2008 Olympic Games Beijing 8.8.08-8.24.08 (with spoilers)

[Canada]

Johnson has been training in Cuba on/off for 6 years.
http://www.jonesbahamas.com/?c=123&a=17956

Interesting I didnt know that. I was wondering how a guy from the Bahamas beat an Eastern European

[DCAmateurBoxing]

Crazy. One of our guys from MT who went to the Olympic trials "only" has about 175-180 bouts and he's 20 now.

You can get a lot of experience in DC area and even more so if you are willing to travel. My son has bout 50 bouts and he's 11.

[Kolya]

Yeah. All we can do out here is travel. He's accumulated that through advancing in tournaments and taking every match he could find; and boxing since he was 8. I think even my guy Thomas has to have 30 bouts or so now and he's only been competing since like 2006 I think.

[locoxelbox]

I was VERY impressed by Vasyl Lomachenko against Bahodirjon Sultonov. Looks like a gold medalist now but he faces the awkward chinese Li Yang next. At the Worlds semi-final last year Yang was up 10-3 at one point then he (rightfully) got two warnings (4 points) and Lomachenko finally won +13-13.

[s9s]

Indian boxer Kumar has just beaten world bantamweight champion Vodopyanov after a tie! Bit of a result there, I think he already beat a decent frenchman in the first round.

[CoreyWash]

man i dont see no kind of boxing on..

[s9s]

man i dont see no kind of boxing on..

If you get onto BBC websites sports page a bit later on they have the Plympic highlights by sport, there has been about 30 mins of boxing highlights everytime I've been on it.

[boxmel]

I was surprised Azea went out so soon, considering how dominant he was at Golden Gloves this year.

Agustama had no business in the GG - this year or ever. He had already qualified for Haiti and to box for two countries is totally against the rules - ours or AIBA's. But, then again, GG has their own rules.

Teddyisms - Box short (the opposite of box tall); throw his jab. I finally had to hit the mute button while watching replays last night.

[emile]

MORE SPOILERS*****************************************








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Raynell Williams is out, losing 9-7 to Khedafi Djelkhir. Arturo Santos of Mexico won his fight quite easily, and will face Djelkhir in the Quarters.

[CoreyWash]

man that sucks that raynell lost..so what are we down to, 4? yanez, andrade, estrada, and wilder? man we have to medal..if we dont get at least one medal its really gonna suck!

[boxmel]

if we dont get at least one medal its really gonna suck!

Depending on what the USOC marker is - it we don't get one or two, USAB's funding gets reduced.

[CoreyWash]

wow that sucks..i still cant believe rau'shee lost in his first fight tho..wow! then the issue with gary russell..this has been a pretty bad olympics for american boxers..hopefully it gets better from here..

[Roberts J]

Williams lost to a French boxer by 2 points. 9-7

[Kolya]

And Sergei Vodopyanov lost. These judges have sucked royally. It's like they're trying to remove anyone who get be a threat to a Chinese "boxer".

[Dennis]

I think two medals is about all we can ask for at this point. I hope we get 3 or 4, but I don't think that is realistic. Heck, we could be lucky to get 1 or 2.

[emile]

And Sergei Vodopyanov lost. These judges have sucked royally. It's like they're trying to remove anyone who get be a threat to a Chinese "boxer".

I think that's a bit much. I haven't seen the fight, but unpredictable results doesn't necessarily mean anything. Otherwise we could have just crowned the Russians and skipped the tournament. Akhil Kumar has a very good fight record. Also, another Chinese fighter lost today, against Gojan of Moldova. (Edited to note that, in fact, Gojan will next face Kumar, so there is nothing here protecting the Chinese)

I watched the Beterbiev fight again, and he fought a shitty fight. Yes, Zhang got away with way too much holding, but Artur didn't help himself much, and to be honest, I thought he was overrated anyway.

[emile]

Also doing well are the Mongolians. Uranchimeg, not one of their most decorated fighters, beat Georgiev very impressively. They just won their first ever individual gold in judo or tae kwon do, but this boxing team might be their best haul yet. Another of their fighters lost just 10-9 to Idel Torriente.

[emile]

Looking back on my first post of the thread - remember that only 3 of the defending World Champions won golds in Athens. Although not nearly this many of them were knocked out so quickly.

[Kolya]

Watching Gojan school that Chinese "boxer" got my hopes up about them maybe having had a talk with the officials about the scoring. And then somehow Kumar defeats Vodopyanov.

