Calzaghe vs Froch

Controversial · Post by **Controversial** » 11 May 2008, 07:25

I very much doubt this fight will ever happen with Calzaghe wanting one big pay day and big name before retiring BUT what do you think the outcome would be if they did fight?

I'm not a huge Froch fan to be honest, he sounds like David Brent with the things he comes out with, his confidence levels are unreal, he really thinks he is the greatest thing on two legs...."yeah I only had 50% of my power in that shot"..."I cant wait to dominte the division" etc...etc...

He seems too easy to hit but I can't make my mind up whether he fights like that because he feels so confident of winning? Maybe against Calzaghe he would be more careful? He certainly has natural power and is big and strong for the weight but he hasn't really been tested yet.

What do you think?

Finch · Post by **Finch** » 11 May 2008, 07:27

Froch's head is too big. Not as good as he thinks and no where near Calzaghe's class.

Gray-Fox · Post by **Gray-Fox** » 11 May 2008, 07:28

Is anyone actually interested in this fight? I don't know about anyone else, but neither fighter particularly excites me.

Max Molyneux · Post by **Max Molyneux** » 11 May 2008, 07:32

Froch can get away with his flat footed, low guard, head hunting style when It's a lower level fighter but Calzaghe will seriously beat him down.

Froch vs Lacy would make a good slugfest If Lacy has his confidence still.

sharpei_louis · Post by **sharpei_louis** » 11 May 2008, 08:39

Easy thread to answer:

never gonna happen, but in theory a wide UD for Calzaghe. No other possible outcome. Froch is never gonna hit world class operators with half-screwed long distance uppercuts, and has no kind of defence. Not sure about his chin but don't rate Calzaghe's power against a big SMW (and Froch is pretty big) so not a high chance of a KO.

I think it's in Froch's interests to avoid the Calzaghe fight... now Froch Kessler, I'd be very interested in that one, and would marginally favour Kessler at this moment cause I've not seen quite enough of Froch

black panther · Post by **black panther** » 11 May 2008, 08:59

I think people are quick to dismiss Froch. I'm not saying Calzaghe is the favourite, which he clearly is, and the obvious outcome would be a busy, boxing masterclass by Calzaghe to score a UD or possibly an accumulation stoppage. BUT its not as simple as that - styles make fights and Calzaghe only really looks special when fighters come to him ala Lacy. Froch likes to counter - even when coming forward he will draw leads then counter with his corkscrew uppercuts and left hook. To say Calzaghe, at this late stage in his career (45 fights) would dismiss Froch with no problems is unfair. This is the same Calzaghe that struggled with Starie, Thornberry, Reid, Bika and was dropped by Kabery Salem. Is Froch that much worse than any of the aforementioned fighters? I think not. Calzaghe is a great fighter - that goes without saying but he's not unbeatable and has many technical flaws eg punching technique, chin in the air when attacking. Finally the fighter that gave Calzaghe the most problems was Reid - Froch is capable of countering in a similar vein. I know Joe had problems leading up to that fight but its something to think about.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 11 May 2008, 09:16

I have a feeling that ppl know how to fight Joe now. The novelty is over. He almost got beaten last time in a parody of a superfight. Vs a big bloke like Froch, will Joe's wonky southpaw ways and little pecks mean too much?

Froch loves the right hand and the left hook. He's a good fighter with real power. I think if Joe moves back down to 168 he weakens himself. Legs weren't here vs Kessler.

Every good fighter tags Calzaghe hard. Froch hits harder than most of them. At very least he would definitely have Joe in some trouble.

Controversial · Post by **Controversial** » 11 May 2008, 09:57

black panther wrote:This is the same Calzaghe that struggled with Starie, Thornberry, Reid, Bika and was dropped by Kabery Salem. Is Froch that much worse than any of the aforementioned fighters? I think not. Calzaghe is a great fighter - that goes without saying but he's not unbeatable and has many technical flaws eg punching technique, chin in the air when attacking. Finally the fighter that gave Calzaghe the most problems was Reid - Froch is capable of countering in a similar vein. I know Joe had problems leading up to that fight but its something to think about.

Calzaghe is an 'occasion' fighter, he has looked very ordinary in the past against poor opponents but always raises his game for the bigger fights. Plus hand problems have been an issue for him in the past.

I think he would be 'up' for a fight with Froch as he wouldn't want to lose his unbeaten record to a big mouth.

Froch has the power to give any fighter trouble and JC has that awful habit of dropping his hands and exposing his chin, it only takes one punch as we all know.

