Classic American West Coast Boxing

[kikibalt]

Mando and Sylvia Ramos
I shot this picture on April 12, 08, at the father and son luncheon.

[kikibalt]

Willie Pep vs Chalky Wright.II
29 September 1944, Madison Square Garden

I love Willie Pep, although I never had a chance to see him live. He was amazing. The closest thing I saw in L.A. was little Albert Davila. I really can't compare the two, but "Tweedy" was a thing of beauty to watch perform, even in the Jr. Golden Gloves, where he gave boxing lessons to those who stepped inside the ropes with him. Frank, I know you were responsible for matching Davila with most of his amateur opposition in L.A. Any special memories?

-Ricardo

Rick, I'll get back to you on this, right now my son James and I are going to watch Ramos vs Ramos.

[bennie]

Sugar Ray Robinson vs Carl "Bobo" Olson
Wrigley Field, Los Angeles, Ca.

What a great shot, almost like a work of art, except it's real!
Robinson just had Bobo's number.

[bennie]

Sugar Ray Robinson vs Paul Pender
Boston, 23 January 1960

Now The Sugar Man is old and not looking so great yet he STILL held Pender to a split decision in Boston. Pender went on to have three bruising fights with our own Bashing, Crashing, Dashing, Smashing one, Terry Downes (winning two).
Pender is an overlooked fighter. He retired as world champ and stuck to it. Takes a lot of class.

[bennie]

Jerry Quarry vs Jimmy Ellis

Ali's sparring partner winning the tournament to find a successor to Ali.
Oh, the irony.

[bennie]

Ezzard Charles vs Lee Oma
12 November 1951

Ezzard doing a spot of fast-bowling.
The Cincinnati Cobra is one of the greats, in my opinion (at boxing ).

[bennie]

¨Now he doesn´t come home at night. ¨
Jibaro´s wife was breast feeding the baby with a blanket draped over her front.
¨Can´t you talk to hi^m?*¨
I remember when he was dating her. She was shy and pretty and fell for him hard. Her father was training him and also was on the managing end.
¨I´ll try,but what has your father said? ¨
¨He´s dying over this. He´s like a son to him. ¨
On the way up Jibaro was in the gym everyday. His wife announced that she was pregnant and everything seemed bright ahead . Jibaro won the title at the Auditorium in Tijuana and became the toast of the town. A good looking kid. Tall and dark. Full head of hair and a smile and personality that was irresistable. But almost immediately you could feel something going on. He celebrated all night and let his wife and father in law go back home without him. I looked at Jibaro´s wifw. She had gained weight from having the baby and the stress of it all was on her face. There was nothing romantic about the situation. It was gone.
¨You know,¨I said,¨He only listens to people that give him the wrong advice.¨
¨If he would only come home. I know if he sees the baby things will get better.¨
The baby was finished eating and was asleep. She wrapped the baby in the blanket and was rocking him slowly.
¨My brother wants to kill him. I´m worried.¨
¨Don´t believe that. Your brother wouldn´t want to leave his nephew without a father.¨
¨He told me that he would make a better father.¨
¨I´ll talk to Jibaro when he comes to the gym. I promise.¨
¨After he won the title we have less money than before.¨
Jibaro´s wife began to cry. Her mother came into the room and took the baby fom the mother´s arms.
¨Con permiso,¨she said. She took the baby,who was asleep into the living room.
^I thought after winning the championship we would have no more worries.¨
Jibaro´s wife stopped crying. It was like she couldn´t cry anymore.
¨It often happens that way,^
¨What way do you mean?¨she asked wiping her face.
¨You can have what seems like everything and have nothing at all.¨
¨I don´t understand still,^she said. She got up and started to walk to the living room.
¨Well,¨I said,¨If he comes to the gym I´ll try to talk to him tomorrow.
¨

Raul Perez made a few so-so defences of his world bantamweight title, then gave a shocking display against Greg "The Flea" Richardson and lost the belt.
This explains why.
Perez moved up in weight but was never the same.

