Classic American West Coast Boxing

[bennie]

Guys , I know Mando and Jackie McCoy worked as longshoremen .
How is that trade doing overall there?
From the pictures, it looks like the longshoremens hall is good size.
Is it all union?Is it a large union?
Do these guys work regular?

Pug
Like I was sayin' earlier just on observation,it looked real slow. I didn't see a big crane working and it was a Friday afternoon. The Union building had a bunch of guys outside(who knows how many inside)waiting to get a call. Wilmington looked like one of those towns that the freeway bypassed. I was looking for the Bates Motel. Pretty gloomy.

"I was looking for the Bates Motel."

[bennie]

Vicki LaMotta

Birth: Jan. 23, 1930
Death: Jan. 25, 2005

Subject of the film "Raging Bull" and Cosmetic Initiator. Born Beverly "Vicki" Thailer in the Bronx, New York. She met boxer husband Jake LaMotta at a community pool and they married while she was still a teenager. Their turbulent often abusive relationship was depicted in the 1980 Martin Scorsese film "Raging Bull". Vicki was potrayed by then 17-year old Actress Cathy Moriarty and earned her an Academy Award nomination for Best Supporting Actress. Over the years the film has been ranked by critics as one of the Greatest Films In History. The film generated great publicity for Vicki who posed for Playboy in November 1981 and proved that she was still a beauty at age 51. Four years later came a self-named successful cosmetics company that marketed what she called "the 60-second facelift." She moved back to New York City from North Miami Beach, where she had lived with her second husband Tony Foster, to lend her name to a cosmetics line and make commercials and personal appearances on local television and at fight arenas. In 1992, after divorcing from Foster she returned to South Florida, eventually moving into Port de Mer, where she lived with two cats. And to the end she remained friends with her first ex-husband Jake LaMotta. LaMotta, 83, who was in Manhattan at a 25th anniversary screening of Raging Bull, mentioned her death to The New York Times. "I spoke to her a few months ago," he said. "I used to speak to her a lot, but as time went by we would only speak on special occasions. But we made up a long time ago." Vicki died after spending a month at a hospital where she was recovering from open-heart surgery.

What a beautuiful woman. Her layout in Playboy Magazine, taken in her 50's, was stunning. She was a natural beauty, by any standard, and a champ like LaMotta deserved nothing less.

-Rick

Rick
I mentioned this once before. Vicky LaMotta and Edna Robinson were on a talk show with Bonecrusher Smith's young wife. This must have been around 25 years ago. Go figure this. We know that at times when Sugar and Jake would be upset with their wives,the girls became sparring partners. A busted lip. A black eye.Some loose teeth. After years of putting up with philandering and getting knocked around they left.

Well on this show Vicky and Edna are runnin' this by Mrs. Bonecrusher. A very pretty and modest girl. If memory serves me,I think The Bonecrusher graduated from college. He might have met his wife there. Anyway Mrs. Bonecrusher is getting nervous from listening to these two recall their former husbands chaotic treatment of them.. Edna and Vicky are getting more and more turned on as they tell of their husbands abuses.
"When being married to a fighter,they'll let you know who's boss,"said Vicky.
"That's right. And if you make a fuss,you'll get belted a good one,"said Edna full of excitement.
"Yes," a energized Vicky said. "I remember Jake letting me have it if I got him upset."
By this time the young bride is almost in tears.
"Oh don't worry honey,"said Edna. "That won't happen to you."
By now both Vicky and Edna had come down to Earth to see that they had upset the girl.

The point to all of this is that women who go for fighters,at least some of them,are turned on by the violence. Even if sometimes if it's at their expense. Fighting turns them on. It turns me on to think that it turns them on.

Amen.

Yeah, I remember hearing about this. Funny stuff. Richard Burton and Liz Taylor used to enjoy arguing as a prelude to sex.

[Rick Farris]

Vicki LaMotta

Birth: Jan. 23, 1930
Death: Jan. 25, 2005

Subject of the film "Raging Bull" and Cosmetic Initiator. Born Beverly "Vicki" Thailer in the Bronx, New York. She met boxer husband Jake LaMotta at a community pool and they married while she was still a teenager. Their turbulent often abusive relationship was depicted in the 1980 Martin Scorsese film "Raging Bull". Vicki was potrayed by then 17-year old Actress Cathy Moriarty and earned her an Academy Award nomination for Best Supporting Actress. Over the years the film has been ranked by critics as one of the Greatest Films In History. The film generated great publicity for Vicki who posed for Playboy in November 1981 and proved that she was still a beauty at age 51. Four years later came a self-named successful cosmetics company that marketed what she called "the 60-second facelift." She moved back to New York City from North Miami Beach, where she had lived with her second husband Tony Foster, to lend her name to a cosmetics line and make commercials and personal appearances on local television and at fight arenas. In 1992, after divorcing from Foster she returned to South Florida, eventually moving into Port de Mer, where she lived with two cats. And to the end she remained friends with her first ex-husband Jake LaMotta. LaMotta, 83, who was in Manhattan at a 25th anniversary screening of Raging Bull, mentioned her death to The New York Times. "I spoke to her a few months ago," he said. "I used to speak to her a lot, but as time went by we would only speak on special occasions. But we made up a long time ago." Vicki died after spending a month at a hospital where she was recovering from open-heart surgery.

