Why Do Fighters Fighters When They Are Past It?

[TheOneIsHere2008]

The great Ray Robinson losing to journeymen... Larry Holmes losing to Brian Nielsen...Muhammad Ali losing to Trevor Berbick...Evander Holyfield losing to Sultan Ibragimov....Mike Tyson losing to Danny Williams and Kevin McBride...

And why do athletes in general continue to play when they are past it?

Willie Mays shagging fly balls in Shea Stadium or Johnny Unitas gettng bruised and battered in San Diego...

And why do musicians continue to play when they are past it...Elton John's last good work was Goodbye Yellow Brick Road and Nixon was president...Ditto for Paul McCartney...With him it was Band On The Run...

If I go to a dance I hope I'm not the last one to leave...

It just seems sad and purposeless...

[Collins2000]

The great Ray Robinson losing to journeymen... Larry Holmes losing to Brian Nielsen...Muhammad Ali losing to Trevor Berbick...Evander Holyfield losing to Sultan Ibragimov....Mike Tyson losing to Danny Williams and Kevin McBride...

And why do athletes in general continue to play when they are past it?

Willie Mays shagging fly balls in Shea Stadium or Johnny Unitas gettng bruised and battered in San Diego...

And why do musicians continue to play when they are past it...Elton John's last good work was Goodbye Yellow Brick Road and Nixon was president...Ditto for Paul McCartney...With him it was Band On The Run...

If I go to a dance I hope I'm not the last one to leave...

It just seems sad and purposeless...

McCartney was OK until that ridiculous "Coming Up" single. That was total shite, followed by more total shite. I hear he's still putting out albums of total shite.


To answer your questions regarding boxers, I'd say money, obviously. I doubt they'd do it for free.

[TheOneIsHere2008]

The great Ray Robinson losing to journeymen... Larry Holmes losing to Brian Nielsen...Muhammad Ali losing to Trevor Berbick...Evander Holyfield losing to Sultan Ibragimov....Mike Tyson losing to Danny Williams and Kevin McBride...

And why do athletes in general continue to play when they are past it?

Willie Mays shagging fly balls in Shea Stadium or Johnny Unitas gettng bruised and battered in San Diego...

And why do musicians continue to play when they are past it...Elton John's last good work was Goodbye Yellow Brick Road and Nixon was president...Ditto for Paul McCartney...With him it was Band On The Run...

If I go to a dance I hope I'm not the last one to leave...

It just seems sad and purposeless...

McCartney was OK until that ridiculous "Coming Up" single. That was total shite, followed by more total shite. I hear he's still putting out albums of total shite.


To answer your questions regarding boxers, I'd say money, obviously. I doubt they'd do it for free.

I'd rather have an unsullied reputation...But then again nobody is paying me millions to sully my reputation...

I was reading about Ray Robinson's last fight...He lost nine rounds out of ten and was dropped by a fighter who never dropped another fighter before in his career... His last fight before that was against some guy who had six fights and lost four...

[Collins2000]

The great Ray Robinson losing to journeymen... Larry Holmes losing to Brian Nielsen...Muhammad Ali losing to Trevor Berbick...Evander Holyfield losing to Sultan Ibragimov....Mike Tyson losing to Danny Williams and Kevin McBride...

And why do athletes in general continue to play when they are past it?

Willie Mays shagging fly balls in Shea Stadium or Johnny Unitas gettng bruised and battered in San Diego...

And why do musicians continue to play when they are past it...Elton John's last good work was Goodbye Yellow Brick Road and Nixon was president...Ditto for Paul McCartney...With him it was Band On The Run...

If I go to a dance I hope I'm not the last one to leave...

It just seems sad and purposeless...

McCartney was OK until that ridiculous "Coming Up" single. That was total shite, followed by more total shite. I hear he's still putting out albums of total shite.


To answer your questions regarding boxers, I'd say money, obviously. I doubt they'd do it for free.

I'd rather have an unsullied reputation...But then again nobody is paying me millions to sully my reputation...

I was reading about Ray Robinson's last fight...He lost nine rounds out of ten and was dropped by a fighter who never dropped another fighter before in his career... His last fight before that was against some guy who had six fights and lost four...