[bennie]

Tony DeMarco vs Carmen Basilio
World Welterweight Championship
War Memorial Auditorium, Syracuse, New York
10 June 1955

Jesus! Not for the faint-hearted.

[dagosd2000]

Pedro
By now you´ve probably talked to Mando.I know you´ve given him a good abrazo. The way I figure whoever makes those decisions,(saints,angels,apostles)gave Mando a pass. I would have liked to have been there with you guys when Mando arrived. I bet Sal Sanchez is tellin´him that that if he´d stuck around and stayed in shape they could have made a lot of dough fightin´each other. I´m sure Mando would have responded by giving him the business on drinkin´and driven´don´t mix.They would have sold out the Forum. I can imagine all the celebrating there would have been after those two fought each other.

Pedro,it´s OK now to buy Mando a drink or two. It ain´t gonna´hurt him no more where you guys are at. Anyways with all you ex pugs sittin´around ,a few shots of Cuervo should bring out some good stories. I bet Vicente has couple worth tellin´. Too bad you can´t post them on the BoxRec .

Sometimes being down here isn´t what it´s cracked up to be. But I´ve got responsibilities to take care of. But I´d sure like to eavesdrop on you guys when you start talkin´boxing. That must be heaven

[kikibalt]

[kikibalt]

Sugar Ray Robinson vs Carmen Basilio
Chicago...1958

[kikibalt]

Sugar Ray Robinson vs Carmen Basilio
Yankee Stadium...The Bronx, New York
1957

[kikibalt]

Sugar Ray Robinson, New Middleweight Champion, Leaving Stadium after Defeating Carmen Basilio
Chicago...1958

[bennie]

Mando and Sylvia Ramos
I shot this picture on April 12, 08, at the father and son luncheon.

Thanks for all the shots of Mando on this thread, Frankie. They mean so much now.

[bennie]

Sugar Ray Robinson, New Middleweight Champion, Leaving Stadium after Defeating Carmen Basilio
Chicago...1958

Robinson was so good in those rematches, much like Napoles. Personally, I think The Sugar Man would have found a way to beat Marvin Hagler. Marvin was a great, great middleweight but not a great "thinking" fighter. He was too mechanical and focussed for that. I remember against Duran he would rush out at the bell and throw a long right from the orthodox stance. Duran could see it coming and countered with a hard right uppercut to the body. Bizarrely, and perhaps revealingly, Hagler continued to do exactly the same thing at the start of almost every round, even though he NEVER landed.

[bennie]

Jerry Quarry vs Jimmy Ellis

As the boxing world knows, Jerrry Quarry had some great wins, but also some losses that didn't make sense. This was one of them, and Jerry's manager Johnny Flores was never more upset than after Jerry embarrassed himself against an opponet he was favored to beat, and should have. Jerry would have never, under any cuircumstances, beaten Ali or Frazier, however, Ellis was made to order for him. This was the final of an eight-man heavyweight elimination to find a successor to Muhammed Ali for the WBA Heavyweight title (after Ali was stripped of the title). In the eliminations, Quarry had decsioned Floyd Patterson, upset Thad Spencer with a KO win, and finally matched with Ali's former sparring partner for the title. He was 23-years-old, stubbornly decided to attempt out boxing a guy by fighting his opponents fight, and then after the losing decision was announced, grabbed the mike from the ring announcer and announced to the world, "I'm retiring from boxing!" I have always been a fan of Jerry's, but I also know the flip side of the best white heavyweight to step into a ring since Rocky Marciano. Jerry always found a way to lose the important fights. Jerry's problem wasn't his punching power, boxing ability, ruggedness or popularity . . . it was his head. Jerry Quarry was a "head case".

R.I.P Jerry, you gave your fans a lot of good times, and a lot of headaches too.

-Rick

You know, Rick, they say the same of Andrew Golota, the Polish nutter who cannot handle the pressure of the really big fights - the make or break ones - and even throws away victory if he is winning those fights. I put it down to esteem. Quarry's personal bar was raised to an exceptionally high level - the kind of level that allowed him to thump Spencer, Patterson, Foster, Lyle and Shavers - but not to a level that allowed him to thump former middleweight Ellis for the world heavyweight title. Jerry was comfortable in his role of division threat, of division hard luck guy. He didn't want to stray out of that comfort zone.