What a beautuiful woman. Her layout in Playboy Magazine, taken in her 50's, was stunning. She was a natural beauty, by any standard, and a champ like LaMotta deserved nothing less.

-Rick

Rick
I mentioned this once before. Vicky LaMotta and Edna Robinson were on a talk show with Bonecrusher Smith's young wife. This must have been around 25 years ago. Go figure this. We know that at times when Sugar and Jake would be upset with their wives,the girls became sparring partners. A busted lip. A black eye.Some loose teeth. After years of putting up with philandering and getting knocked around they left.

Well on this show Vicky and Edna are runnin' this by Mrs. Bonecrusher. A very pretty and modest girl. If memory serves me,I think The Bonecrusher graduated from college. He might have met his wife there. Anyway Mrs. Bonecrusher is getting nervous from listening to these two recall their former husbands chaotic treatment of them.. Edna and Vicky are getting more and more turned on as they tell of their husbands abuses.
"When being married to a fighter,they'll let you know who's boss,"said Vicky.
"That's right. And if you make a fuss,you'll get belted a good one,"said Edna full of excitement.
"Yes," a energized Vicky said. "I remember Jake letting me have it if I got him upset."
By this time the young bride is almost in tears.
"Oh don't worry honey,"said Edna. "That won't happen to you."
By now both Vicky and Edna had come down to Earth to see that they had upset the girl.

The point to all of this is that women who go for fighters,at least some of them,are turned on by the violence. Even if sometimes if it's at their expense. Fighting turns them on. It turns me on to think that it turns them on.

Amen.

Dagos . . . Your post brings to mind a story that came out of Joe Louis' divorce from wife actress Marva Trotter. When the Brown Bomber Bomber was up on the witness stand, the Judge asked him, "Is it true Mr. Louis, that you punched your wife?" Louis looked at the judge and said, "Your honor, don't all couples fight?"

-Rick

[Rick Farris]

Domestic Violence . . .

It seems odd to me that today children our punished severly if they get into a school yard brawl. There was a time a boy was encouraged to stand up against a bully and often taught to punch to protect himself from a lot of pain and embarrassment. We all know what a bully does when confronted with a challenge, they disappear, and the problem is usually solved. A lesson taught that helps both the bully and the vitim. Today, regardless of who starts a fight, both kids are severly punished, including a psych evaluation, etc. If a couple argues too loud (even with no actual physical contact or threat) and the police are called, they will arrest both (definitly the man) and after bailing out, they will be assigned to costly "anger management" classes. I'm sure glad society has finally come up with a way to eliminate violence in the world, isn't it great to live in this peaceful world. Things such as this prevent murder, rape and world wars. :TU

-Rick

[bennie]

The actress who played Vicki LaMotta must have been a fight fan, as she was sitting there, with other dignitaries, at the Honeyghan-Curry fight in Atlantic City in 1986. She is obviously a striking lady but, sadly, the only thing I remember about her countenance is a rather miserable look. Indeed, she brought new meaning to the word 'glum'. Maybe she was a Curry fan.

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[dagosd2000]

Frank
Like many of the regulars on the West Coast thread,I think the programs that you post on this site are the best snapshots that the fan can learn how the "feel" was like in the '50's.Not only about boxing,but how America had a honest toughness . I know there are a lot of books about the history of boxing. Anthologies,"ghost written" autobiographies. Biographies as well. But the best stuff in my book that tells the story of boxing is reading the old columns in the papers. The old Ring Magazines and The Sporting News are good examples.Your old fight programs are classics .They have a swagger.a rough style. Big and loud. Man's reading.

I know many American writers honed their teeth reading about boxing in the papers and the sports journals of the period.The old Ring Magazines with writers like Nat Fleischer and Sam Taub(Up And Down Old Broadway).Fighters and referess would have a column. I remember reading stuff by Tony Zale and Ruby Goldstein. They brought their "day" with them when they told a story. I know Hemingway,Lardner,Jack London,Damon Runyan,and O'Henry formed a lot af their style of writing from reading the old sports writers. It was an era of boxing,baseball,and horse racing. Those old reporters and announcers were THE BEST. We get a taste of that again when you post those old boxing programs.

