Sweet Scientist wrote:Yeah...But do you honestly think Duran would have quit if he had been WINNING?
I don't buy the argument that he quit the fight so he could go to the bathroom...BoxBuzz wrote:Sweet Scientist wrote:Yeah...But do you honestly think Duran would have quit if he had been WINNING?
Rather than 'crap the canvas"? Probably.....however if he hadn't have had those cramps....he might not have been losing the fight..so it may not have been an issue....sort of a vicious circle.
Tyson sure looked fast...For instance ou could see Foreman's and Shavers' bombs coming from a mile away...Grimm wrote:Well I'll put it like this, Ali had the fastest hands to be able to just touch you with them but as far as throwing the fastest haymakers I'd have to go with Patterson then Tyson then Louis.
The One. Your fact about Jimmy Jacobs is taken from a documentary covering the first Ali Frazier fight. Did Jimmy Jacobs measure Patterson's handspeed as well? How about Benny Paret, even Hector Camacho? Do you even know the answer to this question? I suspect not.TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:I repeat:
The Muhammad Ali of 60’s was the fastest heavyweight ever. In the May 5, 1969 Sports Illustrated, Ali’s jab was measured with an omegascope. Ali’s jab, it was found, could smash a balsa board 16.5 inches away in 19/100 of a second. It actually covered the distance in 4/100 of a second, which is the blink of an eye. Jimmy Jacobs, who owned the world’s largest collection of fight films, said that on film tests with a synchronizer Ali’s jab was faster than that of Sugar Ray Robinson. Jacobs contended that Ali was not only the fastest heavyweight, but also the fastest fighter he ever saw on film.
http://coxscorner.tripod.com/ali.html
And here's Muhammad Ali hitting Brian London (I know he's a journeyman, I'm not going to call a boxer a bum or tomato can...You call him one and see what happens)...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU2YPXgh ... deo/117445
Fourteen punches in three seconds!!!
p.s for clarification purposes, I've mentioned Camacho in response to your mentioning SRR. I do realise that this thread is intended as heavies only.Knucklez wrote:The One. Your fact about Jimmy Jacobs is taken from a documentary covering the first Ali Frazier fight. Did Jimmy Jacobs measure Patterson's handspeed as well? How about Benny Paret, even Hector Camacho? Do you even know the answer to this question? I suspect not.TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:I repeat:
The Muhammad Ali of 60’s was the fastest heavyweight ever. In the May 5, 1969 Sports Illustrated, Ali’s jab was measured with an omegascope. Ali’s jab, it was found, could smash a balsa board 16.5 inches away in 19/100 of a second. It actually covered the distance in 4/100 of a second, which is the blink of an eye. Jimmy Jacobs, who owned the world’s largest collection of fight films, said that on film tests with a synchronizer Ali’s jab was faster than that of Sugar Ray Robinson. Jacobs contended that Ali was not only the fastest heavyweight, but also the fastest fighter he ever saw on film.
http://coxscorner.tripod.com/ali.html
And here's Muhammad Ali hitting Brian London (I know he's a journeyman, I'm not going to call a boxer a bum or tomato can...You call him one and see what happens)...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU2YPXgh ... deo/117445
Fourteen punches in three seconds!!!
Secondly, Henry Cooper, who fought both Patterson and Ali, said that Patterson's hands were faster. I think he is in a good position to make this call, don't you?
Thirdly, you initially said that Ali through and eleven punch combo against London, now you've said it's a fourteen punch combo. Please make your mind up. Thanks.
Knucklez wrote:The One. Your fact about Jimmy Jacobs is taken from a documentary covering the first Ali Frazier fight. Did Jimmy Jacobs measure Patterson's handspeed as well? How about Benny Paret, even Hector Camacho? Do you even know the answer to this question? [b]I suspect not.TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:I repeat:
The Muhammad Ali of 60’s was the fastest heavyweight ever. In the May 5, 1969 Sports Illustrated, Ali’s jab was measured with an omegascope. Ali’s jab, it was found, could smash a balsa board 16.5 inches away in 19/100 of a second. It actually covered the distance in 4/100 of a second, which is the blink of an eye. Jimmy Jacobs, who owned the world’s largest collection of fight films, said that on film tests with a synchronizer Ali’s jab was faster than that of Sugar Ray Robinson. Jacobs contended that Ali was not only the fastest heavyweight, but also the fastest fighter he ever saw on film.
http://coxscorner.tripod.com/ali.html
And here's Muhammad Ali hitting Brian London (I know he's a journeyman, I'm not going to call a boxer a bum or tomato can...You call him one and see what happens)...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU2YPXgh ... deo/117445
Fourteen punches in three seconds!!!
