espn doing the 50 best fighters from all 50 states

[Matt]

There's a good chance Hostak would have knocked Steele down, as he hurt just about everyone he fought, except Ken Overlin. I think that Steele would have outpointed Hostak or stopped him late.

[Ric]

Jack Dempsey is the winner of Colorado

I guess I am still at a loss at their criteria. Dempsey from Colorado? When I was doing newspaper research of the late teens and 20s, virtually all the newspapers said he was from Utah, even after he moved to Los Angeles. Will Harry (Kid) Matthews win Idaho based upon this criteria, I wonder? Or who?

[Matt]

Matthews should be considered to be from Idaho, he started there and even after he came to Seattle, he would still go back and fight there periodically to really good crowds.

[Matt]

In a no-brainer, Tony Zale takes Indiana. Buster Beaupre also wins Vermont

[Seamus]

Much as I like Zale, there's no way I'd pick him over Jack Dillon. I might have Bud Taylor higher as well.

[actjac]

Steele should be the pick in Washington but its hard to argue Hostak. In their head-to-head Al knocked Steele out in 1 round.

Harry "Kid" Matthews was an Idaho born boxer but was based in Seattle. ESPN could pick him as Idaho but Kenny Keene was born, raised AND based there. Most of his fights were in Boise where he built a large fan following. I would pick Keene.

[Chuck1052]

Spug Myers, a fighter who was active during the 1920s, was from Pocatello, Idaho.

- Chuck Johnston

[Matt]

Harry (Kid) Matthews is the winner in Idaho. Hard to argue against that. Matthews actually did fight periodically in Idaho to very good crowds, he just could make more money fighting in Seattle and Portland.

[Jaclem]

..chuck1052---pocatello was also the birth place of vicki lester...

[Matt]

Young Firpo from the small mining town of Burke in the Idaho panhandle should get a mention as he beat Tiger Jack Fox and drew with John Henry Lewis. Jimmy Grow was also a pretty good fighter out of Lewiston.

[actjac]

Harry "Kid" Matthews is chosen as Idaho's best. Kenny Keene should have been mentioned in the "other notables" and wasn't.

[JABARDELLI]

In questioning the procedure for ESPN selecting the greatest fighters from each state, one wonders just what that entails and who is on the committee. In a similar "end of the century" Sports Illustrated denomination of the greatest athletes from each state, SI received tremendous criticism for the controversy raised in its endeavors to be objective relative to the process. Picabo Street was rated in Idaho as one of the, if not the, greatest athletes to ever come out of Idaho --- to the chagrin of many Idaho sports historians.

The greatest Idaho fighters include Harry "Kid" Matthews, Young Firpo, Wesley KO Ketchell, Bob Sage, and Mickey Rockson, in addition to Kenny Keane. There is no way that Keene fought the quality of opposition that were faced by Matthews, Young Firpo, Ketchell, Sage or Rockson.

Incidentally, Matthews and Young Firpo were related by marriage. A youthful photo of Matthews in boxing garb, getting his start in southern Idaho as a fighter, was sent to Young Firpo by Matthew's father. An interview with Matthews in the 1970's , Matthews having traversed from Seattle to Wallace, Idaho, to visit an infirm Young Firpo, revealed that Matthew's father's hero was Young Firpo.

If Harry Kid Matthews is considered an Idaho fighter because he was born in Idaho, perhaps Wesley KO Ketchell should also be given consideration although, admittedly, Matthews fought many more Idaho fights than did Ketchell although Ketchell's record may not be complete with respect to his early fights. In truth, however, Ketchell was recognized as an Oregon fighter and Astoria and Portland both laid claim to him at various times during his illustrious career.

In addition to the Washington selection of Freddie Steele as its greatest fighter, one must consider Leo Lomski, Fred Lenhart, and Al Hostak for the honors. Steele and Hostak were both recognized as middleweight champions while Lomski narrowly missed winning the light heavyweight title in a go with Tommy Loughran. Fred Lenhart, a stable mate of Freddie Steele, and who just may have been the greatest fighter to hail from the state of Washington, was never given a title shot.