As Liston said when asked if he thought Patterson should retire following their 2nd fight:

"Who am I to tell a bird it shouldn't fly?"

[TheOneIsHere2008]

But Floyd fought too long and succumbed to pugilist dementia...By the time he passed away he barely remembered he was a world champion...

[Expug]

Once you have felt that adrenalin of winning a fight , you never want to let it go.
Its like a narcotic.
Its hard to walk away from that feeling.
Hard to leave the adulation too.Lots of attention given to a good fighter.
Its tough to go from warrior to nine to fiver.

[Robinson]

They are fighters, It is what they do. Its easy to say your
shot after the fact, but self belief is a great motivator.

Floyd Patterson's condition was most likely caused by blows
in the ring, but I know of people who have family members
that are around his age of death that suffer from the same
ailments. Dementia is sadly common. Its all too easy to blame ones
wear and tear in the ring.

[Ezzard]

For musicians it's what they do... I mean being rich and successful are by-products not the end game. They love doing it.

I guess it's the same for fighters... Also, though, you get to a time in life when you get older and don't want to admit it to yourself. When I was still playing football every clsoe season I would think about quitting but knew that once I did I would never go back. A chapter in my life would be over...

[Robinson]

Time moves too quickly...its hard to accept that.

[AngryGoon38]

They are fighters, It is what they do. Its easy to say your
shot after the fact, but self belief is a great motivator.

Floyd Patterson's condition was most likely caused by blows
in the ring, but I know of people who have family members
that are around his age of death that suffer from the same
ailments. Dementia is sadly common. Its all too easy to blame ones
wear and tear in the ring.

willie pep(300+ bouts) and archie moore(200+).no dementia was suffered by either.jake lamotta(over 100 bouts,many of them quite brutal because of his style,including the severe beating by srr yet no dementia plus the guys still kickin at nearly 90.)Carmen Basilio's another example.79 bouts and alot were punishing and he's still kickin and relatively sharp minded at 81.Lots of other examples of course but these came to mind first so i'll leave it at that for now.

i think there's a bit more to it with dementia.more of a genetics thing.and as for parkinson's while i'm at it,same thing basically.it's more of a genetics thing or pre-destination alot more so than getting hit too much.ali would've eventually gotten it even if he'd had never boxed.....michael j. fox obviously never boxed.

[raylawpc]

They are fighters, It is what they do. Its easy to say your
shot after the fact, but self belief is a great motivator.

Floyd Patterson's condition was most likely caused by blows
in the ring, but I know of people who have family members
that are around his age of death that suffer from the same
ailments. Dementia is sadly common. Its all too easy to blame ones
wear and tear in the ring.

willie pep(300+ bouts) and archie moore(200+).no dementia was suffered by either.jake lamotta(over 100 bouts,many of them quite brutal because of his style,including the severe beating by srr yet no dementia plus the guys still kickin at nearly 90.)Carmen Basilio's another example.79 bouts and alot were punishing and he's still kickin and relatively sharp minded at 81.Lots of other examples of course but these came to mind first so i'll leave it at that for now.

i think there's a bit more to it with dementia.more of a genetics thing.and as for parkinson's while i'm at it,same thing basically.it's more of a genetics thing or pre-destination alot more so than getting hit too much.ali would've eventually gotten it even if he'd had never boxed.....michael j. fox obviously never boxed.

I understand Willie was suffering from dementia when he died.

That said, I am blessed to have several physicians as clients for tax and estate matters. One of my Docs is a neurologist. Of course, he has not studied boxers specifically, but he did tell me on one occasion that current thinking is that boxers who suffer from dementia and other neurological conditions like Parkinson's probably already had a genetic disposition for the condition, and probably would have developed that condition anyway. The repeated blows to the head accelerated the development of the condition.

In otherwords, Jerry Quarry - had he not been a boxer - would have eventually developed Alzheimer's, but much later in life, perhaps in his 70s or 80s. The punches he received as a boxer accelerated the condition. Same thing for Ali and his battle with Parkinson's. Had he never been a boxer, Ali still would have suffered from Parkinson's, but much later in life.

Its an interestng theory.

[observer1]

i guess like guys like Ali and Holmes wanted that "1 extra fight" just so they could be on top and feel they still had it.

