David Haye still in the queue...

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2004, 12:14

The Board have made Lee Swaby official challenger to British and Commonwealth cruiserweight champion Mark Hobson.
"It is fantastic news," said Swaby. "It's put a massive smile on my face. People are realising that I'm better than my record now that I am promoted correctly and have people who want to help around me. Now everyone has to wait behind me for a change - there are other contenders out there, David Haye and everyone - but the Board have recognised what I've been doing and have nominated me as the mandatory challenger."
He couldn't resist having a pop at Haye. "Haye's big scheme was to win the British title by the end of this year and I'm here to say I'm not sure that'll happen for him. Once I beat Hobson I'll have a voluntary defence and it won't be against him. Haye had the chance to fight me and even though he said he'd knock me out and all that, he didn't want it when the time came.
"Haye has tried to buy his way to the top, which is fine, I guess. But I won't have him saying he's gonna knock me out and then not follow through with the fight. Once I win the British title I will be very inclined to just make David Haye wait! If I can stick a spanner in his works, I will. Simple as that."

From SecondsOut.com

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 19 Apr 2004, 15:30

What happened with that Haye-Swaby fight? I remember a write up in Boxing News and then, nothing...did i miss something? I am surprised Haye has gone the British route actually, i would have expected him to pick up a phoney title but credit to him for not doing so.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2004, 15:35

steve689 wrote:What happened with that Haye-Swaby fight? I remember a write up in Boxing News and then, nothing...did i miss something? I am surprised Haye has gone the British route actually, i would have expected him to pick up a phoney title but credit to him for not doing so.

Adam Booth, Haye's trainer, said: "At the end of the day, Lion Promotions didn't get things together on time. They failed to get a confirmed TV date, so the bout fell apart. We are in the business to make money and obviously TV is a huge part of the business."

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 19 Apr 2004, 15:43

Hmm, all sounds a bit weird to me.

jameswilson · Post by **jameswilson** » 19 Apr 2004, 15:49

Haye can quite easily get the Mandatory challenge by beating the likes of Rob Norton and Tony Moran.

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 19 Apr 2004, 15:50

Is David turning into the Cruiserweight Audley Harrison? I'm waiting for him to coin the phrase "It's about the world baby"

steve689 · Post by **steve689** » 19 Apr 2004, 15:55

Goz wrote:Is David turning into the Cruiserweight Audley Harrison? I'm waiting for him to coin the phrase "It's about the world baby"

Yep that's why i expected a phoney title was in the pipeline.

dondada · Post by **dondada** » 19 Apr 2004, 16:00

steve689 wrote:
Goz wrote:Is David turning into the Cruiserweight Audley Harrison? I'm waiting for him to coin the phrase "It's about the world baby"
Yep that's why i expected a phoney title was in the pipeline.

No, really disagree with this. At least both Booth and Haye have been very vocal and sounding sincere in saying they want to go the honourable, traditional route, if you get my drift.

Got a laugh out of Haye in BM saying he didn't want any 'KFC' titles!

Goz · Post by **Goz** » 19 Apr 2004, 16:05

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:
steve689 wrote:
Goz wrote:Is David turning into the Cruiserweight Audley Harrison? I'm waiting for him to coin the phrase "It's about the world baby"
Yep that's why i expected a phoney title was in the pipeline.
No, really disagree with this. At least both Booth and Haye have been very vocal and sounding sincere in saying they want to go the honourable, traditional route, if you get my drift.

Got a laugh out of Haye in BM saying he didn't want any 'KFC' titles!

I was only joking, David has a way to go yet before being legitimatly accoused of going the 'safe route'.

Has gone a bit quiet lately though...

dondada · Post by **dondada** » 19 Apr 2004, 16:11

Is in no man's land at the minute, Goz. At least according to Adam Booth. Finding it difficult to get decent domestic opponents. Might have to import some lads who are going to give him some rounds. He needs to be fighting more often but not the Hastings Rasanis of this world. This will do him more harm than good.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2004, 16:31

I've got no sympathy for Haye and Booth. They chose to dump Eugene Maloney and go it alone. They've done a really great job so far.
PS: check out Haye's first four fights under Maloney, then the rest under their own management.

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=155774

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 19 Apr 2004, 17:04

I think David Haye should fight Tony Moran. If he's suitable for a british title shot, then he can face Haye.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2004, 17:08

Haye should fight someone who can stand up.

Southpaw Stylist · Post by **Southpaw Stylist** » 19 Apr 2004, 17:09

He shouldn't be pushed too early in my opinion, but he needs a good opponent, and soon.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2004, 17:18

They need to stick him in with Paul Bonson in a six-rounder; toughies like Denzil Browne and John "Buster" Keeton would also suffice. There are fights out there for Haye.

adamiw · Post by **adamiw** » 19 Apr 2004, 17:21

bennie wrote:PS: check out Haye's first four fights under Maloney, then the rest under their own management.

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=155774

yeah? what's the point you are making. it's not that you think Maloney put him in with tougher opposition is it?