[JABARDELLI]

ESPN's selected Al Hostak as Washington's greatest fighter? On what basis can ESPN justify that he was a greater fighter than Freddie Steele or, for that matter, Fred Lenhart? Hostak's win over Steele has to be put in the same perspective that Gene Tunney's wins over Jack Dempsey have to be examined when greatness of fighters is being established. Does anyone rank Gene Tunney as a greater fighter than Jack Dempsey even though Tunney defeated Dempsey twice in his career and even though Tunney lost only one fight in his career? The same is true in comparing Steele and Hostack. No doubt about it --- Freddie Steele wins that debate hands down despite the outcome of their fight. As Matt Tegan notes, Steele was at the end of his career when they fought and Steele's manager had passed away. Clearly, at the other end of the spectrum, Hostak was at the zenith of his career when they fought and, as noted, Steele was on the verge of retiring.

I interviewed Freddie Steele in 1983 and inappropriately asked him about the fight with Hostak. I say inappropriately because I thought at the time of the interview that Hostak had knocked Steele out twice and the question I asked Freddie Steele was if Hostak "had his number?" He abruptly told me that Hostak did not have his number but that when he entered the ring with Hostak he was fed up with boxing, was heart broken because Freddie Miller, his manager who had served as a father to him, had died, and his own heart was no longer in boxing.

Selecting Tony Zale for the State of Indiana's greatest fighter is another questionable decision. Zale was not a greater fighter than Jack Dillion. Additionally, he was not as great a fighter as Tiger Jack Fox, either. From the boxing world, however, perhaps none hailing from the state of Indiana made as great an impact on the sport of boxing as did trainer Ray Arcel. Arcel, who considered himself a teacher and not a trainer, hailed from Terre Haute, Indiana. BoxRec states that Fox was born in Indianapolis. I think, however, that Fox was also born in Terre Haute.

However, not to compound the confusion, if Tiger Jack Fox is given recognition as a Spokane, Washington based fighter. If that be the case, forget Steele, Lenhart, and Hostak as the greatest fighter to hail from Washington State. If Fox is a Washington fighter he should be given the honor as the greatest from the State. As noted by Ric, if Jack Dempsey is considered as a Utah based fighter, then the criteria being used, however defined, would seem to place Tiger Jack Fox within the state of Indiana and not Washington.

[Matt]

Bob Montgomery takes South Carolina

[Matt]

Willie Pep is the winner in CT

[Jaclem]

..my ohio trio can beat most of those guys from the other states...

[bjermaine]

btw, i don't think i saw it listed on here but joe louis won detroit. i'm shocked :)

[Matt]

btw, i don't think i saw it listed on here but joe louis won detroit. i'm shocked :)

I'm sure Mayweather fans were dismayed.

[bjermaine]

btw, i don't think i saw it listed on here but joe louis won detroit. i'm shocked :)

I'm sure Mayweather fans were dismayed.

hold on, i meant michigan. i need to go back and learn my cities and states.

[Matt]

Sugar Ray Robinson wins NY

[bjermaine]

Sugar Ray Robinson wins NY

there's no doubt here but mike tyson didn't even get listed in the other notibles section. give me a break.

[Matt]

I think it is ridiculous that they listed Rocky Graziano in the other notables. Graziano is one of the most overrated fighters ever, listing him proving that point.

[bjermaine]

ezzard charles wins ohio.

[Jaclem]

..bejermaine...i already listed ezzard as the greatest, followed by bivins and lloyd marshall.

if we are going to be really strict about it and make it where they were born ..ezzard lived in cincinnati and that's where he's really "from"..but he was born in georgia. (I haven't checked to see who's listed as being from that state, but i'll bet ezzard coud be listed there too.

..whatever....the phenomenal freddie miller..featherweight champion (check his record)..was born in cincinnati so he should get mention here.

[Jaclem]

..oops..just checked and the poster here gives georgia to sugar ray robinson. actually, i thought he was born in valhalla and was out of the competition.

(ring magazine has him as being born in detroit. maybe he was so great that it took three states to produce him.)