Larry Merrchant,Howard,Jim Lampley,you guys could have learned how to write and tell a story about the Sweet Science by learning from the old timers. Instead you really wanted to talk about yourselves.

[kikibalt]

Frank
Like many of the regulars on the West Coast thread,I think the programs that you post on this site are the best snapshots that the fan can learn how the "feel" was like in the '50's.Not only about boxing,but how America had a honest toughness . I know there are a lot of books about the history of boxing. Anthologies,"ghost written" autobiographies. Biographies as well. But the best stuff in my book that tells the story of boxing is reading the old columns in the papers. The old Ring Magazines and The Sporting News are good examples.Your old fight programs are classics .They have a swagger.a rough style. Big and loud. Man's reading.

I know many American writers honed their teeth reading about boxing in the papers and the sports journals of the period.The old Ring Magazines with writers like Nat Fleischer and Sam Taub(Up And Down Old Broadway).Fighters and referess would have a column. I remember reading stuff by Tony Zale and Ruby Goldstein. They brought their "day" with them when they told a story. I know Hemingway,Lardner,Jack London,and O'Henry formed a lot af their style of writing from reading the old sports writers. It was an era of boxing,baseball,and horse racing. Those old reporters and announcers were THE BEST. We get a taste of that again when you post those old boxing programs.

Larry Merrchant,Howard,Jim Lampley,you guys could have learned how to write and tell a story about the Sweet Science by learning from the old timers. Instead you really wanted to talk about yourselves.

diego,

These Knockout programs tell the whole story about the boxing scene in L.A. in the 1940s-50s, a time when there was live boxing 6 days a week, as a young kid in the mid-late 40s, if my dad or uncles coundn't take me to the fights, my friends and I would ride our bikes to the fight, mostly the Olympic because it was closer, sometimes we would ride to Hollywood, now here's the good part, our bikes were stolen more then once, how were we suppose to get back home? well we would steal somebody else's bikes, what else could we do?......

[Expug]

Dagos is right.
These old programs are great.
Man, looking at the tale of the tape for Bolanos, the guys forearms measured 14 and a half.
Bigger than his biceps.
He must have been like Popeye.
Helluva puncher I bet.

[kikibalt]

Dagos is right.
These old programs are great.
Man, looking at the tale of the tape for Bolanos, the guys forearms measured 14 and a half.
Bigger than his biceps.
He must have been like Popeye.
Helluva puncher I bet.

Pug,

Bolanos was in imo a boxer-puncher, good boxer when he had too, and punch when the opening was there, I have this 1948 fight between Williams and Bolanos on dvd. but it only show 1-2 minutes per round.

I should also say that I was there for fight in 1948, I also seen the other two fights between Williams and Bolanos live

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[dagosd2000]

You hear sometimes that the United States didn't have a culture. Europeans like to make those statements. Well in the 20th Century it was the United States that had more culture than Europe. Two world wars devasted that continent.After 1919 and then after 1945,Europe was trying so hard to recover that there wasn't much time forthe arts. Many of their artists,musicians,film makers,and writers came to America.

It was OUR films,musical scores,jazz,popular songs(that had lyrics Shakespeare would have admired),novelists and poets that were the benchmark of the 20th Century. But after WW II we started a subtle decline. Again war was the culprit. Coming out of a war erodes the the culture of a society. Vietnam smashed the door down. The younger crowd,the post Vietnam generation that was born into the culture we have today,never saw the last of the "Golden Days". The 50's and early 60's.

When Frank posts those old programs,he's showing us the last of a good era.When you read the articles,it is not only a nostalgic look into our past,but a representation of quality American writing.

[Randyman]

You hear sometimes that the United States didn't have a culture. Europeans like to make those statements. Well in the 20th Century it was the United States that had more culture than Europe. Two world wars devasted that continent.After 1919 and then after 1945,Europe was trying so hard to recover that there wasn't much time forthe arts. Many of their artists,musicians,film makers,and writers came to America.

It was OUR films,musical scores,jazz,popular songs(that had lyrics Shakespeare would have admired),novelists and poets that were the benchmark of the 20th Century. But after WW II we started a subtle decline. Again war was the culprit. Coming out of a war erodes the the culture of a society. Vietnam smashed the door down. The younger crowd,the post Vietnam generation that was born into the culture we have today,never saw the last of the "Golden Days". The 50's and early 60's.

When Frank posts those old programs,he's showing us the last of a good era.When you read the articles,it is not only a nostalgic look into our past,but a representation of quality American writing.

Rog, you might even say the Europeans have culture courtesy of the USA. Like you, I look back somewhat sadly at the decline of our culture, but I still believe that we can pull through. There's a reason everybody and their brother are clamoring to get in, and it ain't the cheese.