[/b]
Secondly, Henry Cooper, who fought both Patterson and Ali, said that Patterson's hands were faster. I think he is in a good position to make this call, don't you?
Thirdly, you initially said that Ali through and eleven punch combo against London, now you've said it's a fourteen punch combo. Please make your mind up. Thanks.
granberry wrote:Doug Jones' hands were twice as fast as Ali's---both right hand and left jab.
It's right there on the film.
Jimmy Young's hands were three times as fast as Ali's.
For all Ali's pitty pat shit, he seemed to handle Floyd Patterson with great ease, apocryphal stories of hurt backs, notwithstanding...Tantum wrote:That's just it though Grimm...
Ali's pitty pat shit, and Floyd's haymaker combos were COMPARABLE in speed. I think that says alot.
Bob Foster did not fight Floyd Patterson so cannot make a direct comparison in the same way that Henry Cooper can.TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:Knucklez wrote:The One. Your fact about Jimmy Jacobs is taken from a documentary covering the first Ali Frazier fight. Did Jimmy Jacobs measure Patterson's handspeed as well? How about Benny Paret, even Hector Camacho? Do you even know the answer to this question? [b]I suspect not.TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:I repeat:
The Muhammad Ali of 60’s was the fastest heavyweight ever. In the May 5, 1969 Sports Illustrated, Ali’s jab was measured with an omegascope. Ali’s jab, it was found, could smash a balsa board 16.5 inches away in 19/100 of a second. It actually covered the distance in 4/100 of a second, which is the blink of an eye. Jimmy Jacobs, who owned the world’s largest collection of fight films, said that on film tests with a synchronizer Ali’s jab was faster than that of Sugar Ray Robinson. Jacobs contended that Ali was not only the fastest heavyweight, but also the fastest fighter he ever saw on film.
http://coxscorner.tripod.com/ali.html
And here's Muhammad Ali hitting Brian London (I know he's a journeyman, I'm not going to call a boxer a bum or tomato can...You call him one and see what happens)...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU2YPXgh ... deo/117445
Fourteen punches in three seconds!!!
[/b]
Secondly, Henry Cooper, who fought both Patterson and Ali, said that Patterson's hands were faster. I think he is in a good position to make this call, don't you?
Thirdly, you initially said that Ali through and eleven punch combo against London, now you've said it's a fourteen punch combo. Please make your mind up. Thanks.
I am citing Jimmy Jacobs.
Jim Jacobs
Manager, Film Historian)
Jimmy Jacobs is primarily known to boxing for his vast collection of fight films, but he was also a fight manager and, as a young man, a handball champion...Jacobs was also a boxing enthusiast and, in his travels to other countries to give handball exhibitions, he began to acquire films of old fights which were no longer available in this country. In 1961, Jacobs joined forces with another collector, Bill Cayton, to restore and preserve the films. Their corporation, The Big Fights, Inc., produced over one thousand boxing features with the old films as a base. Three of their productions were nominated for Academy Awards.
In addition to his film collecting, Jacobs also managed fighters with Cayton. The pair handled three world champions: Wilfred Benitez, Edwin Rosario, and Mike Tyson. As a manager, Jacobs was content to let the trainer determine the fight strategy and training regimen.
Jacobs died on March 23, 1988 after a long struggle with leukemia. He was hailed in both the boxing and handball worlds for his successes and fine character. Along with his spot in the Boxing Hall of Fame, Jacobs is an inductee of the Handball Hall of Fame.
http://www.ibhof.com/jacobsj.htm
Jimmy Jacobs is the one who said Muhammad Ali was not only the fastest heavyweight, but also the fastest fighter he ever saw on film... I think his opinion qualifies as an expert one and is worthy of consideration...And since he lived to 1988 one can assume he saw film of Paret and Camacho.
As for the Brian London fight , some folks say eleven punches in three seconds...Some say fourteen...They were too fast for me to count...I relied on the observations of others: I'll let you judge:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jU2YPXgh ... deo/117445
How many do you count?
