Muhammad Ali vs Jimmy Ellis

[Poncey]

Agreed.

[TheOneIsHere2008]

Sean O'Grady did . . . so did Ken Norton. Ron Lyle gave me ten rounds worth of his time. Carlos Ortiz did, too.

How's that for starters?

Now, how about the names of those commissions that banned Jimmy Eliis when he was legally blind . . .

And when did I suggest that Ali-Ellis was a thrilling event?

Jack Dempsey gave me over an hour of his time.
So did Joe Louis.

We were talking about specific techniques of boxing.

About specifics to do with their own fights.

Louis was so interested when I told him about my long discussion with Dempsey about such specifics that he actually started grilling me, with great interest, about what Dempsey said.

I am sure Sean O'Grady was a nice kid and I know that Ken Norton was actually intelligent (not about boxing) but I would have no interest in talking about boxing techniques with fighters on their level.

I'll stick with what I learned from Dempsey, Louis, Harold Johnson, Georgie Benton, Wesley Mouzon, Holly Mims, Lee Halfpenny, Bob Brown, etc etc.

i'm sure the pleasure was all theirs. he probably just visited their graves and talked to them. btw, what kind of retard takes orange juice to the fights and bestows them to the fighters he feels that are worthy? what a pompous ass.

One wonders what other pleasures Granberry tried to bestow on these men, some at different levels of consciousness...

[p4p1]

i like how gran is to good to talk boxing with some world champions

[My2Sense]

I like how Robinson keeps popping up with a question pertaining to the original topic, completely ignoring the rest of the thread.

[TheOneIsHere2008]

I like how Robinson keeps popping up with a question pertaining to the original topic, completely ignoring the rest of the thread.

How did Robinson get in this?

Is this the thread where granberry says Jimmy Ellis was legally blind...

A legally blind fighter would get killed...My mom has glacouma...She's legally blind...She has to sit two feet away from a 52 inch HDTV to make out the colors...

He denigrates the sport he professes to love with his wild tales of fixed fights, drugged fighters, and now blind ones...

[p4p1]

I like how Robinson keeps popping up with a question pertaining to the original topic, completely ignoring the rest of the thread.

How did Robinson get in this?

Is this the thread where granberry says Jimmy Ellis was legally blind...

A legally blind fighter would get killed...My mom has glacouma...She's legally blind...She has to sit two feet away from a 52 inch HDTV to make out the colors...

He denigrates the sport he professes to love with his wild tales of fixed fights, drugged fighters, and now blind ones...

he does more than that

[Collins2000]

I like how Robinson keeps popping up with a question pertaining to the original topic, completely ignoring the rest of the thread.

How did Robinson get in this?

Is this the thread where granberry says Jimmy Ellis was legally blind...

A legally blind fighter would get killed...My mom has glacouma...She's legally blind...She has to sit two feet away from a 52 inch HDTV to make out the colors...

He denigrates the sport he professes to love with his wild tales of fixed fights, drugged fighters, and now blind ones...

Don't forget the orange juice 'story'. That one was brilliant.

[p4p1]

I like how Robinson keeps popping up with a question pertaining to the original topic, completely ignoring the rest of the thread.

How did Robinson get in this?

Is this the thread where granberry says Jimmy Ellis was legally blind...

A legally blind fighter would get killed...My mom has glacouma...She's legally blind...She has to sit two feet away from a 52 inch HDTV to make out the colors...

He denigrates the sport he professes to love with his wild tales of fixed fights, drugged fighters, and now blind ones...

Don't forget the orange juice 'story'. That one was brilliant.

that one wasnt to bad exept for the i chose which fighters i gave my OJ to lol

[TheOneIsHere2008]

Maybe Muhammad Ali, Larry Holmes, and Sugar Ray Leonard didn't like his orange juice...

[TheOneIsHere2008]

Dundee never trained any fighter.

He was a cornerman.

He was well known to be clueless when it came the techniques of boxing.
He was known in Philadelphia as "The guy who used to sweep out his brother's gym."

How did the posters here let you get away with that little chestnut?

