Classic American West Coast Boxing

[bennie]

Ali had no business fighting Norton again. He whipped himself into great shape but, even in shape, struggled to impress and took some heavy punches, especially to the body. They say fighters are the last to know when it's all over but actually they are the first. Ali must have known he didn't have it any more after training so hard.
He opted for oblivion.

[kikibalt]

[kikibalt]

Arnie Koslow
Long time So-Cal timekeeper

[bennie]

Pitalua vs. Valero: Another Meza-Garza?
By Ted Sares

Antonio Pitalua, a Colombian who lives in and does all of his fighting out of Mexico City has a record of 46 (KO 40)-3 and a lofty KO percentage of 81.63. Twenty-nine of his stoppage wins have come in three rounds or less. He has stopped his last fourteen opponents in a row including the highly regarded Jose Armando Santa Cruz just this past weekend. Pitalua, 38 years old, won the interim version of the WBC lightweight title with an impressive sixth round upset win over the much younger Santa Cruz.

In 2001, he lost a SD to tough Arnulfo “Chico” Castillo, 33-1-3 coming in, and in 2000, he dropped a close twelve round decision in Germany to Artur Grigorian, 30-0 at the time. At stake was the WBO lightweight title. One of his early victories came against Cosme Rivera who gave Andre Berto all he could handle. Another came against Saul “Baby” Duran, but mostly his opposition has been less than stellar. Still, an 82% KO percentage is nothing to sneeze at. Make no mistake, Pitalua can throw bricks..

Now, according to WBC president Don Jose Sulaiman, Pitalua will be matched to fight another KO artist, Edwin Valero for the WBC lightweight championship.

Meza-Garza

If this fight is, in fact, made, the potential for another Juan “Kid“ Meza-Jaime Garza classic presents itself. As aficionados will recall, Garza, was 40-0, with 38 knockouts (13 in the first round). "Kid" Meza, from Los Angeles, by way of Mexicali, was 49-9, with 37 KO’s. When they met back in 1984, most experts felt the heavy handed Garza would do the trick. But it was not to be. After being put on the canvas for the very first time in his 47-fight career early in the first round, “The Kid” came back and positioned himself to hook with the hooker. His got there first and that was that. Meza had beaten Garza to the punch with shocking effect. The icing was named 1984’s Knockout of the Year by KO Magazine.

Valero

Edwin “Dinamita” Valero is a Venezuelan, but like the Columbian born Pitalua, does much of his fighting out of another country--in his case Tokyo. His KO percentage is a perfect 100 having stopped all 24 of his opponents, some 19 in the first round. And like Pitalua, his level of opposition has been less than compelling. More importantly, he has only fought 49 rounds or an average of 2.04 per fight. Against a veteran like Antonio (who has 221 rounds under his belt), this could prove very troublesome.

Both fighters have been decked in their career. Valero was knocked down in the third round against Panamanian Vicente “El Loco” Mosquera, 24-1-1, before stopping Mosquera in the tenth round in a savage 2006 brawl (Valero‘s toughest fight to date). Valero’s wide punches also leave him open to short counters. In this regard, Pitalua should study the films of Valero’s fight against Genaro Trazancos (also in 2006) where many of his vulnerabilities were in evidence even though he won in two less than compelling rounds.

As for Pitalua, he was stopped by Jesus Rodriquez back in 1995 in a fight for the WBC Continental Americas lightweight title, but that was thirteen years ago.

So hopefully the stage is set. A 38 year old veteran with very heavy hands coming off a stunning KO victory over Santa Cruz vs. a heavy handed world champion who has yet to taste defeat. A fight tha features two lightweight bombers who can end a fight at any time, usually in the early rounds.

If this fight is made, it should be called “Don’t blink,” because if you do, you may well miss the ending. Neither fighter will add many rounds to his record in this one; bet on it!

I don't think Valero is allowed to fight in the States, for neurological reasons.
I wonder if Pitalua is the son of Alfredo Pitalua, who fought Jim Watt over here. He was killing Watt but couldn't keep up the pace.

[kikibalt]

Photo courtesy of Hap Navarro


Max Baer and his original manager, Hamilton Lorimer (who also happened to be his early employer) about to board their fancy vintage auto, parked in front of Dempsey's old Manhattan Gym on Spring street, in L.A. circa 1930.

[kikibalt]

Photo courtesy of Hap Navarro


The brothers Baer, clowning in Morrie Cohan's (Pasadena) hotel room in 1935.

