Boxrec Hall of Fame Ballot (November 2008)

[Ambling Alp]

It's time for another Hall of Fame Election. Normally I would start the first of the month but I will be out of town for a few days so I thought we could just start a couple of days early. The deadline for submitting a ballot is Noon CDT on November 15, 2008. I will total the ballots shortly after that.

A brief summary of the rules:
-A voter can vote for up to 25 names. (If you vote for more than 25, your entire ballot doesn't count.)
-A fighter's last fight has to be before November 15, 1998 to be eligible.
-You can change your vote. Your last vote before the deadline will be the one counted.
-Candidates who are named on atleast 75% of the ballots are elected. If no fighters receive enough votes, the fighter(s) with the most will be elected.
Go to the Boxrec Hall of Fame Sticky (p.2) for more complete rules.

To vote, just list your selections on this thread. (Don't put them on the Hall of Fame Sticky or any other thread.)
It would be appreciated if you list your selections in alphabetical order.

It's a good idea to check every name that other voters have on their ballot. You may find someone that you overlooked.

So far there had a been a good variety of fighters from different era's, There has been decent representation of different weight classes, styles, etc. Hopefully that will continue.

Fighters already elected by Weight Class:

Heavyweight(11)- Ali, Louis, Marciano,Dempsey,Fitzsimmons,Johnson,Jeffries,Frazier,Liston,
Foreman,Sullivan

Lightheavyweight(9)-Charles,Moore,Langford,Foster,Tunney,Conn,Harold Johnson,Loughran
Spinks

Middleweight(14)-Greb,Monzon,Hagler,Ketchel,Walker,Burley,Cerdan,LaMotta,Tiger,Flowers
Benvenuti,Nonpariel Dempsey,Ryan, Darcy
Jr Middleweight(1)-McCallum

Welterweight(10)-Robinson,Ross,Napoles,Ray Leonard,Griffith,Benitez,Basilio,Gavilan,
McLarnin,Barbadoes Joe Walcott
Jr. Welterweight(2)-Loi, Locche

Lightweight(8)-Armstrong,Gans,Benny Leonard,Canzoneri,Ambers,Williams,Carlos Ortiz,McFarland
Jr Lightweight(1)-Kid Chocolate

Featherweight(6)-Pep,Saddler,Sanchez,Arguello,Attell,McGovern
Jr Featherweight(1)-Gomez

Bantamweight(6)-Jofre,Brown,Olivares,Zarate,Harada,Manuel Ortiz

Super Flyweight(1)-Galaxy

Flyweight(2)-Wilde,Perez

There is another thread that will be called a "Discussion Thread". On it you can express opinions regarding the Boxrec Hall of Fame. It will be a good opportunity for you to champion the cause of particular fighters that you feel should make it or shouldn't. That should be a lot fun.
That thread will be for Discussion only. Voting must be on this thread.

Also, voters are encouraged to name one fighter on their ballot that they consider the most worthy and briefly why. You don't have to do this to vote. However, it may help the cause of that fighter.
Lets have fun everyone!

To get things started, here is my ballot:

Sammy Angott
Joe Brown
Jack Britton
Miguel Canto
Young Corbett III
George Dixon
Jem Driscoll
Flash Elorde
Gene Fullmer
Joey Giardello
Beau Jack
Johnny Kilbane
Ted Kid Lewis
Sammy Mandell
Lloyd Marshall
Kid McCoy
Bob Montgomery
Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
Eusebio Pedroza
Aaron Pryor
Sugar Ramos
Luis Rodriguez
Vincente Saldivar
Freddie Welsh
Holman Williams

I am choosing Vincente Saldivar as the fighter that is the most worthy. I feel that he was one of the Top 5 featherweights of All-Time. He had only 3 losses and none were embarrassing. He also had several wins over very good opponents.

[Seamus]

SAMMY ANGOTT
JIMMY BARRY
ANTONIO CERVANTES
YOUNG CORBETT III
JACK DILLON
GEORGE DIXON
JIM DRISCOLL
MIKE GIBBONS
TOMMY GIBBONS
YOUNG GRIFFO
JOHNNY KILBANE
FIDEL LABARBA
JOHN HENRY LEWIS
TED "KID" LEWIS
SAMMY MANDELL
KID McCOY
FREDDIE MILLER
PHILADELPHIA JACK O'BRIEN
LUIS RODRIGUEZ
FREDDIE STEELE
YOUNG STRIBLING
PANCHO VILLA
FREDDIE WELSH
HOLMAN WILLIAMS
MIDGET WOLGAST