He trained

Muhammad Ali

George Foreman

Sugar Ray Leonard

Luis Rodriguez

Willie Pastrano

Ralph Dupas

Jose Napoles

Jimmy Ellis

Sugar Ramos

P.S. It was a boring fight...They knew each other too well...I think they knew each other since they were sixteen... As for Herbert Muhammad he handled Ali's business career and probably robbed him...He knew nothing about boxing...

[p4p1]

Dundee never trained any fighter.

He was a cornerman.

He was well known to be clueless when it came the techniques of boxing.
He was known in Philadelphia as "The guy who used to sweep out his brother's gym."

How did the posters here let you get away with that little chestnut?

He trained

Muhammad Ali

George Foreman

Sugar Ray Leonard

Luis Rodriguez

Willie Pastrano

Ralph Dupas

Jose Napoles

Jimmy Ellis

Sugar Ramos

P.S. It was a boring fight...They knew each other too well...I think they knew each other since they were sixteen... As for Herbert Muhammad he handled Ali's business career and probably robbed him...He knew nothing about boxing...

from what i read herbert muhammad wanted to getinto boxing but his father wouldn allow it and ali was his way to do it, dundee seems to think muhammad did a good job with ali's career

[TheOneIsHere2008]

Dundee never trained any fighter.

He was a cornerman.

He was well known to be clueless when it came the techniques of boxing.
He was known in Philadelphia as "The guy who used to sweep out his brother's gym."

How did the posters here let you get away with that little chestnut?

He trained

Muhammad Ali

George Foreman

Sugar Ray Leonard

Luis Rodriguez

Willie Pastrano

Ralph Dupas

Jose Napoles

Jimmy Ellis

Sugar Ramos

P.S. It was a boring fight...They knew each other too well...I think they knew each other since they were sixteen... As for Herbert Muhammad he handled Ali's business career and probably robbed him...He knew nothing about boxing...

from what i read herbert muhammad wanted to getinto boxing but his father wouldn allow it and ali was his way to do it, dundee seems to think muhammad did a good job with ali's career

You are right...I stand corrected...Elijah Muhammad saw him working a speed or heavy bag in their garage and forbid him from ever doing that again...But I don't think he knew much about boxing...Toward the end of Ali's career he wasn't even in the corner but at a ringside seat...

[p4p1]

i didnt know he was ever in ali's corner i thought he was always in the crowd

[TheOneIsHere2008]

i didnt know he was ever in ali's corner i thought he was always in the crowd

An interesting piece of trivia...

Jimmy Ellis was defeated by Rubin Hurricane Carter as a 160 pounder early in his career...

I'm no expert but it seems Angelo Dundee got the most out of what was an ordinary boxer...

[p4p1]

i didnt know he was ever in ali's corner i thought he was always in the crowd

An interesting piece of trivia...

Jimmy Ellis was defeated by Rubin Hurricane Carter as a 160 pounder early in his career...

I'm no expert but it seems Angelo Dundee got the most out of what was an ordinary boxer...

i remember reading that on carters record and was pretty spun out by it

didnt u remember that ali was a cornerman and not a trainer and has never trained a fighter before he was that kid who swept chris' gym maybe gran ahs some against him and not ali?

[TheOneIsHere2008]

i didnt know he was ever in ali's corner i thought he was always in the crowd

An interesting piece of trivia...

Jimmy Ellis was defeated by Rubin Hurricane Carter as a 160 pounder early in his career...

I'm no expert but it seems Angelo Dundee got the most out of what was an ordinary boxer...

i remember reading that on carters record and was pretty spun out by it

didnt u remember that ali was a cornerman and not a trainer and has never trained a fighter before he was that kid who swept chris' gym maybe gran ahs some against him and not ali?

I went to high school in North Miami Beach and Chris Dundee was a big wrestling promoter...He used to promote wrestling at the Miami Beach Convention Center...Angelo Dundee is 88 and just recently worked a fighter's corner...

Back to Hurricane Carter...I saw that he also beat Emile Griffith...After seeing the movie I thought he was framed...But then after reading the other side I am just confused...