[kikibalt]

Photo courtesy of Hap Navarro


Art Aragon

[kikibalt]

Photos courtesy of Hap Navarro


A rarely seen photo of Manuel Ortiz's kid brother, Trini Ortiz, circa 1943.
The boy only had a few bouts, nothing extraordinary.

[bennie]

Photo courtesy of Hap Navarro


Max Baer and his original manager, Hamilton Lorimer (who also happened to be his early employer) about to board their fancy vintage auto, parked in front of Dempsey's old Manhattan Gym on Spring street, in L.A. circa 1930.

If you've got it, flaunt it.

[Zelley]

Hey Zelley, this name is like a blast from the past and I gotta ask you, dude. When I first started reading boxing mags around '73 there was this one dude named Brian Zelley, also from B.C. who was always writing into International and World Boxing at the time. As I recall he was a huge Jose Napoles fan. Am I conversing with the same fan?

Scartissue[/quote]

As a follow-up, I did have a "Rings Around The World" piece
in the May 1980 issue of "The Ring", page 62.

Part of the piece was as follows:

"VICTORIA - Professional boxing will be revived here after a 19-year void following the approval by City Council to form a Victoria Boxing Commission.

Only one pro boxer resides in victoria at the present time. Jerry (Mack Truck) Reddick
of Halifax, Nova Scotia who has adopted Victoria as his base .....

Throughout the 1960's and 1970's boxing was kept alive on the amateur level.
Two top clubs were the London Boxing Club (which terminated in 1976) and the
Victoria Athletic Association" - Brian Zelley.

I met with Reddick a number of times to talk boxing. But, after a while he moved on.

During this period, there was also pro boxing in Nanaimo and Vancouver.
The main draw in Nanaimo was heavyweight Gordie Racette.

Leon Spinks came to Nanaimo for a fight. But, the treatment this Olympic Champion
and former heavyweight champion received was a disgrace and a stain on the
reputation of the City of Nanaimo. The fight never took place, and Leon was left
walking down the street with bags in hand like some unwanted drifter.

Trevor Berbick came to Victoria to work out in a local amateur club.
But, that's another story.

[scartissue]

I was never much of a Leonard fan myself. He had great ability and developed some real power (he couldn't break an egg in his early years) but, yes, he wanted an edge in every fight and never fought outside of north America as a pro.
Leonard lost twice overseas as an amateur.

Bennie, I too was no fan of leonard. I will never deny his greatness because he was one of the best. However, I too felt he got the 'edge' in certain fights. He could get by quite well on his talents, but a couple of times he was given the nod because...well, he was Ray. The Benitez fight annoyed me. He was going to get the decision but it was close and obviously no one knew how it would be rendered. He drops Benitez in the 15th, Benitez gets up and Leonard lets three punches fly, which Benitez ducks and dodges all three. Suddenly Carlos Padilla jumps in and stops the fight with seconds remaining. Oh did that piss me off! Secondly, the Kalule fight. It was a close fight. Leonard was ahead but Kalule had his best round in the 8th. Never mind what is officially reported as 2:59 of the 9th round. It wasn't. Kalule got dropped, got up, but the bell never rang. It was 3:06 when the fight was stopped and by claiming it was 2:59 only underscores what was done. The 2nd Hearns fight. Come on! Also, I will always dispute the decision of the Hagler fight. It just felt to me like he always got a bit of an edge.

Scartissue

[Expug]

I thought it was classless, when Ray called that big circus together and brought Marvin Hagler to seemingly annpounce there fight .I dont remember where it was, but Ray gets up there in the ring and Marvin and the Petronellis are in the crowd expecting to hear that there is gonna be a mega fight between the two.
Ray gets up there and says , "
Marvin and I would be a great fight, unfortunately it will never happen".
Hagler and his crew felt jerked around . Rightly so.
Ray was a very narccisistic guy.

[Rick Farris]

To Scartissue:

Yes, you are correct, but my ealiest piece was a contribution
in the old "Ring Magazine" In Rings Around The World" it was in the Sixties
and it was only reporting on a junior novice boxing tournament in Vancouver, go figure!

In 1972, while meeting Manuel Gonzalez, at the near end of his boxing years.
I cobbled together a few lines that were printed in the Nanaimo Daily Free Press.

In Lee Kerr's "Boxing Illustrated" column, I did a piece on the yardsticks for
measuring greatness. Also, in one column, he had nicknames for boxers
published. My entry was for Dick Tiger "The Biafran Banger".

