Jones out of Calzaghe negotitions?

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 14 May 2008, 12:22

I hope this is true. That Jones has decided to go for a 4th fight with Tarver.

So will it be Calzaghe-Pavlik?...If so I guess everyone has to keep quiet so as not to disrespect Lockett, at least until Pavlik beats Gary.

Or stay at 175 for Dawson or Johnson?

Can Calzaghe definitely move back down to 168? Pav's promoter Arum said it has to happen at 168, not 175.

Will we see Joe cash in with a good fight vs a guy in his prime?

Phenomenal-Nutrition · Post by **Phenomenal-Nutrition** » 14 May 2008, 12:27

Where did you read this?

Horse · Post by **Horse** » 14 May 2008, 12:32

Autobarn wrote:Or stay at 175 for Dawson or Johnson?

Why would he want to fight Johnson?

chesh · Post by **chesh** » 14 May 2008, 12:32

Jones is fighting only for the big money now and I can't imagine a fourth fight with Tarver would bring more $ than a Millennium Stadium fight with Calzaghe.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 14 May 2008, 12:55

Was in boxing news the other week that they were looking to fight each other again and the rumours are persisting.

That said, Kessler and Taylor were going to fight each other instead of Calzaghe and we all know what happened there.

(Only reson I mention Johnson is that if Joe stays at 175, would he want Dawson the young southpaw? Johnson can claim to beating Tarver and Johnson and some feel he beat Dawson...stretching it a bit I know, but if this fight was being promoted then ppl would say things like this)

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 14 May 2008, 12:58

chesh wrote:Jones is fighting only for the big money now and I can't imagine a fourth fight with Tarver would bring more $ than a Millennium Stadium fight with Calzaghe.

The Mil Stadium is fully booked when Joe wants to fight isn't it? Joe isn't a big draw in America - not quite.

chesh · Post by **chesh** » 14 May 2008, 13:03

Autobarn wrote:
chesh wrote:Jones is fighting only for the big money now and I can't imagine a fourth fight with Tarver would bring more $ than a Millennium Stadium fight with Calzaghe.
The Mil Stadium is fully booked when Joe wants to fight isn't it? Joe isn't a big draw in America - not quite.

Yes, I think you're right for the proposed November date. Joe v RJ in the US would not be so big. I'd also like to see a Johnson fight - could be the toughest one at 175 for Joe.

Poncey · Post by **Poncey** » 14 May 2008, 13:13

http://www.BS.com/?m=show&id=13970

Asterix · Post by **Asterix** » 14 May 2008, 15:09

Emerson Poncey Name Ghent wrote:http://www.BS.com/?m=show&id=13970

Woohoo! Way better for a boxing fan than Calzaghe vs Jones Jr.

chesh · Post by **chesh** » 14 May 2008, 15:30

At 168, Calzaghe will be drained and Pavlik will be stronger. Not a good match-up for Joe at this stage of his career. If he thinks it will be another Lacy-type fight, he'll be mistaken. Pavlik has more to his arsenal.

Asterix · Post by **Asterix** » 14 May 2008, 15:37

chesh wrote:At 168, Calzaghe will be drained and Pavlik will be stronger. Not a good match-up for Joe at this stage of his career. If he thinks it will be another Lacy-type fight, he'll be mistaken. Pavlik has more to his arsenal.

If it goes well for Calzaghe, it'll be more like his fight against Kessler. It will be a very hard night for Calzaghe. I hope he isn't past it (he didn't look right against Hopkins).

Rocky Balboa · Post by **Rocky Balboa** » 14 May 2008, 16:22

chesh wrote:At 168, Calzaghe will be drained and Pavlik will be stronger. Not a good match-up for Joe at this stage of his career. If he thinks it will be another Lacy-type fight, he'll be mistaken. Pavlik has more to his arsenal.

In terms of competitive bouts, if Joe were to choose Pavlik, then no one would be able to say Joe went after a fighter who was past it, had seen better days, etc.

If Joe were to defeat Pavlik, a young, ambitious & hungry fighter, then that would be far better for his legacy than a win over a Jones, Johnson or Tarver would be.

Personally, I don't think Joe would like to move back down to 168lbs - its no secret he finds it very difficult getting to the weight.

As a massive boxing fan, my choice would be Pavlik. We shall see.....

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 14 May 2008, 18:03

chesh wrote:At 168, Calzaghe will be drained and Pavlik will be stronger. Not a good match-up for Joe at this stage of his career. If he thinks it will be another Lacy-type fight, he'll be mistaken. Pavlik has more to his arsenal.

Calzaghe wouldn't be drained, he didn't bulk up to 175, he just didn't boil down to 168.

Pavlik has a lot of heart, is brave, can bang, and is aggressive, but he's not hard to hit, and isn't exactly bloody nijinksy.

Calzaghe would land a hell of a lot of shots on Pavlik, and unlike Taylor, he wouldn't run out of gas after a few rounds, or have to fiddle and fart to maintain his stamina.

I think Pavlik would give it a go, but he's not good enough to beat Joe by some stretch.

stujones · Post by **stujones** » 14 May 2008, 18:06

I want to see Calzaghe vs Bute.

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 14 May 2008, 18:20

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
chesh wrote:At 168, Calzaghe will be drained and Pavlik will be stronger. Not a good match-up for Joe at this stage of his career. If he thinks it will be another Lacy-type fight, he'll be mistaken. Pavlik has more to his arsenal.
Calzaghe wouldn't be drained, he didn't bulk up to 175, he just didn't boil down to 168.

Pavlik has a lot of heart, is brave, can bang, and is aggressive, but he's not hard to hit, and isn't exactly bloody nijinksy.

