MaxBoxing.com - Anyone a member?

[DavidPayne]

? Need someone to check something on PPV content?

It wont break your terms of subscription I promise.

[DavidPayne]

Jist of it is, the Bunce rant about Dougie Fischer at MaxBoxing.com I outlined is being linked to from Dougie Fischer's mailbag and I just like to know what he said about it.

[steve689]

Is that Doug Fischer who does commentary on the Top Rank cards that Setanta broadcast?

He sounds like a prom queen hairdresser. "Oooh, like i gave the round to Cazares purely on agreeeession. Purrr."

Lol, sorry about that

[johnswan1]

Yes, he does sound as though somebody has his balls in a vice.

DP - check your messages.

[DavidPayne]

Cheers John.

I particularly liked my own line - "passable impression of David Ruffin in Sonny Liston's suit".

But self-praise is never popular!

[TheGoods]

I mailed him pissed up winding him up about Buncey's rant and also stating that I was available to get "into it" if him and his mate Steve Kim wanted some on the cobbles action with British writers. To my utter amazement he hit me back within hours with a essay-style response. One word sums up his reaction to the Bunce stuff "SEETHING"

[DavidPayne]

Del.

It was humerous.

[DavidPayne]

Not as humourous as the above spelling but funny all the same.

[TheGoods]

He's only reprinted my full email with his response. Enjoy:

NO POCKETS’ PACKIN’ HEAT

What up Doug?
Long-time reader/subscriber first time writer. Big fan of your work but just wondered if u knew about the Limey giving u a tooling on national TV over in the UK (see below)? The man in question is the tightest boxing journo in the game (he used to be known as Steve 'No Pockets' Bunce on account of his inability to buy a round of drinks) but clearly fancies getting 'into it' with his US brethren. I personally have no time for the guy. His knowledge of the game ain't great and he just likes to hear the sound of his own voice but I'm a freelance fight writer myself (google Derek Bilton) and was just thinking if you wanted a US v UK Contender style beef count me in as I know if I meet the K Hammer he comin' off the worst second place since Mitch Green spoke outta turn to Michael Gerrad Tyson in Harlem back in the day. Holler back and let me know if Kim wants a piece of this tea-drinking, jab slipping MoFon from God's Country.

http://boxingwriter.wordpress.com/2008/ ... ff-on-one/

-- Derek

Steve Bunce has a conniption fit because I bring up Nonito Donaire as a possible future opponent for Ivan Calderon, and then goes on to basically trash all US commentators. David Payne writes that he would "... back big Buncey over 4×2’s" if Bunce and I were to engage in the manly art of self defense. And now you call out Steve Kim! Geez, if I wasn't such a dumb, talentless American slob I'd guess that you Brits have a Big Ben-sized chip on your shoulders when it comes to us Yanks.

A "US v UK Contender style beef" between boxing writers? Um, yeah, I don't want to speak for my peers, but I don't see this happening. I think we're all a bit too busy, you know, covering the sport. LOL. I’m just messin’ with ya, I know you’re joking (at least I hope you are).

But seriously, I honestly have no idea what Bunce was so upset about. So I brought up Donaire's name as a possible opponent for Calderon. So what? The YouTube clip doesn't show the entire post-fight interview I did with Calderon, but I'd already asked him about fighting Archie Solis and Brian Viloria – perhaps the only other names at 108 pounds (where Iron Boy is champ) – and he pooh-poohed both guys. So I brought up the best name (at least here in the States) at 112 pounds: Donaire. I know it's a tall order, and I said so during the interview, but Calderon to his credit said the next big challenge for him would be to step up to flyweight. However, first he'd want to fight unbeaten WBO titlist Omar Narvaez (which is fine with me).

Anyway, all Bunce could do for post-fight commentary was try to disrespect me and then lash into all US broadcasters. Why? I don't recall any US broadcasters trashing UK commentators, and I doubt US fans are dissing British commentators. None of the fans in American know who any of the UK broadcasters are. Is that it? Is Bunce mad that UK boxing fans know my name while US fans have no idea who he is?