The Sound Off days in World and International Boxing in the Seventies
were quite interesting. Often the arguments focused on Jerry Quarry and Muhammed Ali.

Funny thing about Quarry, it may have been at the 1968 Seattle Golden Gloves
because Boone Kirkman was from nearby Renton and attended the fights. Well he happened to be staying on the same floor as the B. C. team. Our light-heavyweight, was jogging down the hall, as Jerry ( and i think Dave Centi) were leaving a room, and he ran into Quarry. He said it was like running into a brick wall. Anyway, he wasn't one of our team winners.

For those that care about such things, I have updated the thread
BOXING: CHAMPIONS & CONTENDERS (1950 - 1959).
The theme is rock and roll, but all about boxing in the Fifties. :idea:[/quote]



_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________


About Jerry Quarry & Dave Centi . . .

Zelley . . . Welcome to this thread! You mentioned Quarry and Dave Centi. I write a lot about Jerry Quarry because I was very close to him, however, his friend and sparring partner Centi is a name that rarely pops up. I have some vivid memories of Quarry sparring sessions at the old Main St. Gym in L.A. In one such session, Dave Centi was wearing a special headgear that protected his nose that Quarry had busted a few weeks earlier. We used to call that type of headguard a "birdcage" because it had a steel bar that ran down from the top of the forehead pad to the chin pad, more of a helmet. During the sparring session, Jerry drilled Centi with a stright right cross that crashed into the face bar with such impact that the bar dislodged from the padding and impaled Centi's forhead. I have to say the sight of Jerry's trainer Teddy Bentham pulling that metal "spear" out of the front of Centi's skull was something I'll never forget. A memory that stands out most in my mind is something I saw up close many, many times, and that was Jerry Quarry's explosive punching power.

-Rick Farris

[Zelley]

About Jerry Quarry & Dave Centi . . .

Zelley . . . Welcome to this thread! You mentioned Quarry And Dave Centi. I write a lot about Jerry Quarry becasue I was very close to him, however, his friend and sparring partner Centi is a name that rarely pops up. I have some vivid memories of Quarry sparring sessions at the old Main St. Gym in L.A. In one such session, Dave was wearing a special headgear that protected his nose that Quarry had busted a few weeks earlier. We used to call those type headguards a "birdcage" because it had a steel bar that ran down from the top of the forehead pad to the chin. During the sparring session, Jerry drilled Centi with a stright right cross that crashed into the face bar with such impact that the bar dislodged from the padding and impaled Centi's forhead. I have to say the sight of Jerry's trainer Teddy Bentham pulling that metal "spear" out of the front of Centi's skull was something I'll never forget.

-Rick Farris

Thanks Rick for providing more detail on Dave Centi.

Hopefully, we can add a few more lines on the life and times of Dave Centi.
I think he faced Jerry and Chuck Wepner.

One regret, is the Jerry Quarry vs Boone Kirkman bout never took place,
My understanding is Boone's sparring partner Wes Craven injured Boone in a sparring session.
Craven, from Seattle, was an exciting and explosive fighter. I remember Wes scoring
a knockout in the Golden Gloves in Vancouver. He bobbed and weaved under a left jab
and exploded with a short right for a one punch knockout over a boxer from Prince Georgie.

[raylawpc]

About Jerry Quarry & Dave Centi . . .

Zelley . . . Welcome to this thread! You mentioned Quarry And Dave Centi. I write a lot about Jerry Quarry becasue I was very close to him, however, his friend and sparring partner Centi is a name that rarely pops up. I have some vivid memories of Quarry sparring sessions at the old Main St. Gym in L.A. In one such session, Dave was wearing a special headgear that protected his nose that Quarry had busted a few weeks earlier. We used to call those type headguards a "birdcage" because it had a steel bar that ran down from the top of the forehead pad to the chin. During the sparring session, Jerry drilled Centi with a stright right cross that crashed into the face bar with such impact that the bar dislodged from the padding and impaled Centi's forhead. I have to say the sight of Jerry's trainer Teddy Bentham pulling that metal "spear" out of the front of Centi's skull was something I'll never forget.

-Rick Farris

Thanks Rick for providing more detail on Dave Centi.

Hopefully, we can add a few more lines on the life and times of Dave Centi.
I think he faced Jerry and Chuck Wepner.

