Classic American West Coast Boxing

scartissue
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by scartissue »

bennie wrote:Irish puncher Darren Sutherland makes his much-awaited pro debut tonight in his home city of Dublin as part of a fantastic triple title fight bill.
Sutherland was outscored by British hope and Olympic champion James DeGale in the middleweight semi-finals of the Olympics earlier this year (10-3). He had licked DeGale aplenty in previous meetings between them and may have the more professional style than the Londoner, one of those 'should have been drowned at birth' southpaws, or certainly James was in the Olympic final.
Anyway, Sutherland steals a march on DeGale by going pro before him, with promoter Frank Maloney, a man who knows how to build an Olympic prospect. This is not quite "Be in at The Beginning" and Lennox Lewis, but Sutherland looks ready to roll at 26 and ready to roll in a country that will back him hard.

Image
Bennie, I saw Sutherland fight last February here in Chicago at the world amateur championships. He lost to a flashy Venezuelan (whom he eventually beat in the Olympics on his way to bronze). I said at the time and I'm sticking with it, of any recent amateur I've seen, Darren Sutherland has the best style for the pro game. He was just getting warmed up when he ran out of time in the amateur contests. I'm predicting a good career for Sutherland.

Scartissue
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by kikibalt »

Rick Farris
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Rick Farris »

raylawpc wrote:
Expug wrote:Sonny had that jab.'He could bust a guy up with that thing.
It was like a right hand it was that powerful.
You had to feel a little bad for Sonny when after winning the title, he was looking forward to a welcoming party at the airport and nobody showed up at all.
It also always bugged me that Larry Merchant who was a writer for a Philly paper at the time.
Wrote,"we should throw Liston a parade and use paper from torn up arrest warrants as confetti".
Im not a Merchant fan,He comes off as pompous.
Its interesting that, while everybody took shots at Sonny, Johnny Coulon - the old bantamweight champion turned world-class trainer out of Chicago said, "I never heard Sonny say anything bad about anyone."

I would have enjoyed meeting Chicago's Johnny Coulon. As you Chicago guys might know, Coulon had a trick that would mistify anybody who saw him perform it. Only 5' tall and under 120 lbs. Coulon would dare a big man to reach down with both arms and try to lift him off the floor. One such challenge went to Sonny Liston, who was training in Coulon's Chicago gym. As a man would bend down and but their arms around Coulon's waist, he'd take one finger and gently press it to a spot on the man's shoulder. Nobody could ever lift Coulon's feet off the ground. He did this well into his 80's. A photo appeared in Ring Magazine of the usually somber Liston laughing as he struggled unsuccessfully to raise the former bantam champ.

Anybody else hear of this?

-Rick Farris
Last edited by Rick Farris on 18 Dec 2008, 18:57, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by raylawpc »

Yes, it was a pretty big gag for Coulon, and he did it against a lot of the big heavyweights. They ran a feature article about Coulon in BI back in the late 60s/early 70s, and it included a picture of Ali trying to lift the diminutive Coulon.
Last edited by raylawpc on 18 Dec 2008, 19:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Expug »

Rick and Tom, old timers here in Chicago still talk about Johnny Coulon and that trick.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by kikibalt »

Image
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by raylawpc »

Expug wrote:Rick and Tom, old timers here in Chicago still talk about Johnny Coulon and that trick.
Brian, he apparently had a few other tricks. As I recall, he would typically exit the ring by leaping over the top rope and landing lightly on his feet - a feat he pulled off into 70s. And he used to celebrate his birthday every year by walking the length of his gym on his hands.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Rick Farris »

scartissue wrote:
bennie wrote:Irish puncher Darren Sutherland makes his much-awaited pro debut tonight in his home city of Dublin as part of a fantastic triple title fight bill.
Sutherland was outscored by British hope and Olympic champion James DeGale in the middleweight semi-finals of the Olympics earlier this year (10-3). He had licked DeGale aplenty in previous meetings between them and may have the more professional style than the Londoner, one of those 'should have been drowned at birth' southpaws, or certainly James was in the Olympic final.
Anyway, Sutherland steals a march on DeGale by going pro before him, with promoter Frank Maloney, a man who knows how to build an Olympic prospect. This is not quite "Be in at The Beginning" and Lennox Lewis, but Sutherland looks ready to roll at 26 and ready to roll in a country that will back him hard.

Image
Bennie, I saw Sutherland fight last February here in Chicago at the world amateur championships. He lost to a flashy Venezuelan (whom he eventually beat in the Olympics on his way to bronze). I said at the time and I'm sticking with it, of any recent amateur I've seen, Darren Sutherland has the best style for the pro game. He was just getting warmed up when he ran out of time in the amateur contests. I'm predicting a good career for Sutherland.