Saying that I think JC would win on points. Froch too open and easy to hit in my opinion.

whiskey · Post by **whiskey** » 11 May 2008, 10:13

Froch works harder and punches harder than Hopkins and is as fit as they come.

junior-saeed · Post by **junior-saeed** » 11 May 2008, 10:15

I you seen the lil documentary on ITV last night befor the froch fight.. Calzaghe said if the money is rigt.. which i agree.. but i think that was a staged call lol.. didnt look really suprised when he got a call from froch

Gray-Fox · Post by **Gray-Fox** » 11 May 2008, 11:10

junior-saeed wrote:I you seen the lil documentary on ITV last night befor the froch fight.. Calzaghe said if the money is rigt.. which i agree.. but i think that was a staged call lol.. didnt look really suprised when he got a call from froch

No one saw his face...

EddieShredder · Post by **EddieShredder** » 11 May 2008, 11:16

There is no way Calzaghe fights Froch. Just no need for him to do so, he can earn millions fighting RJJ, Tarver, Pavlik etc.... Froch is just too much risk, too little reward. JC will only have a couple more fights, maybe even 1 if he lost to RJJ.... people talking of him fighting Froch are insane.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 11 May 2008, 11:17

EddieShredder wrote:There is no way Calzaghe fights Froch. Just no need for him to do so, he can earn millions fighting RJJ, Tarver, Pavlik etc.... Froch is just too much risk, too little reward. JC will only have a couple more fights, maybe even 1 if he lost to RJJ.... people talking of him fighting Froch are insane.

well, Froch has a right to ask for it as he is the mandatory? What would you think of Froch if he didn't demand the fight?

EddieShredder · Post by **EddieShredder** » 11 May 2008, 11:20

Autobarn wrote:
EddieShredder wrote:There is no way Calzaghe fights Froch. Just no need for him to do so, he can earn millions fighting RJJ, Tarver, Pavlik etc.... Froch is just too much risk, too little reward. JC will only have a couple more fights, maybe even 1 if he lost to RJJ.... people talking of him fighting Froch are insane.
well, Froch has a right to ask for it as he is the mandatory? What would you think of Froch if he didn't demand the fight?

No, absolutely. I'm talking about posters and froch fans to be honest, not Froch himself. To be honest though, you could tell when he was interviewed and in the feature in tenerife, he knew it wasn't really gonna happen - unlike a few years ago when he used to bang on about it.

Carbo · Post by **Carbo** » 11 May 2008, 15:41

I really don't know why everyone's so high on Froch. He's still not even fought at anywhere near world class, let alone been proven to the extent that would justify a fight against the 168 and 175lb champion.

Forch has had far too many struggles against sub-world class operators, and is far too open to make it at the very top level. Kessler beats him, no problem, and Joe might even knock him out.

whiskey · Post by **whiskey** » 11 May 2008, 15:53

Is that Joe '7 points wins from last 8 fights' Calzaghe ?

Who, apart from the ridiculous Mandredo stoppage aint ko'd anyone for 3+ years ?

I can buy a points win over Froch, but KO? by Joe?

No chance.

If anything the person who'd be ko'd in that fight would be Calzaghe.

He's been down more times than Elton on David Furnish.

Mitchell, Salem and Hopkins have all bounced Calzaghe off the canvas.

tony3 · Post by **tony3** » 11 May 2008, 16:07

G0mez wrote:Froch works harder and punches harder than Hopkins and is as fit as they come.

It's very difficult to tell. Froch appears very heavy-handed against second-rate opposition (although, interestingly, Calzaghe possessed a higher KO ratio at the same stage in his career) but his power has yet to be tested against someone with a world-class chin.

Another difference between Froch and B Hop is that Froch always aims for a clean, camera-friendly finish so wouldn't waste the match trying to spoil Calzaghe's boxing - unfortunately for Froch, I think that this is something that would work against him.

However Froch does seem exceptionally strong for such one possessed of such a wiry frame and would be, I'm sure, ridiculously determined to emerge victorious should this match ever be made.

For me the bottom line is this; the best Calzaghe that's ever lived, beats Froch hands down, but with age an affluence now catching up with the Italian Dragon, it's now veering ever closer to being a 50/50 affair.

junior-saeed · Post by **junior-saeed** » 11 May 2008, 16:13

Gray-Fox wrote:
junior-saeed wrote:I you seen the lil documentary on ITV last night befor the froch fight.. Calzaghe said if the money is rigt.. which i agree.. but i think that was a staged call lol.. didnt look really suprised when he got a call from froch
No one saw his face...

I ment sound

Honnestly i aint punchy

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 11 May 2008, 16:16

tony3 wrote:
G0mez wrote:Froch works harder and punches harder than Hopkins and is as fit as they come.
It's very difficult to tell. Froch appears very heavy-handed against second-rate opposition (although, interestingly, Calzaghe possessed a higher KO ratio at the same stage in his career) but his power has yet to be tested against someone with a world-class chin.

Another difference between Froch and B Hop is that Froch always aims for a clean, camera-friendly finish so wouldn't waste the match trying to spoil Calzaghe's boxing - unfortunately for Froch, I think that this is something that would work against him.