The thing I noticed (at least with what I saw on the YouTube video) is that once Bunce stopped ranting about me (like anyone watching really gives a rat's ass about me or about what "Buncey" thinks of my interviewing skills) and he finally began commenting on the actual fight, he really had no idea what he was talking about.

He said the fight was "Brilliant". Really? I thought it was a once-sided match that ended prematurely.

He acted like it was an impossible task for Calderon to fight a flyweight. Really? Hey, Buncey! What the hell do you think Cazares was!? S__t, Cazares should be fighting at 115 pounds! The fact that the Mexican weighs 130 pounds on fight night should tell anyone who has a clue about boxing that he's not a real 108 pounder.

Then Bunce says the promoters know better than the "purists" (yeah right, that's why Amir Khan just got KTFO) and that the “right fight” to make is a THIRD bout between Calderon and Cazares.

WTF!!!???

Good lord, who the hell wants to see them go at again!!!!???? You couldn't sell that fight in Puerto Rico or Los Mochis, Mexico. Nobody would touch it in the US.

And I tell you what. If you took Donaire-Calderon to Ken Hershman of Showtime or Kerry Davis of HBO, I bet you one of them (Hershman) would at least seriously consider buying it. If you took Calderon-Cazares III to Telefutura or Telemundo I bet they'd tell you get the f__k out of their office.

If Bunce really wants to know what promoters would do with a talented but very small and low-profile champ like Calderon, he should calm down and talk to Peter Rivera, Iron Boy's promoter, or to Bob Arum, who promotes a number of world-class sub-banties out there, and ask them what they would do. He might actually learn something.

[johnswan1]

It's fair enough that he is defending himself with regards to Bunces comments, but Doug sure does appear to be taking himself way too seriously these days. I remember in one mail bag some guy was calling him a geek and he start printing the phone number for some trainer at a gym he used to go to, as proof that he could hit hard..... Also in one recently some bloke was laughing at how he looked on TV with a suit too tight for him and he came back telling the guy something along the lines of "it's not my fault I'm barrell chested and that my body is more muscular than yours"... eh.. what?

[My T Sharp]

Cheers John.

I particularly liked my own line - "passable impression of David Ruffin in Sonny Liston's suit".

But self-praise is never popular!

Not sure about the following line "a reference for the older reader"

I'm 31 and I know who the Ruff is...I guess I'm old then

[jamesmcdonnell]

He's only reprinted my full email with his response. Enjoy:

NO POCKETS’ PACKIN’ HEAT

What up Doug?
Long-time reader/subscriber first time writer. Big fan of your work but just wondered if u knew about the Limey giving u a tooling on national TV over in the UK (see below)? The man in question is the tightest boxing journo in the game (he used to be known as Steve 'No Pockets' Bunce on account of his inability to buy a round of drinks) but clearly fancies getting 'into it' with his US brethren. I personally have no time for the guy. His knowledge of the game ain't great and he just likes to hear the sound of his own voice but I'm a freelance fight writer myself (google Derek Bilton) and was just thinking if you wanted a US v UK Contender style beef count me in as I know if I meet the K Hammer he comin' off the worst second place since Mitch Green spoke outta turn to Michael Gerrad Tyson in Harlem back in the day. Holler back and let me know if Kim wants a piece of this tea-drinking, jab slipping MoFon from God's Country.

http://boxingwriter.wordpress.com/2008/ ... ff-on-one/

-- Derek

Steve Bunce has a conniption fit because I bring up Nonito Donaire as a possible future opponent for Ivan Calderon, and then goes on to basically trash all US commentators. David Payne writes that he would "... back big Buncey over 4×2’s" if Bunce and I were to engage in the manly art of self defense. And now you call out Steve Kim! Geez, if I wasn't such a dumb, talentless American slob I'd guess that you Brits have a Big Ben-sized chip on your shoulders when it comes to us Yanks.