Oh, Sir Henry Cooper said Patterson was faster...Good for him...I'll counter with World Light Heavyweight Champion, Bob Foster who fought Muhammad Ali who said "“He has no business being as fast as he is. I never saw that right hand.” or Marv Jenson, who managed Gene Fullmer, concurred saying, “Ali has the fastest hands on any heavyweight I have ever seen.”
And yes, I question Cooper's credibility...He said if not for cuts he would have won both fights....That's akin to Robert E Lee saying if not for Gettysburg and the Battle Of Vicksburg the Confederacy would have won the Civil War...
I don't consider myself a boxing expert like many on this site... I do consider myself a good reader and observer and able to understand what I read and observe...
Or
I'm not the first to say or suggest that Muhammad Ali was the fastest heavyweight or fastest boxer of any weight ever; Jimmy Jacobs, Bob Foster, and Marv Jenson were...
I know this is old, but I couldn't help laughing.knockout artist wrote:Terap,
I will stoop to your level and tell you to get the fu** out of this forum.
What you know about boxing can be written on the back of a postage stamp.
You have assumed that I am against all white fighters.
This is simply not true.
If you look at my posts you will see that some of my favourite fighters are white.
Hell, I'm an ex-boxer and white myself.
As for me being a retard, I have an IQ of 148, so choose your words carefully, son.
Incidentally, talking of technique, have you ever boxed?
When I look at this picture I don't find it totally implausible...TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:I don't buy the argument that he quit the fight so he could go to the bathroom...BoxBuzz wrote:Sweet Scientist wrote:Yeah...But do you honestly think Duran would have quit if he had been WINNING?
Rather than 'crap the canvas"? Probably.....however if he hadn't have had those cramps....he might not have been losing the fight..so it may not have been an issue....sort of a vicious circle.
I don't buy the argument that he quit the fight so he could go to the bathroom...
-theoneishere2008
Wow...
When I look at this picture I don't find it totally implausible...
-fistic mystic
Reading comprehension must not be your forte...Here's the original topic - The Fastest Heavyweight Champ Ever?....granberry wrote:It's right there on the film.
Jimmy Young's left jab was three times as fast as Ali's.
Jimmy Young's right hand was three times as fast as Ali's.
And accurate.
Doug Jones' left jab was twice as fast as Ali's.
Doug Jones' right hand was twice as fast as Ali's.
And many times more accurate.
Definitely not an enjoyable experience for Thomas Hauser clones to be brought in contact with those fights.
LOL
Both Doug Jones and Jimmy Young beat Ali.TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:Reading comprehension must not be your forte...Here's the original topic - The Fastest Heavyweight Champ Ever?....granberry wrote:It's right there on the film.
Jimmy Young's left jab was three times as fast as Ali's.
Jimmy Young's right hand was three times as fast as Ali's.
And accurate.
Doug Jones' left jab was twice as fast as Ali's.
Doug Jones' right hand was twice as fast as Ali's.
And many times more accurate.
Definitely not an enjoyable experience for Thomas Hauser clones to be brought in contact with those fights.
LOL
When were Doug Jones' and Jimmy Young's championship reigns?
You're becoming a drone, you old queen...granberry wrote:buzz, the slow Thomas Hauser clone,
thinks he knows what "everyone" thinks.
These members of The Religion of Ali are very proud of their mindreading powers.
They will all tell you they know what Sonny Liston was thinking.
In reality, they would be more likely to know what a Thomas Hauser clone is "thinking."
granberry is a bitter, twisted tool when it comes to ali, ray leonard, angelo dundee and many others his posts most of the time are the same boring dribble he sounds like a broken record he should get a new actgranberry wrote:buzz, the slow Thomas Hauser clone,
thinks he knows what "everyone" thinks.
These members of The Religion of Ali are very proud of their mindreading powers.
They will all tell you they know what Sonny Liston was thinking.
In reality, they would be more likely to know what a Thomas Hauser clone is "thinking."
Did you read this about Angee?p4p1 wrote:granberry is a bitter, twisted tool when it comes to ali, ray leonard, angelo dundee and many others his posts most of the time are the same boring dribble he sounds like a broken record he should get a new actgranberry wrote:buzz, the slow Thomas Hauser clone,
thinks he knows what "everyone" thinks.
These members of The Religion of Ali are very proud of their mindreading powers.
They will all tell you they know what Sonny Liston was thinking.
In reality, they would be more likely to know what a Thomas Hauser clone is "thinking."
