De La Hoya: Big fights

[Datsue]

YouTube: Orzubek Nazarov vs Joey Gamache

Cheers for that, haven't seen it for years!

I quite forgot just what a bazzing mullet Joey Gamache had. True class.

[Poncey]

Further more, Duran dropped 10lbs (some reports put it closer to 15 to 20) in 2 days using Arcel's diaretics. That's not an excuse, it's his fault, but has to be considered if examining the method of the loss.

[Autobarn]

I reckon Orzubek Nazarov would have ripped him a new one at lightweight. That man was a fvcking beast, until he went blind in one eye and lost his title away from home. Scary fighter, though he didn't have a long prime. Southpaw, strong, loads of pressure, good skills. With Oscar's weight draining at 135, and the resulting vulnerability as a fight goes late, i think he'd have been in trouble.

Oscar had no problems making 140. Indeed he didn't go to 147 because of weight problems at 140 - he is actually, a bit rediclously, talking about fighting Ricky at 140 next year! It would have been a good fight, but I think Oscar's own speed and power would have been too much.

Nazarov was a lightweight. Far too strong at the weight for Oscar. Inexperienced Oscar as well. It was a smart fight to avoid really - i.e. go for more recognised names, at a more comfy weight, when ready.

In a long fight, Oscar fades naturally after 8, even at his best weight. At a weight he's draining for, he'd get broken down. Don't see DLH having the stamina at 135. Yes, he was freakishly big & powerful at the weight, but the man just doesn't have the endurance.

[MightyWarrior]

I reckon Orzubek Nazarov would have ripped him a new one at lightweight. That man was a fvcking beast, until he went blind in one eye and lost his title away from home. Scary fighter, though he didn't have a long prime. Southpaw, strong, loads of pressure, good skills. With Oscar's weight draining at 135, and the resulting vulnerability as a fight goes late, i think he'd have been in trouble.

Oscar steered clear of Azumah Nelson too. Did Nazarov go blind in one eye then? Detached retina I guess..wondered why he retired so soon.

Question is - will Oscar actually make 147 for this fight? He failed to make weight for his last fight, according to BM, and that was at 150.

[stujones]

Many people had him beating Mayweather including a judge. As I said before I think DLH would swap Mayweather, Tito and Mosley with Whittikar, Sturm and Quartey and still no DLH defeat was as desive as Duran's loss to Hearns, Hearn's loss to Barkley and only the Hopkins defeat was as comprehensive as Duran's loss to Laing and Hearns' second loss to Barkley.

This makes no sense whatsoever Stu, at least you are consistent.

Hearns switched tactics brilliantly in the Ray fight, something Oscar has never done in the big bouts.

They are not comparable, unless your point of comparision follows the 'a points loss is analagous to a KO but certain KO's are not analagous to certain points defeats'. Your post was nonsensical.

No DLH defeat was as comparable to the KO of Duran, even the Hopkins one, a KO loss when old-man Hopkins awoke from his snooze and KO'd the guy, with a body shot to boot. Instead the KO loss to Hopkins is comparable to a points defeat to Laing and the rematch loss to Iran?!

Well I suppose I must have missed the time when DLH was KO'd in 2 rounds! Of course it makes sense, when was DLH anhilated in two rounds - NEVER!

Oscar got worn down and KO'd when out of his weight devision by a ATG. Hearns got clean KO'd early against a relatively ordinary (but been I'm awaiting for him to be described as Mike Tyson meets Rocky Marciano) Middleweight, and Duran got anhilated in 2 by Hearns. When has DLH been blown away like that.

When has DLH lost to a fighter of Kirklaind Laing level?.... Oh yeah, he hasn't. Cue the Felix Sturm "loss" - well 1) DLH got the decision 2) It was a damn sight closer than Laing vs Duran even if we go on the Terry D scoring as opposed to the actual scoring 3) Considering Duran won titles at Light Middle and Middle - Welterweight was far closer to Duran's natural weight than Middle was for DLH.

DLH changed tactics well vs Sturm, for on my card, pull it out of the bag. He also fought differently vs Vargas and Mosley 2 as he did in his early career. Anyway, Hearns might have changed his approach for Ray - but he lost!

You've often used in your arguements on the last generation of Heavyweight re Tyson that he couldn't handle certain styles and you've used points wins over average(ish) fighters as cues that he shouldn't be an ATG..... But Duran loses to Laing, and Hearns twice to Barkley - but thats okay.

It is clear that while I whole admit to being bias for DLH, you are clearly bias against him and will not accept that Fab four had their faults also. Cue continual digs about his business outside the ring as its some bad thing about his in ring achievements.... yet when it comes to praising Leonard you won't mention the fact he had a massive ring and faced and Old Hagler - but when it comes to praising Hagler you'd probably mentioned the controvesial decision over 12 rounds when past it!

Hearns = Chinny.
Duran = Too small.
Leonard = Didn't fight often enough.
Hagler = Well hard to find a fault, just DLH gets criticisms from you for "moaning" about a decision... Hagler didn't fight again cause of a decision that went against him!

For me - Duran is the GOAT Lightweight, but exclude his Lightweight resume wouldn't be a ATG - a man who didn't hold a belt outside of the Lightweight one for more than a year! But his lightweight resume is second to none and should be in everyones P4P Top Ten GOAT. A man who lost against all of the Fab 5! Admittedly outside of his weight devision, but somehow Hagler beating him not only gives Duran credit, but also gives Hagler credit.... Is DLH going to receive ANY credit for a close points win vs Pacquiao - no chance!

Leonard is the single greatest boxer of all time, a master in an out of the ring.

Hagler - Greatest Middleweight of all time and should be in the top 10 also.

Hearns - in the same bracket as DLH, again a fighter who never reigned along time, too chinny, with stamina issues, whilst had phenomenal power and great skills. The manner of key Hearns defeat will always hold against him IMO. You say DLH's performances in the "Super Fights" will always be a factor against it, but its okay for Hearns to get KTFO in Super Fights and non Superfights against limited, one dimensional bangers - who lost to Benn in a round in the interim between their fights!

[stujones]

Oscar steered clear of Azumah Nelson too. Did Nazarov go blind in one eye then? Detached retina I guess..wondered why he retired so soon.

Question is - will Oscar actually make 147 for this fight? He failed to make weight for his last fight, according to BM, and that was at 150.

Steered clear of Old Azumah - you mean at Super Feather? Oh come on, now he was TIGHT at Super Feather... he took full advatange of the weigh in to get a belt there I do grant that.

[stujones]

Nazarov was a lightweight. Far too strong at the weight for Oscar. Inexperienced Oscar as well. It was a smart fight to avoid really - i.e. go for more recognised names, at a more comfy weight, when ready.

In a long fight, Oscar fades naturally after 8, even at his best weight. At a weight he's draining for, he'd get broken down. Don't see DLH having the stamina at 135. Yes, he was freakishly big & powerful at the weight, but the man just doesn't have the endurance.[/quote]

Watch his fight with Molina to see the big "fade" that he is famous for.... there was no fade and that was at 135. One of my fave fights is that one.

Pity it never happened though.