[p4p1]

yeh im exactly the same i dont know what to think about it either ya have to wonder

[TheOneIsHere2008]

yeh im exactly the same i dont know what to think about it either ya have to wonder

There are websites that point to his guilt and suggest the whole "Hurricane" story is a myth...And then there's his story...

Who knows?

I'm more impressed that Jimmy Ellis moved up in weight classes so successfully...He was a solid "technical" boxer, a lesser or much lesser Larry Holmes if you will...

[p4p1]

yeh im exactly the same i dont know what to think about it either ya have to wonder

There are websites that point to his guilt and suggest the whole "Hurricane" story is a myth...And then there's his story...

Who knows?

I'm more impressed that Jimmy Ellis moved up in weight classes so successfully...He was a solid "technical" boxer, a lesser or much lesser Larry Holmes if you will...

i havnt watched a whole heap of old fights i plan to but just dont get around to it i have heaps of fights on video and dvd just havnt watched them all but i do read alot

[Ambling Alp]

Dundee never trained any fighter.

He was a cornerman.

He was well known to be clueless when it came the techniques of boxing.
He was known in Philadelphia as "The guy who used to sweep out his brother's gym."

How did the posters here let you get away with that little chestnut?

He trained

Muhammad Ali

George Foreman

Sugar Ray Leonard

Luis Rodriguez

Willie Pastrano

Ralph Dupas

Jose Napoles

Jimmy Ellis

Sugar Ramos

P.S. It was a boring fight...They knew each other too well...I think they knew each other since they were sixteen... As for Herbert Muhammad he handled Ali's business career and probably robbed him...He knew nothing about boxing...

That's quite a few guys that were successful with Dundee. He also was with Carmen Basilio and Pinklon Thomas. He had a few other other guys who won title belts as well.

[TheOneIsHere2008]

Dundee never trained any fighter.

He was a cornerman.

He was well known to be clueless when it came the techniques of boxing.

He was known in Philadelphia as "The guy who used to sweep out his brother's gym."

How did the posters here let you get away with that little chestnut?

He trained

Muhammad Ali

George Foreman

Sugar Ray Leonard

Luis Rodriguez

Willie Pastrano

Ralph Dupas

Jose Napoles

Jimmy Ellis

Sugar Ramos

P.S. It was a boring fight...They knew each other too well...I think they knew each other since they were sixteen... As for Herbert Muhammad he handled Ali's business career and probably robbed him...He knew nothing about boxing...

That's quite a few guys that were successful with Dundee. He also was with Carmen Basilio and Pinklon Thomas. He had a few other other guys who won title belts as well.

By Luca De Franco

Thousands of people work in the American boxing business, but the ones who really count total about fifty and they all know each other. One of them is Angelo Dundee. Probably, he is the only one liked by all the others. I met dozens of top guys in New York, Florida and New Jersey and nobody ever said a bad word about the legendary trainer. That’s because Angelo always treated everybody with respect and got it in return. The Philadelphia-born Hall of Famer always accepted the fighters for what they were and worked a way to develop their talent at the highest level:



http://www.thesweetscience.com/boxing-a ... lo-dundee/


Maybe Granberry is pissed that the Dundee trained Wille Pastrano upset the Phildelphia trained Harold Johnson...

[TheOneIsHere2008]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FjCIhfNA ... re=related

I know some folks are burnt out on Muhammad Ali threads but I was watching the Ali-Ellis fight again...To me watching old Ali fights is like watching The Godfather, Casino, or Goodfellas; movies I have literally seen dozens of times...

If you go to the 8:50 mark Ali stands within striking range of Jimmy Ellis for an an entire minute with his hands by his size and makes him miss with shoulder and head movement alone...I have seen Floyd Mayweather do moves similar to this but he weighed eighty pounds less...And Jimmy Ellis was for real....He might not have been an ATG but he had wins against solid fighters like Patterson, Quarry, and Bonavena...He got owned by Joe Frazier but who didn't but Ali and George Foreman...