Others like Tyson did it for the Payday due to money problems.

[TheOneIsHere2008]

They are fighters, It is what they do. Its easy to say your
shot after the fact, but self belief is a great motivator.

Floyd Patterson's condition was most likely caused by blows
in the ring, but I know of people who have family members
that are around his age of death that suffer from the same
ailments. Dementia is sadly common. Its all too easy to blame ones
wear and tear in the ring.

willie pep(300+ bouts) and archie moore(200+).no dementia was suffered by either.jake lamotta(over 100 bouts,many of them quite brutal because of his style,including the severe beating by srr yet no dementia plus the guys still kickin at nearly 90.)Carmen Basilio's another example.79 bouts and alot were punishing and he's still kickin and relatively sharp minded at 81.Lots of other examples of course but these came to mind first so i'll leave it at that for now.

i think there's a bit more to it with dementia.more of a genetics thing.and as for parkinson's while i'm at it,same thing basically.it's more of a genetics thing or pre-destination alot more so than getting hit too much.ali would've eventually gotten it even if he'd had never boxed.....michael j. fox obviously never boxed.

I understand Willie was suffering from dementia when he died.

That said, I am blessed to have several physicians as clients for tax and estate matters. One of my Docs is a neurologist. Of course, he has not studied boxers specifically, but he did tell me on one occasion that current thinking is that boxers who suffer from dementia and other neurological conditions like Parkinson's probably already had a genetic disposition for the condition, and probably would have developed that condition anyway. The repeated blows to the head accelerated the development of the condition.

In otherwords, Jerry Quarry - had he not been a boxer - would have eventually developed Alzheimer's, but much later in life, perhaps in his 70s or 80s. The punches he received as a boxer accelerated the condition. Same thing for Ali and his battle with Parkinson's. Had he never been a boxer, Ali still would have suffered from Parkinson's, but much later in life.

Its an interestng theory.

I am not a neurologist but I have read a lot on pugilist dementia and the research suggests if you performed CT-Scans on boxers with a lot of fights most fighters would present with abnormal brain scans...But there is a difference between presenting with an abnormal brain scan and having neurological and/or cognitive deficits that would be recognizable by most laymen...


SI hired a panel of experts and did an interesting test in 1980 of Jerry Quarry, Tex Cobb, and another boxer... They all exhibited neurological and cognitive deficits with Jerry Quarry being the most significantly impaired of all of them:

http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/ ... /index.htm


There really should be more research but I suspect boxers don't want to be guinea pigs or labeled as demented, even if all the tests are non-intrusive...

[Robinson]

They are fighters, It is what they do. Its easy to say your
shot after the fact, but self belief is a great motivator.

Floyd Patterson's condition was most likely caused by blows
in the ring, but I know of people who have family members
that are around his age of death that suffer from the same
ailments. Dementia is sadly common. Its all too easy to blame ones
wear and tear in the ring.

willie pep(300+ bouts) and archie moore(200+).no dementia was suffered by either.jake lamotta(over 100 bouts,many of them quite brutal because of his style,including the severe beating by srr yet no dementia plus the guys still kickin at nearly 90.)Carmen Basilio's another example.79 bouts and alot were punishing and he's still kickin and relatively sharp minded at 81.Lots of other examples of course but these came to mind first so i'll leave it at that for now.

i think there's a bit more to it with dementia.more of a genetics thing.and as for parkinson's while i'm at it,same thing basically.it's more of a genetics thing or pre-destination alot more so than getting hit too much.ali would've eventually gotten it even if he'd had never boxed.....michael j. fox obviously never boxed.

I think as DaveV17 suggested once that alot of fighters conditions are related
to how they live outside of the ring..partying hard and fighting hard...that takes
its toll. Alot of hardnosed guys that have taken heavy blows in their careers
seem to be pretty coherent to this day, whereas others who took seemingly
less punishment yet lived it up seem to suffer now.

Genetics has to play a big factor. It is very likely that had Patterson never
fought and lived an unexceptional life he would no doubt have suffered
from dementia. Our hospitals have alot of dementia patients in them, more
at a younger age these days...most of them are long term marijuana users,
others have lived seemingly clean lives yet they still suffer all the same.