John L Gardner vs Paul Sykes full fight on You Tube

[EddieShredder]

I've just watched the Paul Sykes documentary on youtube.... He's an engaging man indeed. I wouldn't say intelligent though, well read perhaps. Definately had seemed like someone you wouldn't want to know, on any level.

[lowersmiths]

although boxing has saved a lot of people i wonder if it actually made paul sykes become the violent thug he was. that documentary suggests so.

[Coco]

Sykes was a very late starter because he was in nick already, so his violent tendancieswere already ingrained.
If anything the times he stayed out of trouble was when he was boxing.

[lowersmiths]

Sykes was a very late starter because he was in nick already, so his violent tendancieswere already ingrained.
If anything the times he stayed out of trouble was when he was boxing.

Sykes was a late starter in terms of his professional career but he had been involved in boxing since he was a boy. He had been due to turn pro a number of times before but incarceration prevented this. I'm not too sure but I think he represented England at junior level. Either way, his violence and his boxing were inter-twined. He grew up with both.

yes he says in that doc that his dad took him to boxing when he was a young lad and that ''how can your dad love you when he makes you get hit in the face''

got to be a sociology essay in there somewhere ... where's the eloquent spud with his gcse coursework when you need him?

[EddieShredder]

Sykes was a very late starter because he was in nick already, so his violent tendancieswere already ingrained.
If anything the times he stayed out of trouble was when he was boxing.

Sykes was a late starter in terms of his professional career but he had been involved in boxing since he was a boy. He had been due to turn pro a number of times before but incarceration prevented this. I'm not too sure but I think he represented England at junior level. Either way, his violence and his boxing were inter-twined. He grew up with both.

yes he says in that doc that his dad took him to boxing when he was a young lad and that ''how can your dad love you when he makes you get hit in the face''

got to be a sociology essay in there somewhere ... where's the eloquent spud with his gcse coursework when you need him?

"Eloquent Spud"

The impression I get is that Sykes would have been a violent criminal whether he boxed or not. It just seemed part of his make up/psyche.

After watching the documentary, I had a look at his Wiki page. Several times in the film he banged on about how he wasn't a theif/robber/scum etc.. but according to wiki (obviously could be wrong) it said he had been done for robbery etc.

I think the bottom line is that he was just a bad man. Thats it. The fact that he boxed bears no relevance, other than it probably made him a little more useful with his hands.

[Mimmy]

I don't think Sykes fell into the catogory of gangster but as many have mentioned i suppose you can do what you please in life if you throw your weight around and one one is prepared to stand up to him. I would imagine if he lived in London he would have been far worse as he might have met the most unsavory characters in crime.

There is no doubt that Sykes was an intelligent person, you get to see that in the docu, he maybe was eccentric in terms of his mentality.

Ive spoken to people from wakefield when Sykes was alive and one person told me he worked as a doorman in Blackpool for Brian London, not sure if that is correct as ive never heard this mentioned before.

At the end of the day i think his upbringing had a lot to do with his adult life, he obviously didnt like his father, and in the docu it looks like his dad could not deal with him, no one has ever mentioned what he was like as a teenager, 13 to 19.

I get the impression he only boxed for money and his heart could not have been into it 100% otherwise he would have stayed on the straight and narrow. But he must have had a little feelings because he was genuinly upset when he had that fight with Dave Wilson, whom he nearly killed in the ring, incidently Wilson never fought again.

There is a member of boxrec called 'Enigma' on here, that person is Neil Malpass, maybe if he read this thread he could give an impression of what Paul Sykes was like in the ring.

[coneye]

watched the doco Sykes came across has what a lot have said , a thick bully . he was not intelligent just well read , having come from a familly of jail birds, with the exeption of myself and my sons the rest just tend to keep the bed warm for each other , revolving door one comes out the other goes in .

Sykes just came across has a bully instantly in the fight with Gardner he turns and gives up has soon has he starts to get it back,his inteligence or lack off it came through he was a nutter plain and simple , in fact my lads have often laughed and said how do you pick em so quick dad , when we have met people and i have turned rnd and said he's done a lot of time , later we have found i'm correct its easy i've told them listen to them talk , long termers always read a lot and repeat what they have read. .

