Jack Dempsey Query

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 10 Mar 2002, 14:35

Can we get confirmation of his Sept. 1923 bout with Luis Firpo?. For what it's worth (not knowing its accuracy) THE A-Z OF WORLD BOXING by Bert Blewett (1996) ap p. 42, says it occurred Sept. 24. We have it as Sept. 14.

Ric

http://www.boxrec.com/boxer_display.php?boxer_id=09009

$ bill · Post by **$ bill** » 10 Mar 2002, 15:37

September 14, 1923. I was at the Polo Grounds and saw it with my father and grandfather. Blewitt blew it. I was thirteen years old, at the time. That fight was the most dramatic short fight I've ever seen. If Dempsey hadn't been bodily pushed and nearly thrown back into the ring by reporters and ringsiders he would have lost.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 10 Mar 2002, 16:07

Cool, $bill. What other great fights did you witness?

$ bill · Post by **$ bill** » 11 Mar 2002, 02:18

This is not the correct section of the Forum to be responding to this. But, since you asked. The first fight I saw was in February, 1916. Pittsburgh, Pa. A fighter named Monaghan (spelling?) and a "comer" named Harry Greb. I was 6 years old. All I remember about it was that I was tired just from watching all the punches that were thrown. After that I saw almost every major fight in western Pa. and Ohio. For the big fights in Philadelphia, Ny, etc. I went with my grandfather by overnight train. Saw quite a few of the big fights and most of the top fighters. The list is very, very long. I used to call in my grandfathers round reports to the local newspaper. I was what was called a "runner". Lots of history and lots of hand me down stories.

barry · Post by **barry** » 11 Mar 2002, 02:29

I know this could turn into a did you see this, or did you see that, but I have to ask, did you ever see Jack Blackburn, Sam Langford, or Kid Norfolk fight?

$ bill · Post by **$ bill** » 11 Mar 2002, 03:04

I knew I should have kept my mouth shut. I saw the "tar baby" in one fight. Dayton, Oh. Knocked out by "Tut" Jackson. He was over the hill then 38 or 39 years old. My grandfather considered him the greatest non-champion. (Sorry Lew Tendler). Up to that time the greatest pound for pound, along with Jack (no equal) Dempsey. The 1880's Middleweight. I also saw "Thumbs" Norfolk damage Greb's eye at Pittsburgh in '21. I didn't see Blackburn. He never fought in the area. Heard he was a tough customer and put on a good show. My Grandfather really never went out of his way to see the "coloreds" fight, unless is was something special. That's just the way it was in "them thar days".

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 12 Mar 2002, 10:47

"Thumbs" Norfolk? With all due respect Bill, I think calling the 'Keed" thumbs is a bit disrespectful. Let's be honest, Greb was no choir boy. He probably thumbed more men than any fighter who ever lived. In fact in Norfolk and Greb's second fight it was old "angel" Harry who was disqualified for foul fighting. Let's call a spade a spade. Norfolk was a great fighter. Let's not let the fact that he got the best of Greb(at Greb's own game) tarnish the Kid's record.

$ bill · Post by **$ bill** » 12 Mar 2002, 13:41

Harry Greb was definitely no "angel". He was also a master at side-stepping an off balance opponent and rabbit-punching him. He was a local hero in the western Pa. at the time and could do no wrong. The "thumbs" comment was what my family and the local ("adults?)refered to Norfolk after that fight. I was 11 at the time. Norfolk was a great fighter, who never really got his chance or dues. It happened to a lot of good black fighters. If the money was there, a match was made. I'm not so sure that some of them weren't prearranged results. You have to remember it was a racist society at the time. There had been riots in Memphis and Chicago and the KKK was very strong in the Midwest, particularly Indiana. The black fighter paid the price. Look at Jack Johnson. To diminish his dominance, a White Heavyweight Championship was created. It wasn't pretty, but that's the way it was. I can only tell you what I saw, thought and felt. Others may have had different experiences or viewed things differently than I did.