[kikibalt]

Sugar Ray Robinson vs Fritzie Zivic
16 January 1942

[Rick Farris]

Ezzard Charles vs Lee Oma
12 November 1951

Ezzard doing a spot of fast-bowling.
The Cincinnati Cobra is one of the greats, in my opinion (at boxing ).

I agree Bennie. I Wonder how great boxing fans of today would rate Roy Jones Jr. had he fought guys like Charles, Maxim, Young Firpo, Maxie Rosenbloom, Archie Moore, Tiger Jack Fox, etc. I'm pretty sure RJ would have found another sport to compete in. His run & gun tactics would have never been tolerated in another era and he'd have discovered that a true boxer would have little difficulty in setting a deadly trap for the modern era speedster. It goes back to that old saying by Joe Louis, "You can run, but you can't hide."

-Rick

[dagosd2000]

¨Now he doesn´t come home at night. ¨
Jibaro´s wife was breast feeding the baby with a blanket draped over her front.
¨Can´t you talk to hi^m?*¨
I remember when he was dating her. She was shy and pretty and fell for him hard. Her father was training him and also was on the managing end.
¨I´ll try,but what has your father said? ¨
¨He´s dying over this. He´s like a son to him. ¨
On the way up Jibaro was in the gym everyday. His wife announced that she was pregnant and everything seemed bright ahead . Jibaro won the title at the Auditorium in Tijuana and became the toast of the town. A good looking kid. Tall and dark. Full head of hair and a smile and personality that was irresistable. But almost immediately you could feel something going on. He celebrated all night and let his wife and father in law go back home without him. I looked at Jibaro´s wifw. She had gained weight from having the baby and the stress of it all was on her face. There was nothing romantic about the situation. It was gone.
¨You know,¨I said,¨He only listens to people that give him the wrong advice.¨
¨If he would only come home. I know if he sees the baby things will get better.¨
The baby was finished eating and was asleep. She wrapped the baby in the blanket and was rocking him slowly.
¨My brother wants to kill him. I´m worried.¨
¨Don´t believe that. Your brother wouldn´t want to leave his nephew without a father.¨
¨He told me that he would make a better father.¨
¨I´ll talk to Jibaro when he comes to the gym. I promise.¨
¨After he won the title we have less money than before.¨
Jibaro´s wife began to cry. Her mother came into the room and took the baby fom the mother´s arms.
¨Con permiso,¨she said. She took the baby,who was asleep into the living room.
^I thought after winning the championship we would have no more worries.¨
Jibaro´s wife stopped crying. It was like she couldn´t cry anymore.
¨It often happens that way,^
¨What way do you mean?¨she asked wiping her face.
¨You can have what seems like everything and have nothing at all.¨
¨I don´t understand still,^she said. She got up and started to walk to the living room.
¨Well,¨I said,¨If he comes to the gym I´ll try to talk to him tomorrow.
¨

Raul Perez made a few so-so defences of his world bantamweight title, then gave a shocking display against Greg "The Flea" Richardson and lost the belt.
This explains why.
Perez moved up in weight but was never the same.

Bennie
After Jibaro won the title it all went to his head. I knew the family(his father in law who was his trainer and I was coaching his brother in law in football in Tj).Jibaro Perex was like a lot of young Mexican fighters who couldn´t deal with prosperity. Him and Mando had the same compulsions when it came to breaking training. With Jibaro it was just a matter of time before he´d self destruct.

[dagosd2000]

Sugar Ray Robinson vs Carl "Bobo" Olson
Wrigley Field, Los Angeles, Ca.

Just before he went into the Marines in World War II my father was working at Meadowmoor Dairy in Chicago. They were trying to get something going with Ray Robinson like they did with Joe Louis--a soft drink with Sugar´s name on it. Robinson came out of a meeting at the dairy´s offices in Chicago and was standing on the side walk waiting for a cab. Some mob guy( I forget the name) was standing next to him unknowing to Robinson. A car pulls up to where they´re standing. Two guys jump out of the car with shotguns and let this guy have it. Robinson never went back to the dairy to make any deals on putting his name on a soft drink.