Calzaghe would land a hell of a lot of shots on Pavlik, and unlike Taylor, he wouldn't run out of gas after a few rounds, or have to fiddle and fart to maintain his stamina.

I think Pavlik would give it a go, but he's not good enough to beat Joe by some stretch.

his legs looked bad vs Kessler. Surely a year later and coming down after light heavy it will be harder to campaign at 168. Calzaghe-Kessler just had the look of a "last time at the weight" to me.

Is it really worth moving down for Pavlik is he's not yet the superstar of world boxing that he's expected to become?

It's Calzaghe who should be the superstar because he's the senior champion yet ticket sales weren't great for the Hopkins fight among American viewers. He's more of a curio over there than anything. Ppl who saw him for the first time v Hopkins will think he's a bit agricultural, a bit unschooled even if that's not true.

Then again, I'd rather see Joe move down because frankly I thought he looked fleshy, horrible and sluggish at 175. He could probably do with fighting an aggresor like Pavlik for his style to shine.

observer1 · Post by **observer1** » 14 May 2008, 18:26

he's been at 168 for 10 years, i doubt it would too much problem for 1 more fight.

i'd think Pavlik would be the problem

Autobarn · Post by **Autobarn** » 14 May 2008, 18:32

observer1 wrote:he's been at 168 for 10 years, i doubt it would too much problem for 1 more fight.

i'd think Pavlik would be the problem

"just one more" - how many times has that got someone in trouble...

Maelstrom · Post by **Maelstrom** » 14 May 2008, 20:11

From what I can remember, Calzaghe really struggled to make 168 for loads of his fights... He was talking about moving up at least 5 years ago.

Once you have gone up, going back down is always tricky. Loads of fighters have shown us that. I wouldn't want to see him at 168.

Plus, if he does go down to 168, queue the Froch release....

Lickszz · Post by **Lickszz** » 15 May 2008, 03:20

[quote="Horse"][quote="Autobarn"]Or stay at 175 for Dawson or Johnson?[/quote]Why would he want to fight Johnson?[/quote]

I don't think he would. Johnson would probably beat him. He didn't fancy Johnson last time and pulled out.

don't call it a comeback · Post by **don't call it a comeback** » 15 May 2008, 04:03

Getting to 168 for one more fight will not be a problem for Joe - he was well short of light heavy for the Hopkins fight and the extra few pounds did not suit him or help him.

nickd · Post by **nickd** » 15 May 2008, 05:28

Was it the weight or old father time though? He doesn't really have a style that will lend well once he starts slowing down which is what I think has happened. He looked like he was slowing slightly against Kessler, then he looked sloppy as hell against Hopkins (granted that was down to Hopkins' style a little but still). It's possible he's on the downslide. He is 36 after all and relies on speed and timing, once that goes he is fooked.

Tykemania · Post by **Tykemania** » 15 May 2008, 06:39

nickd wrote:Was it the weight or old father time though? He doesn't really have a style that will lend well once he starts slowing down which is what I think has happened. He looked like he was slowing slightly against Kessler, then he looked sloppy as hell against Hopkins (granted that was down to Hopkins' style a little but still). It's possible he's on the downslide. He is 36 after all and relies on speed and timing, once that goes he is fooked.

I think there is a limited amount of evidence that he may be on the downslope now, but nothing conclusive - he didn't hold Kessler's shots as well as he would have three or four years back, but he was never down despite the Dane landing cleanly on a fair few occasions. Likewise, whilst he went down to Hopkins in round one, he was never in danger of being stopped and for me controlled the remainder of the fight.

I don't think he'll go back down to 168 - it might be a diet too far for him. Besides which, the only fights there for him are high on the risk/reward register (Pavlik, Froch) compared to bigger paydays again Jones and Tarver.

Shirow · Post by **Shirow** » 15 May 2008, 07:25

Maelstrom wrote:From what I can remember, Calzaghe really struggled to make 168 for loads of his fights... He was talking about moving up at least 5 years ago.

Once you have gone up, going back down is always tricky. Loads of fighters have shown us that. I wouldn't want to see him at 168.

Plus, if he does go down to 168, queue the Froch release....

The difference with Calzaghe going up is that he didn't build himself up to the weight with weights as is the norm. He just didn't starve/dehydrate 5lbs off.

Mackie Shilstone engineered Hopkins up to LH the same weigh he did Jones Jr to HW. Hopkins would be ruined by droppping back to MW but Calzaghe will just have to go through the unappealing process he's done so many times before which he will the the payday is there.

Phenomenal-Nutrition · Post by **Phenomenal-Nutrition** » 15 May 2008, 08:08

Pavlik is a tough fight, in his prime, sharp straight shots, big hitter, strong, tall, rangy, powerful. The 1-2 down the line may seem predictable but straight shots like that may get to Calazage. I thought Kessler did well and then lost heart, Pavlik won't imo.

don't call it a comeback · Post by **don't call it a comeback** » 15 May 2008, 09:33

nickd wrote:Was it the weight or old father time though? He doesn't really have a style that will lend well once he starts slowing down which is what I think has happened. He looked like he was slowing slightly against Kessler, then he looked sloppy as hell against Hopkins (granted that was down to Hopkins' style a little but still). It's possible he's on the downslide. He is 36 after all and relies on speed and timing, once that goes he is fooked.

He's ageing no doubt but there's no signs of rapid decline. But everything is slowing a bit and getting shallower. Thats why I think home advantage is crucial - it will give him that extra bit of zip as he starts to tire. But money will probably dictate stateside and that will be a tougher gig.

Jones out of Calzaghe negotitions?

Jones out of Calzaghe negotitions?

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