[Expug]

Sammy Angott
Fred Apostoli
Jimmy Barry
Miguel Canto
Jim Corbett
Pipino Cuevas
Jack Dillon
Flash Elorde
Gene Fullmer
Joey Giardello
Billy Graham
Beau Jack
Lew Jenkins
Johnny Kilbane
Danny Lopez
BENNY LYNCH
Joe Lynch
Bob Montgomery
Philadelphia Jack O;Brien
Carlos Palomino
Eddie Perkins
Vincente Saldivar
Tom Sharkey
Freddie Steele
Fritzie Zivic

Ive pushed to get Fritzie Zivic in .
Benny Lynch should be in already for sure.

[giacomino]

Jose Carattoli
JIMMY BARRY
ANTONIO CERVANTES
GEORGE DIXON
JIM DRISCOLL
LUIS RODRIGUEZ
PANCHO VILLA
VICTOR GALINDEZ
BENNY LYNCH
Sammy Angott
Miguel Canto
Flash Elorde
Joey Giardello
Beau Jack
Lew Jenkins
Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
Eddie Perkins
Vincente Saldivar
Fritzie Zivic
Humberto Gonzalez
Daniel Zaragoza

[raylawpc]

GEORGE DIXON

Jack Britton
Jose Carattoli
Joe Choynski
James J. Corbett
Johnny Coulon
Jack Delaney
The Dixie Kid
Mike Donovan
Jem Driscoll
Johnny Dundee
Frankie Genaro
Pete Herman
Peter Jackson
Johnny Kilbane
George “Kid” Lavigne
Ted "Kid" Lewis
Jack McAuliffe
Battling Nelson
Fidel LaBarba
Philadelphia Jack O’Brien
Tom Sharkey
Mysterious Billy Smith
Kid Williams
Kochi Wajima

I've nominated mostly pre-1930 fighters because I believe they are underrepresented. I've included Koichi Wajima because he was a great junior middleweight who is now largely forgotten by fans today.

[Jaywheel]

Young Corbett III
George Dixon
Gene Fullmer
Aaron Pryor
Esteban de Jesus
Freddie Steele
Ted "Kid" Lewis

[Martin Sosa Cameron]

Accavallo, Horacio
Archer, Joey
Barry, Jimmy
Brown, Joe
Carattoli, Jose
Davis, Al Bummy
Dixon, George
Elorde, Gabriel Flash
Fernandez, Jorge
Godoy, Arturo
Joyce, Willie
Kilbane, Johnny
Laguna, Ismael
Lausse, Eduardo
Leto, Jimmy
Marshall, Lloyd
Merentino, Rafael
Mina, Mauro
Moore, Memphis Pal
Nelson, Battling
Paul, Tommy
Rodriguez, Angel
Suarez, Justo
Torres, Jose Chegui
Zivic, Fritzie

[Ezzard]

Jimmy Barry
Jack Britton
Jim Corbett
Young Corbett III
George Dixon
Jim Driscoll
Johnny Dundee
Flash Elorde
Tommy Gibbons
Peter Jackson
Joe Jeanette
Ted Kid Lewis
Benny Lynch
Lloyd Marshall
Bob Montgomery
Owen Moran
Kid Norfolk
Eusebio Pedroza
Luis Rodriguez
Vicente Saldivar
Young Stribling
Rodrigo Valdez
Pancho Villa
Freddie Welsh
Tony Zale

[Seamus]

Raylawpc. Manuel Ortiz is already in.

Ezzard. John L Sullivan is already in.

[Ezzard]

Raylawpc. Manuel Ortiz is already in.

Ezzard. John L Sullivan is already in.

Thanks Seamus

[raylawpc]

Thanks Seamus. I've changed it to Fidel LaBarba.

[Jaywheel]

Raylawpc. Manuel Ortiz is already in.

Ezzard. John L Sullivan is already in.

Giacomino. McCallum is already in.

[Seamus]

Giacomino

You also listed Sammy Angott twice.

[giacomino]

Thanks, fixed that

[Martin Sosa Cameron]

Hi, Giacomino!

Well, now you can to write five new boys for the HOF!

[taverner]

Only one of my picks got in last time, so its nearly the same vote.