However Froch does seem exceptionally strong for such one possessed of such a wiry frame and would be, I'm sure, ridiculously determined to emerge victorious should this match ever be made.

For me the bottom line is this; the best Calzaghe that's ever lived, beats Froch hands down, but with age an affluence now catching up with the Italian Dragon, it's now veering ever closer to being a 50/50 affair.

If Calzaghe moves back downto 168 he's taking some serious shots and with age and weight making the reflexes and recovery mightn't be sufficient.

However, Joe moves down for one man, Pavlik.

Matt W · Post by **Matt W** » 11 May 2008, 16:29

Just don't see this fight happening.

Froch is a good fighter and will probably win a belt but I think he will fall short of the true elite. For me he's too open to the right hand and I don't think he'll be able to stop people at that level. For me Kessler does a real number on him with straight rights.

Would like to see him do well though as I like his attitude.

tony3 · Post by **tony3** » 11 May 2008, 16:48

Autobarn wrote:If Calzaghe moves back downto 168 he's taking some serious shots and with age and weight making the reflexes and recovery mightn't be sufficient.

However, Joe moves down for one man, Pavlik.

Whilst ironically, for all the reasons stated above, Pavlik would be the worst choice of opponent at SMW.

Calzaghe's starting to show some of the classical symptoms of deep decline; he looks almost skeletal when weighing in at 168, he looks a bit too 'soft' at 175 and is starting to cut with alarming regularity.

Personally I reckon one more megamoney fight - Jones, in Cardiff - then he should call it a day.

Controversial · Post by **Controversial** » 13 May 2008, 03:40

G0mez wrote:If anything the person who'd be ko'd in that fight would be Calzaghe.

He's been down more times than Elton on David Furnish.

Mitchell, Salem and Hopkins have all bounced Calzaghe off the canvas.

You cant seriously think Calzaghe has a poor chin? He was decked for the first time in his 36th fight and got up and ko'ed Mitchell in the same round. The knockdowns by Salem and Hopkins were very brief visits to the canvas, he jumped up both times and won the fights. Its not like he was seriously in trouble at any point.

twenty six · Post by **twenty six** » 13 May 2008, 04:21

Gomez has an agenda mate.
Fair play to him, he supports his man (Froch) all the way.

whiskey · Post by **whiskey** » 13 May 2008, 08:09

Salem had 12 ko's in 29 fights.

Mitchell had 18ko's in 30 fights (bit better than Salem i concede)

Hopkins... apart from light-middle Oscar which a few believe to be suspect, he's not stopped anyone for 6+ years.

Infact whilst discussing this - Joe has 7 points wins from his last 8 fights himself. His last stoppage was manfrodo which was a bit premature.

Since slippery Mathew Barney took a one-handed Froch 12 rounds, the Cobra has KO'd 7 on the trot. Some were pretty beaten up too (Brian Magee especially).

23 wins, 19ko's there is a bit of power there it must be agreed on.

If Froch had been rocked at any point at all i would say that there is always a chance Calzaghe would stop him.

But i think with his fragile hands and slapping punches with the wrist and thumb, i can't see Froch budged by the welshman.

Obviously all the above is my completely biased opinion - but there are a few facts we surely must concede.

I'd say the odds on for a Calzaghe points win must be a big favourite. But if a stoppage comes it will be Froch stopping Joe not vice versa i think.

Controversial · Post by **Controversial** » 13 May 2008, 09:12

G0mez wrote:Salem had 12 ko's in 29 fights.

Mitchell had 18ko's in 30 fights (bit better than Salem i concede)

Hopkins... apart from light-middle Oscar which a few believe to be suspect, he's not stopped anyone for 6+ years.

Infact whilst discussing this - Joe has 7 points wins from his last 8 fights himself. His last stoppage was manfrodo which was a bit premature.

Since slippery Mathew Barney took a one-handed Froch 12 rounds, the Cobra has KO'd 7 on the trot. Some were pretty beaten up too (Brian Magee especially).

23 wins, 19ko's there is a bit of power there it must be agreed on.

If Froch had been rocked at any point at all i would say that there is always a chance Calzaghe would stop him.

But i think with his fragile hands and slapping punches with the wrist and thumb, i can't see Froch budged by the welshman.

Obviously all the above is my completely biased opinion - but there are a few facts we surely must concede.

I'd say the odds on for a Calzaghe points win must be a big favourite. But if a stoppage comes it will be Froch stopping Joe not vice versa i think.

No one is saying Froch can't punch. The knockdowns Calzaghe had were very brief. In fact the Salem fight was so one sided, even with a knockdown against him, JC won by a huge margin. As stated before JC raises his fight to the opposition. He has looked very ordinary in the past.

Froch has yet to fight anyone of note. He gets hit very very easily and has also looked ordinary in past fights.

JC has well known fragile hands which is why he struggles to get full power into his punches, plus the fact he throws them fast and regularly stops him from getting maximum power into them all anyway.

JC by decision.