A "US v UK Contender style beef" between boxing writers? Um, yeah, I don't want to speak for my peers, but I don't see this happening. I think we're all a bit too busy, you know, covering the sport. LOL. I’m just messin’ with ya, I know you’re joking (at least I hope you are).

But seriously, I honestly have no idea what Bunce was so upset about. So I brought up Donaire's name as a possible opponent for Calderon. So what? The YouTube clip doesn't show the entire post-fight interview I did with Calderon, but I'd already asked him about fighting Archie Solis and Brian Viloria – perhaps the only other names at 108 pounds (where Iron Boy is champ) – and he pooh-poohed both guys. So I brought up the best name (at least here in the States) at 112 pounds: Donaire. I know it's a tall order, and I said so during the interview, but Calderon to his credit said the next big challenge for him would be to step up to flyweight. However, first he'd want to fight unbeaten WBO titlist Omar Narvaez (which is fine with me).

Anyway, all Bunce could do for post-fight commentary was try to disrespect me and then lash into all US broadcasters. Why? I don't recall any US broadcasters trashing UK commentators, and I doubt US fans are dissing British commentators. None of the fans in American know who any of the UK broadcasters are. Is that it? Is Bunce mad that UK boxing fans know my name while US fans have no idea who he is?

The thing I noticed (at least with what I saw on the YouTube video) is that once Bunce stopped ranting about me (like anyone watching really gives a rat's ass about me or about what "Buncey" thinks of my interviewing skills) and he finally began commenting on the actual fight, he really had no idea what he was talking about.

He said the fight was "Brilliant". Really? I thought it was a once-sided match that ended prematurely.

He acted like it was an impossible task for Calderon to fight a flyweight. Really? Hey, Buncey! What the hell do you think Cazares was!? S__t, Cazares should be fighting at 115 pounds! The fact that the Mexican weighs 130 pounds on fight night should tell anyone who has a clue about boxing that he's not a real 108 pounder.

Then Bunce says the promoters know better than the "purists" (yeah right, that's why Amir Khan just got KTFO) and that the “right fight” to make is a THIRD bout between Calderon and Cazares.

WTF!!!???

Good lord, who the hell wants to see them go at again!!!!???? You couldn't sell that fight in Puerto Rico or Los Mochis, Mexico. Nobody would touch it in the US.

And I tell you what. If you took Donaire-Calderon to Ken Hershman of Showtime or Kerry Davis of HBO, I bet you one of them (Hershman) would at least seriously consider buying it. If you took Calderon-Cazares III to Telefutura or Telemundo I bet they'd tell you get the f__k out of their office.

If Bunce really wants to know what promoters would do with a talented but very small and low-profile champ like Calderon, he should calm down and talk to Peter Rivera, Iron Boy's promoter, or to Bob Arum, who promotes a number of world-class sub-banties out there, and ask them what they would do. He might actually learn something.

I think Doug covered himself pretty well here, why was Buncey getting so steamed up anyway, what's the big frigging deal? I'm pretty sure Doug knows a hell of a lot more about the US boxing scene and the lighter weight categories in general than Steve does, he will have seen all of those guys fights I'm pretty sure.

[Autobarn]

Have to say, Bunce goes OTT again. Is it about the fight, or is it about Buncey?

Maybe Fisher asked a slightly silly question. I mean why would Calderon - a tiny former strawweight - fight Donaire? Donaire, a massive flyweight, really a super flyweight. Yes, Bunce is right - it isn't worth the risk for Calderon, and it won't happen because Calderon is smaller than most light flyweights, probably.

However isn't it the duty of a TV interviewer to try and hype up tasty fights?

Was Dougie supposed to say, "Listen Ivan. This makes sense! Fight Cazares again for decent money. Trust me, it's better than pie 'n maish! Have an easy tune up first. This is what boxing's about. Bidness! The fans will buy this, because this was inconclusive! You can school this guy, but you can fool the fans into thinking that a rubber match will be meaningful."

(One flaw in that: Cazares couldn't even make light flyweight this time, could he? Does that kill off a 3rd fight?)