It was obvious the guy was destined for a lot of time, and the raping of young boys in there does'nt suprise me i've always felt habitual and i mean habitual offenders not one of murderer's or such but people like Sykes who come and go so frequently they don't mind jail because they don't miss what most of us would and thats a shag with the girlfreind or missis because they enjoy shagging men , in other words i think most habitual offenders are poofs and jail to them is a smogasboard, in fact i've got a cousin who has been in for 32 out of his 51 years starting with boys homes right through and when i told him i thought he was a closet pillow biter he laughed said i had some weird ideas but funny enough never denied it he's married got kids but it don't bother him leaving them for 2-3 years at a time

So all in all Sykes was a coward , a bully , a rapist and preyer on young boys , and a poof, only good thing about the violence in britain today is people like sykes may well end up with a bullet courtesy of some 15 year old

[coneye]

I eplained why i said that , like i said a murder done in the heat of the moment different , but habitual crims a lot of them are closet poofs , lets be right here it goes on and it goes on in the nick a LOT more than people talk about,

Your local tealeaf who thinks he's a bit flash does'nt come out of nick and talk about it but it goes on in there big time and the nicks are full off guys like Sykes , big tough guys outside who turn into pillow biters when they get in there , the habitual crim knows where he's going and it don't bother him cos a lot of them get it inside. like i said for carreer crims like Sykes and lots of others its a smogasboard, and if you don't think it goes on i suggest your the deluded one living on another planet.

[coneye]

Has to wether or not someone is gay i could'nt care less there choice in life what should we care , and i'm not saying everyone in prison is a poof , what i'm saying and i'm only going on what i've been told, because i've never done time is that there is an awful lot of guys who are habitual crims in and out all the time who are not bothered by missing out on dipping there wick cos they do it in there. its just not spoken about

Like i said most of my familly are crims in and out, theres 3 doing life at the moment , theres another couple of dozen who have done lots of years between them . they have told me about more than a couple of hardcases from manchester including a couple i worked doors with in manchester in the 70.s and eighties who despite there hard man posture on the outside on the inside have been made into little bitches and its not stopped them going back for stupid things.

Bet any money Sykes would off bashed anyone who dared to suggest he was a closet queen , but it did'nt stop him and i bet it did'nt stop some of the lads he raped from going straight either

[jonjrp]

My old man was a prison officer at wakefield in the mid 80s and knows alot about Paul Sykes.

He told me plenty of stuff last night over the phone, his first reaction to the mention of Sykes name being a groan followed by 'thats a gruesome name from the past'. Some of the stuff he told me included how in the weights room Sykes had hit one of the prison officers over the head with a weight of some description and the fella never worked again.

He said another prison officer, possibly called Barry Ramsden (?) or Marsden (?), was a huge guy, 6'4'' and a former heavyweight boxer himself. At some point in the past Barry had shared a ring with Sykes, he said he had no skill at all and if you had the balls to stand up to him he wasn't that dangerous at all. The old man recalled vividly how he turned his back on John L Gardner because the fight was a bit tough and that was the officers general opinion of Sykes, he was just a bully who wanted to dish it out but couldn't take it.

My favourite story though was how he told me there was a pub very near Wakefield Prison that Sykes like to frequent. One of his habits was to go up to people who'd just bought a pint, stand over them & spit in it, knowing they wouldn't then drink it so he'd take it off them and drink it himself. Well one night in the late 80s he performed this trick on some young fella hanging out in the pub with a few quiet but mean guys. They said nothing, let Sykes have the pint and all left. A few hours later, Sykes came out of the pub in the dark, obviously a little worse for wear after how many drinks, and these guys were all waiting for him. Apparently these guys knocked him to the ground and absolutely brutalised him, worked over something fierce and were evn taking free kicks on his head. After the beating Sykes was not seen around that area for a very long time.

Couldn't of happened to a more deserving fella, and my dad felt everybodys a lot better off with the guy dead & buried.

First off let me just say, with no offence meant, that your dad was talking pure crap when he says a weight was used in the assault against the screws. Paul Sykes wasn't in Wakefield jail in the mid "80s for a start, it was Hull jail and one of the screws was called John Raine who was punched once and had his jaw broken. The other one, I can't recall his name, but he got a punch and suffered a couple of broken ribs.
Talking about bullies let me just remind you about the screw Raine- in Everthorpe Borstal in the 1970s, he was a true bully with boys as young as 15 so you see what goes around comes around. He got his just deserts in the end
Paul sykes was serving 30 months at the time and this sentence was increased to 6 years for the GBH on the 2 screws

[Mimmy]

Do you know I bet Paul Sykes is one of the most talked about boxers from the late 70's early 80's. Its just amazing how one mans notoriarity will go on for ever, just like the Krays in the 60's.

It would not supprise me if some British director came along and looked at the history behind Sykes, and his family and made a movie of it, and I bet it would be well worth watching.

