFire

Been a while since I saw it, too, though I do have the fight & probably should sit down with it again some time. Even so, there was no way (at least, in my book) that Norton was that dominant --- I had it 7-5, 115-113, it was somewhat similar to the recent Calzaghe-Hopkins bout --- as I saw it, a fairly close fight, but one in which there was still a clear winner, & that was Norton. I certainly would not say it wasn't competitive, though, & I also suspect that Ali's broken jaw has become mythology. I would place money on his jaw being broken late, rather than early (I have heard people like Pacheco even speculate it was broken in the first), because Ali was quite active until the later rounds. All credit to him if it did genuinely break early, but I sincerely doubt it.

In any case, I do think their first fight was close. Excellent point you make, by the way, Dempsey, about close fights not being robberies. I hate it when a fight is a toss-up call, & people go ballistic (such as De La Hoya-Quartey, or De La Hoya-Whitaker). Yeah, one guy was lucky & the other wasn't (as was the case with Ali-Norton II), but that does not constitute a robbery. People would do well to remember that.

BoxBuzz · Post by **BoxBuzz** » 25 Apr 2008, 23:40

Collins2000 wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:
Collins2000 wrote:
Buzz, go back to bed mate. The 3rd fight was a 15 rounder...
OK OK granberry jr....I meant in style only. Was not being literal and a bit in jest. I seem to remember another person basically calling all but one round for Norton a few weeks ago didn't think it was the same fight or the same contributor but maybe it was. It was the "all but one" that got my attention in this case.

3 years ago this board was being barraged with Marciano Threads...now it's Ali threads.....just a phase I suppose. I'm waiting for the Joe Jeanette wave to roll through.
I prefer to talk about fighters like Kostas Petrou or Charlie Magri.

It was Davey who had it 10 rounds for Norton, 1 for Ali and 1 even.

I had it 7 - 5 for Ali.

Collins just like a damn broken clock you go a way long time with nothing relevant to offer, and then out of nowhere, and for just a minute....you display perfection.

Collins2000 · Post by **Collins2000** » 25 Apr 2008, 23:55

BoxBuzz wrote:
Collins2000 wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote: OK OK granberry jr....I meant in style only. Was not being literal and a bit in jest. I seem to remember another person basically calling all but one round for Norton a few weeks ago didn't think it was the same fight or the same contributor but maybe it was. It was the "all but one" that got my attention in this case.

3 years ago this board was being barraged with Marciano Threads...now it's Ali threads.....just a phase I suppose. I'm waiting for the Joe Jeanette wave to roll through.
I prefer to talk about fighters like Kostas Petrou or Charlie Magri.

It was Davey who had it 10 rounds for Norton, 1 for Ali and 1 even.

I had it 7 - 5 for Ali.
Collins just like a damn broken clock you go a way long time with nothing relevant to offer, and then out of nowhere, and for just a minute....you display perfection.

Listen up Old Fraud #2.

How do you determine what is relevant? Given that you know fekk all about boxing I mean.

Stick to sucking off your boy granberry (aka terap, banned for racial abuse).

granberry · Post by **granberry** » 26 Apr 2008, 01:58

Collins2000 wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote:
Collins2000 wrote: I prefer to talk about fighters like Kostas Petrou or Charlie Magri.

It was Davey who had it 10 rounds for Norton, 1 for Ali and 1 even.

I had it 7 - 5 for Ali.
Collins just like a damn broken clock you go a way long time with nothing relevant to offer, and then out of nowhere, and for just a minute....you display perfection.
Listen up Old Fraud #2.

How do you determine what is relevant? Given that you know fekk all about boxing I mean.

Stick to sucking off your boy granberry (aka terap, banned for racial abuse).

Looks more like buzz and collins are sucking off each other.

Collins NEVER posts on boxing.

He slithers around boxrec posting snipes at other posters

with the obvious blessing of 'moderator' [that's a laugh] buzz.

buzz is the enabler of collins, whose only purpose is the destruction of boxrec.

Collins2000 · Post by **Collins2000** » 26 Apr 2008, 02:19

granberry wrote:
Collins2000 wrote:
BoxBuzz wrote: Collins just like a damn broken clock you go a way long time with nothing relevant to offer, and then out of nowhere, and for just a minute....you display perfection.
Listen up Old Fraud #2.

How do you determine what is relevant? Given that you know fekk all about boxing I mean.

Stick to sucking off your boy granberry (aka terap, banned for racial abuse).
Looks more like buzz and collins are sucking off each other.

Collins NEVER posts on boxing.

He slithers around boxrec posting snipes at other posters

with the obvious blessing of 'moderator' [that's a laugh] buzz.

buzz is the enabler of collins, whose only purpose is the destruction of boxrec.

Terap, you old fraud, tell us about how you were banned from here AND the CBZ for racial abuse.