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2004, 17:35

adamiw wrote:
bennie wrote:PS: check out Haye's first four fights under Maloney, then the rest under their own management.

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=155774
yeah? what's the point you are making. it's not that you think Maloney put him in with tougher opposition is it?

Haye fought better opponents in his first four fights under Maloney than he has in his five fights since. He's going backwards in other words. Tony Booth, the French hardman Zairi and Phil Day were the kind of tough, learning opponents you would expect for an ex-amateur star in his early fights.
As for Bowden, Maloney was slated for that match, but maybe Haye deserved an easy night after the hard-earned Zairi win.
Then it all starts to go downhill. Two easy wins led to a light-heavyweight nearly exposing him, and since then he's had two more easy wins. Clearly, they haven't learned the Mock lesson.

adamiw · Post by **adamiw** » 19 Apr 2004, 18:00

think you may be a bit harsh.

Booth was a good opener, he has proved awkward for even high level performers (Omar Sheika). That was a good first step.

Zairi was a very good opponent. He came to fight, took some heavy shots and Haye had to fight at a high tempo.

These 2 fights were ideal.

Bowden. If you have seen the Rahman fight over at max boxing, his opponent is very similar to Bowden. Manager's should know what a fighter is like if they are going to put them against their fighter. It isn;t as if Bowden was ghanian and no one had ever seen him fight. But perhaps that's all they had avaliable.

Day he didn;t do anything that tested Haye in the slightest. But a nice showcase of Haye's talents.

Overall...decent. 2 good, 2 not so good.

The with Booth as his manager.....

Wynn. The camera's were off on this one. Hard to comment. Looking at his record..he was coming off a win, went 6 with the decent James Crawford. Haye blew him out in about a minute. Haye does hit VERY hard...he cant help it.

Gregg Scott Biggs.Not a great opponent admittidly, similar to Phil Day. Haye put a beating on a man, and never got tested. Prospects have these sort of fights...it's not unusual.

Mock. They took a risk with this one, and almost went completely wrong. You can look at it 2 ways. Haye nearly got KOd, and perhaps was fortunate that Mock wasn't able to find the punches to finish the job. Or you can look at it another way, and say that Haye (Wey!) learnt more in that fight than almost all his first 6 fights put together. That could of happened when he was 16-0, his defence exposed. After only 7 fights he can adjust and improve, had this happened further down the road, he may not be able to improve.

Tony Dowling. Alot of people thought Dowling was going to pull the upset. This was for the English title, you can't argue against wanting to win that as a pro with only 7 fights behind him. Haye did a terrific job.

Rasani. The situation was as simple as Rasani or no fight. Haye paid for Rasani to fight him, with his own money...he wanted a fight that much. Had he not gone ahead, his upcoming fight in May would mean it would of been 6 months out of the ring.

I wouldn't say that since Maloney left, the opponents have been neccesarily (never got this one right in my spelling tests!) better, but i wouldn;t say they have been any worse...on the whole. I dont think Maloney leaving has made any real difference to Haye's progression which i feel is faster than most prospects after only 9 fights.

Haye himself is prepared to take risks. He's willing to take on the likes of Mark Hobson and Carl Thompson...they have had alot more experience, and i personally feel Haye still needs a few more fights before he can step in with them. But he is prepared to go in agai st them now..i believe him. He says as a fan of boxing, he cant stand seeing fighters being protected.

sometimes it's very hard to find the ideal opponent, and you aren't left with much. Especially when you are someone who hits as hard as David, people realise they are going in the ring, and will end up getting sparked and dont feel it's worth it.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 19 Apr 2004, 18:14

adamiw wrote:think you may be a bit harsh.

Booth was a good opener, he has proved awkward for even high level performers (Omar Sheika). That was a good first step.

Zairi was a very good opponent. He came to fight, took some heavy shots and Haye had to fight at a high tempo.

These 2 fights were ideal.

Bowden. If you have seen the Rahman fight over at max boxing, his opponent is very similar to Bowden. Manager's should know what a fighter is like if they are going to put them against their fighter. It isn;t as if Bowden was ghanian and no one had ever seen him fight. But perhaps that's all they had avaliable.

Day he didn;t do anything that tested Haye in the slightest. But a nice showcase of Haye's talents.

Overall...decent. 2 good, 2 not so good.

The with Booth as his manager.....

Wynn. The camera's were off on this one. Hard to comment. Looking at his record..he was coming off a win, went 6 with the decent James Crawford. Haye blew him out in about a minute. Haye does hit VERY hard...he cant help it.

Gregg Scott Biggs.Not a great opponent admittidly, similar to Phil Day. Haye put a beating on a man, and never got tested. Prospects have these sort of fights...it's not unusual.