[1southpaw]

Just going back to Sykes, he wrote a book called Sweet Agony. this book is a collectors item. Ive had a few of them bought them and sold them on ebay. do you know the book was about £3 when it came out but now its worth around £90 now in good condition. I bought one for £17 and sold it for £70, i bought another for £40 and sold it for £97. keep your eye out for it only 10,000 printed i think and im guessing lots of people in Wakefield bought it but as years have gone by they have become tatty or thrown away.

Is it a good read?

you can get this book on amazon for between £25-£77

[Mimmy]

Just going back to Sykes, he wrote a book called Sweet Agony. this book is a collectors item. Ive had a few of them bought them and sold them on ebay. do you know the book was about £3 when it came out but now its worth around £90 now in good condition. I bought one for £17 and sold it for £70, i bought another for £40 and sold it for £97. keep your eye out for it only 10,000 printed i think and im guessing lots of people in Wakefield bought it but as years have gone by they have become tatty or thrown away.

Is it a good read?

you can get this book on amazon for between £25-£77

I think folks have seen the price that the book was worth and now all those who may have it have jumped on the ebay bandwagon and sold it.

Believe me this time last year there was only one on amazon for £140. I have bought and sold 2 in the last 6 or 7 months. As i have said before there was only 10,000 printed so even if there is only 1 or 2 thousand out there they are now coming up for sale, but its too late now the price is obviously reflecting on how many books have turned up.

[Collins2000]

I just put up Joe Bugner vs Danny "Smiley" Sutton on Youtube.

If you are interested, you will find it.

[overhand_right]

My old man was a prison officer at wakefield in the mid 80s and knows alot about Paul Sykes.

He told me plenty of stuff last night over the phone, his first reaction to the mention of Sykes name being a groan followed by 'thats a gruesome name from the past'. Some of the stuff he told me included how in the weights room Sykes had hit one of the prison officers over the head with a weight of some description and the fella never worked again.

He said another prison officer, possibly called Barry Ramsden (?) or Marsden (?), was a huge guy, 6'4'' and a former heavyweight boxer himself. At some point in the past Barry had shared a ring with Sykes, he said he had no skill at all and if you had the balls to stand up to him he wasn't that dangerous at all. The old man recalled vividly how he turned his back on John L Gardner because the fight was a bit tough and that was the officers general opinion of Sykes, he was just a bully who wanted to dish it out but couldn't take it.

My favourite story though was how he told me there was a pub very near Wakefield Prison that Sykes like to frequent. One of his habits was to go up to people who'd just bought a pint, stand over them & spit in it, knowing they wouldn't then drink it so he'd take it off them and drink it himself. Well one night in the late 80s he performed this trick on some young fella hanging out in the pub with a few quiet but mean guys. They said nothing, let Sykes have the pint and all left. A few hours later, Sykes came out of the pub in the dark, obviously a little worse for wear after how many drinks, and these guys were all waiting for him. Apparently these guys knocked him to the ground and absolutely brutalised him, worked over something fierce and were evn taking free kicks on his head. After the beating Sykes was not seen around that area for a very long time.

Couldn't of happened to a more deserving fella, and my dad felt everybodys a lot better off with the guy dead & buried.

First off let me just say, with no offence meant, that your dad was talking pure crap when he says a weight was used in the assault against the screws. Paul Sykes wasn't in Wakefield jail in the mid "80s for a start, it was Hull jail and one of the screws was called John Raine who was punched once and had his jaw broken. The other one, I can't recall his name, but he got a punch and suffered a couple of broken ribs.
Talking about bullies let me just remind you about the screw Raine- in Everthorpe Borstal in the 1970s, he was a true bully with boys as young as 15 so you see what goes around comes around. He got his just deserts in the end
Paul sykes was serving 30 months at the time and this sentence was increased to 6 years for the GBH on the 2 screws

Actually mate he was not talking pure crap. He made it very clear to me that when he started at Wakefield Prison in the mid-80s Paul Sykes was not there any longer, and if you read my post i never said Sykes was there at the time. He was recounting grim tales from long time prison officers.

And the fact you refer to prison officers as 'screws' speaks volumes about you.

[coneye]

[quote="teddy007" Screws or "Prison wardens" are very much to blame for people coming out of prison more hardened when they went in.[/quote]
What a stupid comment, you been in and told off have you,

. Can tell you now nephew of mine just got time AGAIN , only familly members he ain't robbed have been myself and my sons, and the reasons for that is he's been told stay away or suffer a clip round the ear , something he should off got years ago.