Jack Kid Berg
Jack Britton
Ken Buchanan
Miguel Canto
Antonio Cervantes
Jungkoo Chang
Johnny Coulon
Esteban De Jesus
George Dixon
Jem Driscoll
Victor Galindez
Frankie Genaro
Johnny Kilblane
Fidel La Barba
Ted Kid Lewis
Jack MacAuliffe
Kid McCoy
Freddie Miller
Bob Montgomery
Eusebio Pedroza
Aaron Pryor
Rodrigo Valdez
Midget Wolgast
Tony Zale
Hilario Zapata

Going mainly for lighter weight fighters as they are comparatively under represented.

The most deserving case is George Dixon, a real great who should have been elected before, but I'd like to highlight perhaps the least known name on my list - Hilario Zapata. This is a guy who won 17 world title fights in three reigns at fly and light-fly, but who gets very little recognition.

[wsbuf]

Tommy Paul
Freddie Miller
Fidel LaBarba
Johnny Kilbane
Young Stribling
Jimmy Slattery
Jersey Joe Walcott
Johnny Dundee

[elmersalsa]

Here are my picks for November 2008:
Sammy Angott
Jimmy Barry
Jack Britton
Joe Brown
Miguel Canto
Jack Delaney
George Dixon
Jim Driscoll
Pete "Kid" Herman
Beau Jack
Peter Jackson
Johnny Kilbane
Fidel La Barba
Ted "Kid" Lewis
Benny Lynch
Freddie Miller
Bob Montgomery
Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
Eusebio Pedroza
Aaron Pryor
Pancho Villa
Jersey Joe Walcott
Freddie Welsh
Harry Wills
Tony Zale



Eusebio Pedroza made 20 title defenses of the WBA Featherweight Title, 10 of them, in opponents' home turf. He was one of the most ducked fighters of his era. He was never given his due.

Benny Lynch is another underrated flyweight that cleaned up the division back in the 1930s.

Freddie Welsh is another underrated great lightweight champion that also was British Lightweight champion and only lost 5 fights over 100 fights in his career.

Sammy Angott is another lightweight great that does not get much respect. He beat Bob Montgomery 3 times, (some say that were dubious decisions, I don't know, I was not around at the time) and also beat the great Ike Williams, at least once of 3 fights.

Peter Jackson, a black man from the US Virgin Islands, was one of the very best fighters of the 1880s era. To me, he was better than John L. Sullivan.

[Minotauro]

Jack Kid Berg
Jimmy Bivins
Eddie Booker
Jack Britton
Joe Brown
Miguel Canto
Jeff Clark
Jack Dillon
George Dixon
Esteban De Jesus
Joey Giardello
Beau Jack
Joe Jeanette
Ted Kid Lewis
Lloyd Marshall
Bob Montgomery
Owen Moran
Battling Nelson
Kid Norfolk
Floyd Patterson
Luis Rodriguez
Vincente Saldivar
Pancho Villa
Jersey Joe Walcott
Holman Williams

[sockdolager]

Joey Archer
Antonio Cervantes
Jim Corbett
Jack Dillon
Jem Driscoll
Gene Fullmer
Tommy Gibbons
Beau Jack
Peter Jackson
Joe Jeannette
Danny Lopez
Lloyd Marshall
Bob Montgomery
Ken Norton
Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
Floyd Patterson
Aaron Pryor
Vincente Saldivar
Tom Sharkey
Young Stribling
Jersey Joe Walcott
Holman Williams
Harry Wills
Tony Zale
Fritze Zivic

I'll call attention to Saldivar for the same reason Alp did.

[sockdolager]

Got it in, thanks for the pm, alp.

Please let me know if I have a name up that has already been voted in, I did this quickly.

[BoxBuzz]

Joey Archer
ANTONIO CERVANTES
Jim Bivins
Jim Corbett
YOUNG CORBETT III
GEORGE DIXON
JIM DRISCOLL
Gene Fullmer
Joey Giardello
TOMMY GIBBONS
Peter Jackson
Joe Jeanette
JOHNNY KILBANE
TED "KID" LEWIS
Danny Lopez
KID McCOY
PHILADELPHIA JACK O'BRIEN
Eusebio Pedroza
LUIS RODRIGUEZ
Vincente Saldivar
YOUNG STRIBLING
PANCHO VILLA
Jersey Joe Walcott
Holman Williams
Tony Zale


FIXED!!!
Or...who can i pull down to up Carottoli and Marshall? I'll need a good written expressed reason or it stands as is.

[Seamus]

Kid Gavilan is already in Buzz.

[BoxBuzz]

Hmm....I'll take him down and add another later today or tomorrow. I have time right?

[My2Sense]

In case I don't get a chance to make a complete list now, here's the ones I definitely want to get in:

EDIT: Nevermind, go to my next post.