It was good to hear though that they had a press conference with that AIBA rep though and that the media tore into him about the scoring. I can just imagine them going back at the officials' meeting and going "Crap, they're onto us. Looks like we have to actually score fairly."

[boxmel]

Watching Gojan school that Chinese "boxer" got my hopes up about them maybe having had a talk with the officials about the scoring. And then somehow Kumar defeats Vodopyanov.

You are implying that "they" are telling the judges who to pick, or should be? Humph.

It was good to hear though that they had a press conference with that AIBA rep though and that the media tore into him about the scoring.

I find that funny since the media hasn't a clue. Terry Smith's inane efforts to try and explain made things worse. Below are my comments to his statements:

saying AIBA's assemblage of the world's best 34 referees and judges is naturally less generous about what constitutes a scoring blow.

That makes sense - except I've seen slaps count.

>Instead, Smith acknowledges a different kind of subjectivity has taken over in which judges are asked to determine results through a total number of scoring punches. The guidelines for judging those punches are fairly vague, and Smith acknowledged >individual officials have their own opinions about what counts.

Terry Smith should wash his mouth out with soap. He just plunged any
understanding of amateur judging into the toilet. If you go totally by the
scoring criteria (which is supposed to be used in EVERY country), there is no subjectivity and no difference in opinions about what counts.

"They've shown preferences, not to a particular person, but to a
particular style of fighting," Smith said.

"Style" is NOT one of the criteria so I have no clue what Terry is talking
about. Frankly, I don't think he does, either.

Smith said AIBA is aware of the public perception that some officials may not have the >reflexes necessary

As he says, it is strictly a perception - not a known. The judges this
year are certainly not much older than 60. Rick and I were tested for
reflexes at the OTC when we were in our 50s. He scored really high and I didn't do too bad, either.

AIBA is attempting to recruit new officials in their 20s to train for
upcoming international tournaments.

Unfortunately, if you start out in your 20's as an AIBA (which is almost
impossible in the U.S.), it still takes 15 or more years to make World
AIBA. So by the time they work the Olympics, they will be in their 50's.
Sigh.

[Kolya]

Yes, Mel, I do believe there's been corruption in the judging; not only in boxing but in other sports as well. This Olympics has been a joke in terms of the favoritism and the decisions being given. USAB officials are better than the AIBAs judging this.

And as an aside, the judging lived up to it's incompetent standard in the Williams bout.

[boxmel]

Yes, Mel, I do believe there's been corruption in the judging;

Please explain your corruption theory. How do you think it's happening?

This Olympics has been a joke in terms of the favoritism and the decisions being given.

Most Olympics are as you describe. It never changes, from Olympics to Olympics, and it never will.

USAB officials are better than the AIBAs judging this

.

Think I'll beg to differ with you on this one.

And as an aside, the judging lived up to it's incompetent standard in the Williams bout.

I plan on watching it tonight.

[Kolya]

I think there's been favoritism shown towards Chinese "boxers" in particular; with the Cubans also getting some favorable scoring. I don't think there's some huge, behind the scenes conspiracy; but I do believe that the Chinese are so desperate to up their medal count that there's been favorable decisions going their way and favorable officiating; much like in Seoul in 1988 (which was an example of how corruptible the system is). Athens was not this bad.

[boxmel]

I think there's been favoritism shown towards Chinese "boxers" in particular; with the Cubans also getting some favorable scoring.

I don't, but let's say you're right. How is the favoritism being shown? And, by the way, I'm sure there are other countries who feel we're getting favoritism.

but I do believe that the Chinese are so desperate to up their medal count that there's been favorable decisions going their way and favorable officiating; much like in Seoul in 1988 (which was an example of how corruptible the system is).

So now you are putting forth the idea that the judging IS corrupt - that the judges might be getting offers of bribes and acting on them? This DID happen in Seoul.

Athens was not this bad.

The biggest change I see this year, and it started to happen in Athens, is the fact that the boxers aren't boxing any more. They are being allowed to hold ad nauseum and wrestle and generally produce extremely sloppy bouts. This is not the amateur boxing that I like.

[Kolya]

The Chinese are being allowed to wrestle, grapple, run; and receive multiple cautions without being warned; as happened the previous night where a Chinese "boxer" was up by 1 and held for the last 15 seconds. I didn't know that bribing had occured in Seoul; and I don't think it's that bad, but I do think that there might have been just a subtle undertone of maybe showing favoritism towards Chinese "boxers". Russia and the USA have been getting bent over a barrel this Olympics.