I think Buncey was having a fit about the Internet in general and the flak that some grumpy posters may have said about him. So maybe he vents on Fisher, the leading Internet presence for boxing coverage. I don't think it's very professional to vent like that on live TV. Personally, I tuned out because the picture quality was abysmally shaky.

[DavidPayne]

It was all entertaining and I think we all know DF knows his stuff. But I think Steve would argue he knows it a little too well, if you know what I mean.

[chinny]

IMO Dougie is a much better writer than Bunce, but on TV Bunce has 'it' and Dougie struggles, if only becasue of his pipsqueak voice.

Dougie's mailbags are essential reading.

I like that Bunce posts and stands up for himself on the ESB Brit forum, but over the last week or so he's had a pop at internet writers in general and has really come a cropper.

Contrast Bunce on setanta with the turgid 'he'll be disappointed with that' crap you get from football TV pundits (or Barry on ITV boxing for that matter) and we really should appreciate him while we have him.

[Autobarn]

It was all entertaining and I think we all know DF knows his stuff. But I think Steve would argue he knows it a little too well, if you know what I mean.

I can see why Bunce complained. Dougie must have known full well that Calderon v Donaire is highly unlkely.

Calderon made like 20 defences vs midgets, bums, and the odd decent fighter, then found his major rival. He's not going to start taking bigger risks than the dangerous Cazares.

But not long ago, ppl were saying Bunce didn't know his stuff. The first Setanta night (when they became serious about boxing), McGuigan and Maloney were in the studio picking everything Bunce said to pieces in ill tempered critiques, Maloney saying "Bunce should retire from commentating." I disagreed with Maloney and McGuigan, fel they let themselves down on air that time. But I also feel Bunce went too far on Fisher.



I agree, Chinny, Dougie is a better writer than Bunce. Doug's mailbag's are top drawer - his arguments with "Roy Boys" and "Pretty Boys" are classic - and so are his features an his concise fight reports. However, Bunce is a natural TV personality, which Fisher isn't. I have respect for both men. Few can make a living in boxing journalism.

[Twinkle Toes]

Appears to me that Buncey is jealous of Fischer.

Fischer has done pretty well for himself and has made the transition from online to ringside - I can see that not sitting to well with people like Buncey.

[el_grande_mauro_mina]

I remember Payney writing an email to Buncey once and Buncey came back with a
seething response and a lot of it was based around 'internet hacks' who couldn't write
their way our of a paper bag and how the man himself travelled up and down the country
writing about small hall shows in places like Darlington for chump change. That he had paid
his dues and deserved his name in lights.

The email Payney sent at the time had a ton of gravitas as Buncey had a way of over-sensationalizing
a written piece back in the day. I would read his articles and think 'WTF' But I think Buncey has a dislike
of internet writers making a name for themselves in boxing writing where he doesn't think they have paid
their dues - an opinion shared by Claude Abrahams by all accounts.

The internet has changed boxing journalism for the better. Simple as that really. Payne, Dooley, McNeilly etc
are as good if not better than Flexen, Abrahams and the Connolly's.

I like Bunce as a TV commentator a great deal - he is far better behind a mike than he is behind a keyboard.

[hitman_hatton1]

ha ha loved that bit at the end of buncey's rant.

"what a stupid comment"

just the way he says it.

cracked me up. DD

[Gray-Fox]

I like both men, but Fischer's knowledge of the current world scene is better than Bunce's and he doesn't exaggerate as much so as to confuse the public.

[stujones]

First time I have seen the interview, personally I think Bunce is a tad out of order.... nice to see him big up Darke and Watt from a rival TV show (Duke McKenzie though?).

However, personally I don't think Calderon vs Donaire is a laughable joke of a fight, okay there is a bit of a size difference, but its not like Calderon is a massive puncher who will lose that power moving up.

Bunce wasn't calling Pacquiao vs Diaz a silly fight, and that was a one time Super Flyweight moving up to Lightweight...... against a big Lightweight at that. Some people were calling Mayweather vs DLH a silly fight.... but who won that one again?