SONNY Liston vs Joe Frazier

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 28 Feb 2004, 11:30

This would be an explosive match up.... a peak 1960 Liston against the peak 1971 Frazier. Could Liston have overcome Fraziers furious attack... would Frazier wear Liston down. Wouls Frazier be able to survive Listons Bombs. Styles make fights and I think that Fraziers style was made for Liston. Liston would force Frazier back with his huge jabs and dismantle Frazier much like George Foreman did twice... Liston a winner by about 5th round ko... all comments and views invited!......

wouter · Post by **wouter** » 28 Feb 2004, 11:53

Couldn't have said it better myself, I even think 5 rounds is bit too long

Marciano Frazier · Post by **Marciano Frazier** » 28 Feb 2004, 14:15

I can't stand the way every time Frazier is matched up with a powerful puncher, nearly everyone involved immediately says "It would be like Foreman-Frazier!" It would not, especially in this case. Liston was a very powerful puncher, but he did not have the extremely aggressive fast-starting characteristics George Foreman had. I think Frazier would work Liston's body, wear him down and win an 11th round KO.

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 28 Feb 2004, 14:24

What a matchup this would be!

Frazier would have all the tools to beat Sonny, except for one vital point, and this was his slow starts, and a slow start against liston is deadly.

liston's jab and huge reach advantage would tell, as the bombs hit joe, but joe was the toughest nut i have ever seen, and i think he would survive the first 5 or 6 rounds, but i feel he would take too much punishment too early and be pulled out of the fight by the referee at around 7.

ferroz · Post by **ferroz** » 28 Feb 2004, 20:41

i think Liston would win because he has power in both hands not just the left and because of his reach advantague

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 29 Feb 2004, 10:35

I think what's too often overlooked about Liston is that he was actually a very skilled and technically proficient boxer. He wasn't just a slugger or brawler as many seem to believe. And he wasn't slow either... he was actually a swift and fluid mover for such a big and powerful man.
I'd pick Frazier to overcome Rocky Marciano but against Liston he'd be fighting a bigger more powerful fighter who would also have the technical skills to dominate and break him apart with the jab.

knockout artist · Post by **knockout artist** » 01 Mar 2004, 04:51

Marciano Frazier wrote:I can't stand the way every time Frazier is matched up with a powerful puncher, nearly everyone involved immediately says "It would be like Foreman-Frazier!" It would not, especially in this case. Liston was a very powerful puncher, but he did not have the extremely aggressive fast-starting characteristics George Foreman had. I think Frazier would work Liston's body, wear him down and win an 11th round KO.

Frazier was a slow starter thought.

He only fought straight ahead. Suicide against a peak (1958) Liston

All about styles, Liston KO1.

Marciano Frazier · Post by **Marciano Frazier** » 01 Mar 2004, 12:09

knockout artist wrote:
Marciano Frazier wrote:I can't stand the way every time Frazier is matched up with a powerful puncher, nearly everyone involved immediately says "It would be like Foreman-Frazier!" It would not, especially in this case. Liston was a very powerful puncher, but he did not have the extremely aggressive fast-starting characteristics George Foreman had. I think Frazier would work Liston's body, wear him down and win an 11th round KO.
Frazier was a slow starter thought.

He only fought straight ahead. Suicide against a peak (1958) Liston

All about styles, Liston KO1.

Liston WAS NOT a fast starter either. Foreman was one of the quickest starters ever, with 14 first-round KO's and a huge load of 2nd-round KOs as well. Liston was not. In fact, he wasn't even a slugger, but more of a boxer who tried to set up for a bomb along the way. This fight would not be anything like Foreman-Frazier.

silkov · Post by **silkov** » 01 Mar 2004, 12:45

Go tell Patterson that Liston wasn't a fast starter!. Actually Marciano Frazier I agree in a way as Liston did not rely on a fast start as much as Foreman did early in his career... but Liston was a superior technician to Foreman and more a 'boxer' than the early Foreman... which is why I seen him breaking up Frazier in about 5 or 6 rounds. Frazier was a great fighter but couldn't fight going back... he'd be walking straight into Lisotns power shots. Liston had a great jab, very powerful and deceptively fast... as a matter of styles I see Liston as being too much for smokin Joe.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 01 Mar 2004, 13:46

silkov wrote:Go tell Patterson that Liston wasn't a fast starter!

Ever think that Liston was afraid to go too long with Patterson, so decided to try and end it early? Just a possibility.

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 01 Mar 2004, 13:51

Tantum wrote:
silkov wrote:Go tell Patterson that Liston wasn't a fast starter!
Ever think that Liston was afraid to go too long with Patterson, so decided to try and end it early? Just a possibility.

Liston was scared of No-man.

and certainly not Patterson.

Stamina had never been a problem for Liston before, and he knew that Floyd would be no match for him at all, and the two fights proved it.

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 01 Mar 2004, 14:35

Perhaps Liston's bully persona was in fact to hide his fears? Much like Tyson?

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 01 Mar 2004, 14:47

Tantum wrote:Perhaps Liston's bully persona was in fact to hide his fears? Much like Tyson?

Doubtful.

Sonny liston, bar his two ali 'fights' was always able to see his way through advertsity.

He boxed his way with a broken jaw against Marshall, and did what tyson never did and reversed a defeat.

I must ask you a question, as you seem to think Liston was fearful,

what was he afraid of?

bigynzing · Post by **bigynzing** » 02 Mar 2004, 10:12

Patterson was done even before he got in the ring...poor Floyd...i guess he just thought to much.

I think Liston would have won against Smokin in 7. The jabs the key.