One regret, is the Jerry Quarry vs Boone Kirkman bout never took place,
My understanding is Boone's sparring partner Wes Craven injured Boone in a sparring session.
Craven, from Seattle, was an exciting and explosive fighter. I remember Wes scoring
a knockout in the Golden Gloves in Vancouver. He bobbed and weaved under a left jab
and exploded with a short right for a one punch knockout over a boxer from Prince Georgie.

I never knew Kirkman and Quarry were scheduled to fight. When and where was the fight supposed to take place?

[Zelley]

They were not scheduled to fight, but there was word in boxing circkes that arrangements were
trying to be made. I guess if somebody could connect with Boone Kirkman today
maybe we could get the full story.

[kikibalt]

Henry Cooper, British and Empire Heavyweight Champion poses with Former Twice Heavyweight Champion of the World Floyd Patterson, and British heavyweight Billy Walker at Isow's Restaurant in Soho. Cooper and Patterson will meet in the ring at Wembley Stadium on 20 September. Billy Walker is scheduled to fight Dick Wipperman on the undercard.

[kikibalt]

Matthew Hilton, Light Middleweight, Circa 1985

[kikibalt]

Archie Moore & Mickey Walker
12 September 1955

[Rick Farris]

They were not scheduled to fight, but there was word in boxing circkes that arrangements were
trying to be made. I guess if somebody could connect with Boone Kirkman today
maybe we could get the full story.

A Boone Kirkman memory . . .

In the mid 60's, Boone Kirkman came up as a young heavyweight in the Pacific Northwest at the same time Jerry Quarry was making name for himself in Los Angeles. One of my first memories of Boone Kirkman, is a full page photo of Kirkman, and his legendary manager, Jack "Deacon" Hurley that graced the cover of Boxing Illustrated in 1966. Kirkman was sitting on a stool, in his trunks and gloved up, a tattoo etched on his upper arm, with Hurley leaning over him from behind whispering advice into his ear.

Of course, the shot was staged. Boone had a "hungry" scowl on his face and the "Deacon's" sharp eyes blazed behind glasses, probably dreaming of the potential value of a white heavy contender in the Ali era. I read the article more than forty years ago, and later would learn about Jack Hurley from my future trainer, Mel Epstein. Kirkman, of course, didn't reach the level of Jerry Quarry. I last saw Boone in the ring when he became part of that "five opponent circus" that faced George Foreman, all in one afternoon, sometime after Ali had guilded big George in that "Rumble in the Jungle". Like the other heavyweight runner-ups that stepped in with Foreman that day, Boone Kirkman was spanked and sent home via the canvas.

-Rick Farris

[Rick Farris]

Henry Cooper, British and Empire Heavyweight Champion poses with Former Twice Heavyweight Champion of the World Floyd Patterson, and British heavyweight Billy Walker at Isow's Restaurant in Soho. Cooper and Patterson will meet in the ring at Wembley Stadium on 20 September. Billy Walker is scheduled to fight Dick Wipperman on the undercard.

I was always a fan of Floyd Patterson. A lot of this had to do with a book I read in Jr. High School, "Victory Over Myself", Patterson's biography that was written shortly before he lost the title to Sonny Liston. Floyd's fight with Cooper took place shortly after both had lost to Muhammad Ali, in title defenses the previous year. I saw the fight when it happened and Floyd took out Cooper in the 4th round after flooring him three times.

Cooper was another favorite, but not until much later when I came to learn about Henry, and his gifted left hook, which could take off any head that strayed into it's path during a match. Even a young Cassius Clay's. During a trip to the U.K. years back, I found a book on Cooper's life while rummaging thru a shop in Devon. The book was titled, "Our 'Enry", and it was a great read. Today it sits with the best in my fistic library.

-Rick

[Rick Farris]

Amos "Big Train" Lincoln . . .

I was just twelve when I saw this former heavy contender, and Sonny Liston sparring partner (and future opponet) fight at the Olympic Auditorium in L.A. I remember trying to convince anybody to take me to his fight with Thad Spencer at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium in the mid-60's, after seeing him win at the Olympic over Chuck Leslie. However, nobody close to me shared my interest in the match. Eventually, I'd get to see Lincoln training at the Main Street Gym. I also recall sitting as close as I could to where Lincoln was visiting with some gym touts sitting on the bleachers. I heard them discussing Sonny Liston's early exit against Ali in Lewiston, a fight that "Big Train" had been a Liston sparring partner. "We knew Sonny wasn't going to win. He never trained, and when we boxed he wasn't motivated to anything more than going thru the motions. We knew Sonny was up to something, and we all made bank by betting on the kid from Louisville, especially Sonny."