Years later I was with my father at a fight in San Diego. Sugar Ray is there at ringside. My father goes up to Robinson ,puts his arm around him,and asks him if he remembered that ¨hit ¨years ago in front of the dairy. Robinson knew my father from Chicago and remembered the ¨hit ¨.Robinson told my dad that he had a feeling the ¨hit ¨was supposed to be made on him. My father tried to convince him otherwise ,but Sugar Ray still thought that he was the ¨mark¨¨ that day.

[dagosd2000]

Willie Pep vs Chalky Wright.II
29 September 1944, Madison Square Garden

I love Willie Pep, although I never had a chance to see him live. He was amazing. The closest thing I saw in L.A. was little Albert Davila. I really can't compare the two, but "Tweedy" was a thing of beauty to watch perform, even in the Jr. Golden Gloves, where he gave boxing lessons to those who stepped inside the ropes with him. Frank, I know you were responsible for matching Davila with most of his amateur opposition in L.A. Any special memories?

-Ricardo

Rick, I'll get back to you on this, right now my son James and I are going to watch Ramos vs Ramos.

Frank
I saw that fight live. I´ve posted this before,but I might rank this fight( Ramos vs. Ramos) as the best example of pure boxing skills I´ve ever seen. Mando was fast and sharp that night. What do you think of this fight?

[kikibalt]

Frank
I saw that fight live. I´ve posted this before,but I might rank this fight( Ramos vs. Ramos) as the best example of pure boxing skills I´ve ever seen. Mando was fast and sharp that night. What do you think of this fight?

diego,

My wife and I were ringside for the R-V-R fight, My son James had never seen the fight or any Mando R. fight for that matter, I have it on DVD, so last night, him and I sat down to watch the fight, it was great, great fight, Mando looked like the second coming of Enrique Bolanos, Bolanos was just a little slicker then Mando, We also seen the Bolanos vs Ike Williams II fight last night, James just loved the way Bolanos fought, The R & R fight had to be one of the best fights, I seen live.

[thomconn]

Pug
My father also told me the syndicate asked Ray Robinson to carry Charlie Fusari in their title match in Jersey City. I looked at the tape of that fight a few times. It did look like Robinson could take him out whenever he wanted,but it went 15.

I haven't seen the tape of the fight but Teddy Brenner in "Only the Ring Was Square" said that Robinson carried Fusari. This, supposedly, was the fight that resulted in Robinson being called "the greatest carrier since Mother Dionne." Brenner says that Fusari thought he was in a real fight but that his corner knew the deal. After several rounds, Fusari is said to have returned to his corner saying that he had Robinson "figured out" and would knock him out the next round. Knowing that Robinson would not let the fight go the distance if Fusari tried to hurt him, Fusari's cornermen nervously talked him out of trying to knock out Robinson--which would have resulted in Fusari being knocked out instead.

[Rick Farris]

Mando and Sylvia Ramos
I shot this picture on April 12, 08, at the father and son luncheon.

When I spoke with Sylvia Ramos a couple days back, she told me that after Mando gave up alcohol and drugs, more than twenty-five years ago, he became a compulsive eater. Hence the former lightweight champ's weight gain. "Mando's appetite was ravenous", she daid, "I did my best to put a limit on his eating, but when Mando started to eat, he'd just keep eating. Although he was drug & alcohol free, he had cross-addicted to food." Although over-eating is more socially acceptable than drug addiction & alcoholism, the results can be equally fatal. Not long after Mando topped 200 pounds, he came down with diabetes, further complicating his health issues. The extra weight also put more stress on an already damaged spine.

-Rick Farris

[Expug]

It would seem that fighters just have always been balls to the wall, go for it kinds of people. Not really moderate in certain endeavors.
Maybe not all of them but many.
When they do something, they do it with gusto. All the way.
I dont know, maybe I dont articulate it so well, but I think you guys know what I mean.