Mock. They took a risk with this one, and almost went completely wrong. You can look at it 2 ways. Haye nearly got KOd, and perhaps was fortunate that Mock wasn't able to find the punches to finish the job. Or you can look at it another way, and say that Haye (Wey!) learnt more in that fight than almost all his first 6 fights put together. That could of happened when he was 16-0, his defence exposed. After only 7 fights he can adjust and improve, had this happened further down the road, he may not be able to improve.

Tony Dowling. Alot of people thought Dowling was going to pull the upset. This was for the English title, you can't argue against wanting to win that as a pro with only 7 fights behind him. Haye did a terrific job.

Rasani. The situation was as simple as Rasani or no fight. Haye paid for Rasani to fight him, with his own money...he wanted a fight that much. Had he not gone ahead, his upcoming fight in May would mean it would of been 6 months out of the ring.

I wouldn't say that since Maloney left, the opponents have been neccesarily (never got this one right in my spelling tests!) better, but i wouldn;t say they have been any worse...on the whole. I dont think Maloney leaving has made any real difference to Haye's progression which i feel is faster than most prospects after only 9 fights.

Haye himself is prepared to take risks. He's willing to take on the likes of Mark Hobson and Carl Thompson...they have had alot more experience, and i personally feel Haye still needs a few more fights before he can step in with them. But he is prepared to go in agai st them now..i believe him. He says as a fan of boxing, he cant stand seeing fighters being protected.

sometimes it's very hard to find the ideal opponent, and you aren't left with much. Especially when you are someone who hits as hard as David, people realise they are going in the ring, and will end up getting sparked and dont feel it's worth it.

Good post. My real beef with Haye's five opponents since splitting with Maloney is that only Mock has taken him past the first round. Four wins out of five in the first round means the man is learning absolutely nothing.
However, Booth, Zairi and Day all took him past the first round. Maloney was giving him 'rounds'. Right now, Haye needs those same 'rounds' desperately.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 19 Apr 2004, 18:16

I seen interviews with Haye, he doesn't want to fight bums, the better guys won't fight him. If they do they want a fortune.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 19 Apr 2004, 18:18

I think you make a fair point, fighters early in their career need to stay busy, and it's going to be hard to get people with ambition in there with haye, as nobody who considers themselves a prospect wants to go in and get bashed up by Haye.

The cruiserweight division in this country is hardly brimming with talent, and in fact of all the weight divisions above featherweight, this one probably has the smallest talent pool as all the ambitious bigger men work out and go up to heavyweight, it does leave Haye in an awkward position.

Somehow though, Macaranelli has managed to do it, possibly because Warren can afford to pay well enough to entice people in there, I don't know, but let's not forget that Macca has been pro a lot longer than Haye.

a lot of the fights Haye is prepared to take against the lies or Macca, Nelson, Thompson, are not really fights he is ready for. He has a big punch of course which always would give him a hope, but he just doesn't have the kind of experience that even someone like Macaranelli has.

I hope Haye can get some decent opponents soon, his career does appear to be a bit on hold right now.

Lefthookhappy19 · Post by **Lefthookhappy19** » 19 Apr 2004, 18:27

Thompson vs Haye, Bombs away. Same with Maca vs Haye. I think Haye might just beat Thompson now but its pretty risky. Thompson was getting bashed up bad by Rothman before the KO. Maybe even Johnny Nelson, I can't see Nelson dodging Haye's punches for long at his age. Haye needs to stop being willing to take a punch just to try and land a perfect counter. Carl Froch has the same problem, Froch can take a punch though but I don't think Haye can, he was stopped a few times in the amatuers.

jamesmcdonnell · Post by **jamesmcdonnell** » 20 Apr 2004, 05:15

Thompson is probably the least risky fight. He's never had the greatest chin, and he's very slow these days, not to mention his stamina appears to be totally shot. The only reason Rothmann lost was he was too busy pratting about when he should have been putting the finishing touches to Thompson, that and the fact that Thompson punches like a gorilla of course.

Nelson would I think take Haye to school, just so experienced, and even though he is old, I reckon he could dance rings around Haye for 12 rounds. He could also hurt him with counters.

Macaranelli v Haye more evenly balanced than their records suggest, but Macaranelli wins because he boxes more.

J · Post by J » 20 Apr 2004, 07:52

haye vs macc is a fans dream and promoting / boxing suicide.
They will meet eventually for a lot more money in 18 months or so, bear in mind Haye has only had 9 fights, cant see it happening just yet, as much as we would love it to Im afraid.

bennie · Post by **bennie** » 20 Apr 2004, 07:54

What has Haye actually done as a pro to secure a fight with Maccarinelli or Thompson? Haye is the Alex Arthur of the cruiserweight division: all hype and, as yet, absolutely no substance. He's fought no-one to justify talk of 'world' title shots. As the Board proved yesterday, he doesn't even justify a straight crack at the British title held by Mark Hobson. I'm not even sure at this stage of his career if he'd beat Hobson. Bruce Scott and Sebastian Rothmann would certainly be formidable opponents for him, whom Maccarinelli and Thompson disposed of to win their 'world' titles.
Haye has yet to fight ANYONE!