But we always thought it, was his nana's fault he's a theiving liying little bastard, he used to steal out of her purse cos she was an old lady who only showed him love, and a easy victim, at least we now know, its not her fault its the screws,

Could be though like i said, when the thieving , lying , scummy little drug facked victim off society, gets put away , he for one likes to seek out the sykes off the world in there , and they don't have to knock him out to get there dick sucked . Course when he comes out he likes to parade around has the dangerous crim and brag about being banged up wiyh the sykes types .

Fack i'm glad to find out its not his grans fault anymore

[overhand_right]

Teddy -- you're the one coming out saying everyone calls em Screws and putting the blame on prison officers and not the criminals for their actions.

i doubt you're very familiar with the red tape prison officers work with? Since you seem to be putting yourself across as a man down with the criminals, you really coming across any offenders leaving prison shaking and traumatized, vowing to go straight because they don't want to be done over by the screws again?

No.

[Old bones Ian]

Anyway back to putting stuff on youtube, i have a few things i could add, but not sure they are to big , whats a good program to reduce the size of the files without mucking up the quality to much

[Collins2000]

Incidentally Sykes' old man was a screw too.

[Scrap]

Coneye youre spot on.

[Old bones Ian]

one of my favourite youtube clips, no idea who the boxers are, but includes a double knockdown, and the most excitable commentator ever.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-B0_mpsJ2Sc

[coneye]

[quote="teddy007" Screws or "Prison wardens" are very much to blame for people coming out of prison more hardened when they went in.

What a stupid comment, you been in and told off have you,

. Can tell you now nephew of mine just got time AGAIN , only familly members he ain't robbed have been myself and my sons, and the reasons for that is he's been told stay away or suffer a clip round the ear , something he should off got years ago.

But we always thought it, was his nana's fault he's a theiving liying little bastard, he used to steal out of her purse cos she was an old lady who only showed him love, and a easy victim, at least we now know, its not her fault its the screws,

Could be though like i said, when the thieving , lying , scummy little drug facked victim off society, gets put away , he for one likes to seek out the sykes off the world in there , and they don't have to knock him out to get there dick sucked . Course when he comes out he likes to parade around has the dangerous crim and brag about being banged up wiyh the sykes types .

Fack i'm glad to find out its not his grans fault anymore

your a person with a real chip on their shoulder, i has better not mess with u because you come from sucj a hard family, you mug.[/quote]


Chip on my shoulder, well if having a intense dislike for thieves, bullies, rapists, scumbags , drug facked villains and all other types of scum who like to prey on the weaker people in society is having a chip on the shoulder , well i guess i must have .

Has to coming from hard familly you got that wrong cos half of them are part of the drug facked society i hate and there only like that cos like a lot of others they associate with there just bullies and theives who back down when there not in gangs or meet someone there not sure they can handle, its a culture thing mate , and its getting worse these scumbags are not hard there not even tough enough to do a days work theres so facking lazy a day on a building site would kill them .

Tell you what the scumbags do though they love it when people like you walk around defending them with stupid comments like its the screws fault there feral, they love it even more when people like you think there hard . When in fact most of them are soft has shit

Luckilly though there not all like that i'm proud to say some of my relations are hard working religous people and i wished the other lot were has well . but still while idiots like you run licking there arses they won't change so the answer is lock the fackers up for a long time , and the bleeding heart liberals such has yourself well you can all go get facked soft people with soft liberal attitudes have ruined britain.

BRING BACK HANGING , an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth, these little fackers who thieve chop there fingers off , rapists give em back with a hot poker, murderers let the victims familly decide what happens get tough it won't stop all the shit but they won't stab and maim again if there swinging from the tree.

FACK I FEEL LIKE A YANK NOW , I'M GONNA LIVE IN TEXAS

[Collins2000]

You don't half get some nutters on here...

[coneye]

Coneye What are you talking about? I never once said that people who commit crime were hard and that i thought they were. I stated that that prison officer were as much to blame for people coming back out hardened criminals, but that just adds to the other factors of prison environment and other prisoners. You most defiantely have a big mouth behind your computer.

Still making silly comments , i indicated some of my family were scumbags and crims, you come back with i'm from a hard familly based on what ,fact that some of them seem to like prison , thats not hard mate thats stupid.Like i said the only time there hard is when there in a gang or others are scared of them .

[overhand_right]

I never once said that people who commit crime were hard and that i thought they were. I stated that that prison officer were as much to blame for people coming back out hardened criminals, .

What a ridiculous thing to say.

Please go into detail -- exactly HOW can you blame prison officers for creating hardened criminals?