New Leonard-Hagler book: "Sorcery at Caesars"

[Elton John]

Wilfred's one punch KO of my old favourite Maurice Hope is chilling.

Mo was in good form going into that fight but he was no match for Benitez.

Incidently, has anyone ever seen Hope's 15th round TKO over Antuerfermo? I'd like to see that.

Mo was not in good form, he was in terrible form by that time-certainly not the same he was for Vito.

[Elton John]

Wilfred's one punch KO of my old favourite Maurice Hope is chilling.

Mo was in good form going into that fight but he was no match for Benitez.

Incidently, has anyone ever seen Hope's 15th round TKO over Antuerfermo? I'd like to see that.

no, and i have never seen anyone explain how the man who later went 15 with Hagler, could get stopped by Hope....

Cuts, that's how. Otherwise Vito can rumble all night long. Somehow, Vito got by 15 rounds of Hagler without significant damage.

[Collins2000]

Wilfred's one punch KO of my old favourite Maurice Hope is chilling.

Mo was in good form going into that fight but he was no match for Benitez.

Incidently, has anyone ever seen Hope's 15th round TKO over Antuerfermo? I'd like to see that.

Mo was not in good form, he was in terrible form by that time-certainly not the same he was for Vito.

Elton, you have already provided us with much hilarity in the Terry Norris thread. Good to see you are doing the same here, buddy.

[Collins2000]

Wilfred's one punch KO of my old favourite Maurice Hope is chilling.

Mo was in good form going into that fight but he was no match for Benitez.

Incidently, has anyone ever seen Hope's 15th round TKO over Antuerfermo? I'd like to see that.

no, and i have never seen anyone explain how the man who later went 15 with Hagler, could get stopped by Hope....

Cuts, that's how. Otherwise Vito can rumble all night long. Somehow, Vito got by 15 rounds of Hagler without significant damage.

Cuts, eh?

It's obvious from your posts that your knowledge of boxing is almost non-existant.

Here's a quote regarding the bout from http://www.thesweetscience.com/boxing-a ... tough-guy/

On October 1, 1976 in Rome (Italy), he lost the belt against Maurice Hope (TKO15). According to Antuofermo, the official should have let him continue until the end (which was only 15 seconds away). Vito claimed to have weight problems in the weeks prior to the fight. Since he didn’t have a diet specialist in his team, he didn’t lose weight properly and was weak during the fight. With the years, Maurice Hope proved to be a true champion.

On March 4, 1979 he won the WBC world light middleweight title and held it until May 23, 1981.

No mention of cuts there Elton. And how often would a fight be stopped on cuts with just 15 seconds to go?

But then again you just pull your comments out of your arse don't you?

[Elton John]

Cuts, eh?

It's obvious from your posts that your knowledge of boxing is almost non-existant.

Here's a quote regarding the bout from http://www.thesweetscience.com/boxing-a ... tough-guy/

On October 1, 1976 in Rome (Italy), he lost the belt against Maurice Hope (TKO15). According to Antuofermo, the official should have let him continue until the end (which was only 15 seconds away). Vito claimed to have weight problems in the weeks prior to the fight. Since he didn’t have a diet specialist in his team, he didn’t lose weight properly and was weak during the fight. With the years, Maurice Hope proved to be a true champion.

On March 4, 1979 he won the WBC world light middleweight title and held it until May 23, 1981.

No mention of cuts there Elton. And how often would a fight be stopped on cuts with just 15 seconds to go?

But then again you just pull your comments out of your arse don't you?

That's a fine way to be talking to your betters.

The article doesnt tell much-period. Hard to tell exactly what happened but an educated guess would suggest lacerations forced a stoppage.

I've seen Hope and he resembled a punching bag. I have to wonder: were all jr middleweights that slow back then?

[Collins2000]

Cuts, eh?

It's obvious from your posts that your knowledge of boxing is almost non-existant.

Here's a quote regarding the bout from http://www.thesweetscience.com/boxing-a ... tough-guy/

On October 1, 1976 in Rome (Italy), he lost the belt against Maurice Hope (TKO15). According to Antuofermo, the official should have let him continue until the end (which was only 15 seconds away). Vito claimed to have weight problems in the weeks prior to the fight. Since he didn’t have a diet specialist in his team, he didn’t lose weight properly and was weak during the fight. With the years, Maurice Hope proved to be a true champion.

On March 4, 1979 he won the WBC world light middleweight title and held it until May 23, 1981.

No mention of cuts there Elton. And how often would a fight be stopped on cuts with just 15 seconds to go?