-Rick

[dagosd2000]

TO EACH HIS OWN

I remember going to the CREA GYM in Tijuana to watch Julio Chavez fine tune himself for his defense against Danilo Cabrera. The old gym under the bleachers of the stadium was packed with fans who wanted to see their hero train. Julio Cesar spareed lightly ,hit the heavy bag,shadow boxed,and did his floor exercises. I was very interested watching him and how the fans were enthralled by his presence. Then I heard a couple of fans talking with each other off to the side. They were talking about how Chavez didn't skip rope. He wasn't good at it and didn't like doing it. It wasn't a part of his training routine.

Boxing is as funny a sport as any other. Here's the great J.C. Chavez at the pinnacle of his career never incorporating the jump rope as part of his workout. I think later when Emmanuel Stewart worked with him,he made him jump rope. Oh well. I figure it didn't make any difference.

Some football teams work in aerobics with their training thinking it enhances footwork and coordination. Jim Jeffries would lift one of his steers to build up power and strength. Lou Nova practiced yoga.Rocky Balboa chased a chicken. I guess if it works,don't change it. And if it doesn't,don't mess with it even if all the others are doing it.

[Rick Farris]

TO EACH HIS OWN

I remember going to the CREA GYM in Tijuana to watch Julio Chavez fine tune himself for his defense against Danilo Cabrera. The old gym under the bleachers of the stadium was packed with fans who wanted to see their hero train. Julio Cesar spareed lightly ,hit the heavy bag,shadow boxed,and did his floor exercises. I was very interested watching him and how the fans were enthralled by his presence. Then I heard a couple of fans talking with each other off to the side. They were talking about how Chavez didn't skip rope. He wasn't good at it and didn't like doing it. It wasn't a part of his training routine.

Boxing is as funny a sport as any other. Here's the great J.C. Chavez at the pinnacle of his career never incorporating the jump rope as part of his workout. I think later when Emmanuel Stewart worked with him,he made him jump rope. Oh well. I figure it didn't make any difference.

Some football teams work in aerobics with their training thinking it enhances footwork and coordination. Jim Jeffries would lift one of his steers to build up power and strength. Lou Nova practiced yoga.Rocky Balboa chased a chicken. I guess if it works,don't change it. And if it doesn't,don't mess with it even if all the others are doing it.

I agree with that philosophy, Roger. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

-Rick

[bennie]

I was never much of a Leonard fan myself. He had great ability and developed some real power (he couldn't break an egg in his early years) but, yes, he wanted an edge in every fight and never fought outside of north America as a pro.
Leonard lost twice overseas as an amateur.

Bennie, I too was no fan of leonard. I will never deny his greatness because he was one of the best. However, I too felt he got the 'edge' in certain fights. He could get by quite well on his talents, but a couple of times he was given the nod because...well, he was Ray. The Benitez fight annoyed me. He was going to get the decision but it was close and obviously no one knew how it would be rendered. He drops Benitez in the 15th, Benitez gets up and Leonard lets three punches fly, which Benitez ducks and dodges all three. Suddenly Carlos Padilla jumps in and stops the fight with seconds remaining. Oh did that piss me off! Secondly, the Kalule fight. It was a close fight. Leonard was ahead but Kalule had his best round in the 8th. Never mind what is officially reported as 2:59 of the 9th round. It wasn't. Kalule got dropped, got up, but the bell never rang. It was 3:06 when the fight was stopped and by claiming it was 2:59 only underscores what was done. The 2nd Hearns fight. Come on! Also, I will always dispute the decision of the Hagler fight. It just felt to me like he always got a bit of an edge.

Scartissue

When Leonard first appeared on the scene, he was just another Ali clone, all that dancing around. It was like 'so what?' You have to say, his 'education' on the way up was first class and he learned well and showed he could fight. The first Hearns fight is a classic but Hearns would have beaten him with a couple of more 'big' fights behind him. I truly believe that. I can still remember watching Hearns make his way to the ring, with just the Cuevas 'big' fight experience behind him. He looked nervous. Leonard, on the other hand, had made those Duran walks, and Benitez... Such a thing made all the difference on the night, a great night.
After the first Duran fight, Leonard said. "The best man won." Great, the man is human. Then he added, with a smug look on his face, "in the eyes of the judges." Annoying.