Frank has to be considered the number one West Coast boxing historian, internet or otherwise. Whenever i think he has exhausted his supply of photos, magazine covers and articles, he'll post another.
Thanks, Frank and Rog for turning me on to this site. What an education just browsing through here.

[Randyman]

The Bronx Bull, Jake LaMotta, receives a congratulatory smooch from his loving wife Vicki
after his successful Middleweight title defense against Laurent Dauthille (1950)

A few years ago there's Jake gettin' interviewed on TV. All of a sudden he looks up .
"Rocky,Sugar Ray,how you guys doin' up der'? You guys must like it up der' cause yas' never come down for a visit. Pretty soon I'll be up der wit' yas."

Go ahead put your order in. Let me guess. Your mother's gonna' have waitn' for ya' a nice sausage and pepper sandwich with maybe some egg plant parmasain on the side? Am I close/

Rog, I am an Italian food junkie. I bleed sausage and peppers! man, you just made me hungry, and I just got through eating dinner.
Randy

[kikibalt]

You hear sometimes that the United States didn't have a culture. Europeans like to make those statements. Well in the 20th Century it was the United States that had more culture than Europe. Two world wars devasted that continent.After 1919 and then after 1945,Europe was trying so hard to recover that there wasn't much time forthe arts. Many of their artists,musicians,film makers,and writers came to America.

It was OUR films,musical scores,jazz,popular songs(that had lyrics Shakespeare would have admired),novelists and poets that were the benchmark of the 20th Century. But after WW II we started a subtle decline. Again war was the culprit. Coming out of a war erodes the the culture of a society. Vietnam smashed the door down. The younger crowd,the post Vietnam generation that was born into the culture we have today,never saw the last of the "Golden Days". The 50's and early 60's.

When Frank posts those old programs,he's showing us the last of a good era.When you read the articles,it is not only a nostalgic look into our past,but a representation of quality American writing.

Rog, you might even say the Europeans have culture courtesy of the USA. Like you, I look back somewhat sadly at the decline of our culture, but I still believe that we can pull through. There's a reason everybody and their brother are clamoring to get in, and it ain't the cheese.

Frank has to be considered the number one West Coast boxing historian, internet or otherwise. Whenever i think he has exhausted his supply of photos, magazine covers and articles, he'll post another.
Thanks, Frank and Rog for turning me on to this site. What an education just browsing through here.

Randy, you're much to kind, but nice to have you here, maybe we can get some of the guys here to post at your web site.

[Randyman]

You hear sometimes that the United States didn't have a culture. Europeans like to make those statements. Well in the 20th Century it was the United States that had more culture than Europe. Two world wars devasted that continent.After 1919 and then after 1945,Europe was trying so hard to recover that there wasn't much time forthe arts. Many of their artists,musicians,film makers,and writers came to America.

It was OUR films,musical scores,jazz,popular songs(that had lyrics Shakespeare would have admired),novelists and poets that were the benchmark of the 20th Century. But after WW II we started a subtle decline. Again war was the culprit. Coming out of a war erodes the the culture of a society. Vietnam smashed the door down. The younger crowd,the post Vietnam generation that was born into the culture we have today,never saw the last of the "Golden Days". The 50's and early 60's.

When Frank posts those old programs,he's showing us the last of a good era.When you read the articles,it is not only a nostalgic look into our past,but a representation of quality American writing.

Rog, you might even say the Europeans have culture courtesy of the USA. Like you, I look back somewhat sadly at the decline of our culture, but I still believe that we can pull through. There's a reason everybody and their brother are clamoring to get in, and it ain't the cheese.

Frank has to be considered the number one West Coast boxing historian, internet or otherwise. Whenever i think he has exhausted his supply of photos, magazine covers and articles, he'll post another.
Thanks, Frank and Rog for turning me on to this site. What an education just browsing through here.

Randy, you're much to kind, but nice to have you here, maybe we can get some of the guys here to post at your web site.

Well, for what it's worth, I consider you my mentor in all things boxing. Hope you don't mind.
Randy

[kikibalt]

The Bronx Bull, Jake LaMotta, receives a congratulatory smooch from his loving wife Vicki
after his successful Middleweight title defense against Laurent Dauthille (1950)

A few years ago there's Jake gettin' interviewed on TV. All of a sudden he looks up .
"Rocky,Sugar Ray,how you guys doin' up der'? You guys must like it up der' cause yas' never come down for a visit. Pretty soon I'll be up der wit' yas."

Go ahead put your order in. Let me guess. Your mother's gonna' have waitn' for ya' a nice sausage and pepper sandwich with maybe some egg plant parmasain on the side? Am I close/

Rog, I am an Italian food junkie. I bleed sausage and peppers! man, you just made me hungry, and I just got through eating dinner.
Randy

I would eat Italian food if they didn't use cheese on everything, can't stand caso... :(