But then again you just pull your comments out of your arse don't you?

That's a fine way to be talking to your betters.

The article doesnt tell much-period. Hard to tell exactly what happened but an educated guess would suggest lacerations forced a stoppage.

I've seen Hope and he resembled a punching bag. I have to wonder: were all jr middleweights that slow back then?

Surely you aren't suggesting that you are qualified to make 'an educated guess' are you Reg?

[raylawpc]

From the AP:

[Collins2000]

From the AP:

Thanks, Ray.

I'd still like to see the Boxing News review of the fight. I was always sure Antuerfermo was gassed and was stopped as he was taking shots without anything coming back. I thought any cuts were incidental rather than being the main reason for the stoppage. Of course, I could be wrong. It was a long time ago...

Surely some of the 'historians' in here have access to the relevant copy of Boxing News and can scan it for us???

[Elton John]

From the AP:

Thanks Ray. Again, my suspicions proved correct. See that Collins 2000?

[Collins2000]

From the AP:

Thanks Ray. Again, my suspicions proved correct. See that Collins 2000?

I'm not convinced yet, Reg.

However, if the Boxing News review says the fight was stopped due to a cut eye, I will be the first to admit you were right and I was wrong.

[raylawpc]

From the AP:

Thanks, Ray.

I'd still like to see the Boxing News review of the fight. I was always sure Antuerfermo was gassed and was stopped as he was taking shots without anything coming back. I thought any cuts were incidental rather than being the main reason for the stoppage. Of course, I could be wrong. It was a long time ago...

Surely some of the 'historians' in here have access to the relevant copy of Boxing News and can scan it for us???

Can't help you with that. I suggest you PM Frank (kikibalt). He is able to dig up some really obscure items off the internet. Maybe he can help.

[Elton John]

From the AP:

Thanks Ray. Again, my suspicions proved correct. See that Collins 2000?

I'm not convinced yet, Reg.

However, if the Boxing News review says the fight was stopped due to a cut eye, I will be the first to admit you were right and I was wrong.

Who's Reg? I go by many names but Reg is certainly not one of them.

[Collins2000]

Who's Reg? I go by many names but Reg is certainly not one of them.

Really? I'd have thought you'd have been aware of Elton's real name...

[Elton John]

Who's Reg? I go by many names but Reg is certainly not one of them.

Really? I'd have thought you'd have been aware of Elton's real name...

If I liked that name I would be using it wouldn't I? My more recognizable name is how I'd like to be addressed. Thank you

[Collins2000]

Who's Reg? I go by many names but Reg is certainly not one of them.

Really? I'd have thought you'd have been aware of Elton's real name...

If I liked that name I would be using it wouldn't I? My more recognizable name is how I'd like to be addressed. Thank you

OK, Reg, I'll remember that in future.

Are you still in contact with Renata?

[raylawpc]

Hey, Collins, you are not one of those guys who still call Muhammad Ali "Cassius Clay" are you?

[Collins2000]

Hey, Collins, you are not one of those guys who still call Muhammad Ali "Cassius Clay" are you?

No, I think the only ones left are Terap and bitter old Joe Frazier...



Actually, I think our "Elton John" is giving out more false info. I saw a doco not so long back about the 70's and in it Ringo Starr (os should I say Richard Starkey) was talking about the real Elton John and he referred to him as "Reggie"...

[Goodnight, Irene]

I'm thinking about purchasing Four Kings. Any good?

[Robinson]

GI


I just started reading it. It seems ok, nothing new, so far....

Ill hope to finish it of soon.

[Arbachakov]

Vito was not stopped because of a cut against Hope, he was out on his feet and taking a beating aka Robinson Lamotta...hence his excuses about weightmaking.Pretty sure the boxing news report confirmed as much, but if you were following the BRitish scene at the time you wouldn't really need that confirmation.

[Collins2000]

Vito was not stopped because of a cut against Hope, he was out on his feet and taking a beating aka Robinson Lamotta...hence his excuses about weightmaking.Pretty sure the boxing news report confirmed as much, but if you were following the BRitish scene at the time you wouldn't really need that confirmation.

It's always good to have written evidence when 'discussing' this sort of thing with people like dear old Reggie. It's hard to get him to accept he might be wrong.

Several punters in here have claimed to be historians over the years but none seem to have access to the Boxing News report of that fight which would clear things up one way or another.

I always thought I'd read that the fight was stopped as Vito was taking a hammering rather than a cut eye stoppage but I have never seen any footage which means it is hard to disprove Reggie's version of events.