Scartissue
Thanks for the tip, Bennie. I haven't followed amateur boxing in quite awhile including the most recent Olympics so the name Darren Sutherland is unfamiliar to me. If you and Scar were impressed, that's good enough for me. I'll keep an eye out for sutherland. By the way, David Haye will get next shot at the youngest Lurch brother's heavyweight title this coming year. All it takes is one good shot on the chin and the heavyweight title will return to Great Britain. Once hurt, Vlad K. looks to the ground for a soft place to fall, we've seen it before and we'll see it again. Guaranteed! Just hope that punch is delivered by the "Haymaker". :TU:
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Rick Farris »

Just for fun, how's this for a fantasy heavyweight title match:

Vlad Klitschko vs. a prime Sonny Liston. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

(I guess I have a mean streak. :wink: )

-Rick
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Expug »

raylawpc wrote:
Expug wrote:Rick and Tom, old timers here in Chicago still talk about Johnny Coulon and that trick.
Brian, he apparently had a few other tricks. As I recall, he would typically exit the ring by leaping over the top rope and landing lightly on his feet - a feat he pulled off into 70s. And he used to celebrate his birthday every year by walking the length of his gym on his hands.
Tom, what year did Coulon die?
I know he had that gym here for years, but I dont know when.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Expug »

Rick Farris wrote:Just for fun, how's this for a fantasy heavyweight title match:

Vlad Klitschko vs. a prime Sonny Liston. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

(I guess I have a mean streak. :wink: )

-Rick
Liston by ko EARLY.
Klitschko would want npthing tom do with Sonny though.
These heavyweights nowadays would not be falling all over themselves to get in the ring with a prime Liston.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

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Image
Johnny Coulon

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Statistics
Real name Johnny Coulon
Nickname(s) "The Cherry Picker From Logan Square"
Rated at Bantamweight
Nationality Canadian
Birth date February 12, 1889
Birth place Toronto, Canada
Death date October 29, 1973 (aged 84)
Death place Chicago, Illinois, United States
Stance Orthodox
Boxing record
Total fights 97
Wins 56
Wins by KO 24
Losses 4
Draws 4
No contests 32

John Frederic Coulon (February 12, 1889 – October 29, 1973) was the bantamweight boxing champion of the world from 6 March 1910, when he wrested the crown from England's Jim Kendrick, until 1914, when he was defeated by Kid Williams.

Biography
Born in Toronto to American parents Emile Eugene Coulon (1857-1911) and Sarah Loretta Waltzinger (1857-1923), Coulon grew up in turn-of-the-century Chicago, where as a prelim fighter he became known as "The Cherry Picker from Logan Square." He turned pro at 16 and was champion at 21. His career, managed by his father, Eugene "Pop" Coulon, stretched from 1905 to 1920. The hall-of-famer is listed as losing only four times in 97 fights, but he claimed to have fought over 300 pro fights.

Coulon won his first 26 bouts before losing a 10-round decision to Kid Murphy. In a rematch with Murphy in 1908, Coulon reversed the decision and earned recognition as the American bantamweight champion.

After capturing the world title against Kendrick in 19 rounds, he defended the title against Earl Denning, Frankie Conley, Frankie Burns, and Kid Williams. He finally lost the crown in 1914 when Williams stopped him in the third round. He also faced Harry Forbes during his career. Coulon met three Hall-of-Famers in his career: Kid Williams, Pete Herman, and Charley Goldman, who is best known for training Rocky Marciano.

Coulon served in the United States Army during World War I, often instructing soldiers on how to fight. He boxed twice after his service stint and retired from the ring in 1920 with a record of 56 wins, 4 draws, and 32 no-contests.

After retirement, he began public performances with a stupendous stage act. He would appear stripped to the waist and challenge anyone in the audience to try to lift him off his feet. It seemed an empty challenge since at five feet and barely 110 pounds, he was smaller than many schoolboys. But each who took up the challenge soon left the stage baffled and frustrated. Coulon himself never made any extravagant claims that he could violate natural laws. He was content to make a living by presenting a baffling stage act. The trick was that Coulon would feign a struggle, grabbing the opponent by the neck and applying pressure to a nerve there.

In 1921, Coulon married Marie Maloney (1892-1984). She never saw him fight professionally, but together they opened Coulon's Gymnasium on the South Side of Chicago. Marie was the business manager. "His professional career was over when we met, but together we saw oh so many of the great ones train at our gym down thru the years — men like Jack Dempsey, Gene Tunney, Jim Braddock, Joe Louis, Sugar Ray Robinson, and Muhammad Ali."[citation needed] Ali would often use the gym to keep himself toned during his exile years. Coulon managed junior welterweight champion Eddie Perkins (74-20-4) and light-heavyweight contender Allen Thomas.

Ernest Hemingway visited Coulon's and insisted on sparring with the local pugs. LeRoy Neiman sketched boxers working out. A cult movie of the sixties, Medium Cool, filmed scenes at the gym, where Coulon briefly appeared, a tiny old man captured forever on celluloid.

Coulon was not only a topnotch trainer, but living boxing history. He was a close friend of Jack Johnson, had frequented Johnson's restaurant, the "Café de Champion," and had even been a pallbearer at the great champion's funeral. He had known every heavyweight champion since the Great John L. Sullivan, had been bantamweight champion of the world, had trained hundreds of fighters and was a revered celebrity in Chicago during the 1960s. At 76 he could leave a ring by jumping over a top rope, landing softly on his feet. He celebrated a birthday by walking the length of the gym on his hands. He died at 84 in 1973 in Chicago and was buried in St. Mary's Cemetery.

Coulon was inducted into Canada's Sports Hall of Fame in 1955 (Sport: Boxing; Theme: Strength & Science), was installed in the Catholic Youth Organization's Club of Champions for his contributions to amateur boxing in 1971, and into the International Boxing Hall of Fame in 1999.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Expug »

kikibalt wrote:Image
Johnny Coulon

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Statistics
Real name Johnny Coulon
Nickname(s) "The Cherry Picker From Logan Square"
Rated at Bantamweight
Nationality Canadian
Birth date February 12, 1889
Birth place Toronto, Canada
Death date October 29, 1973 (aged 84)
Death place Chicago, Illinois, United States
Stance Orthodox
Boxing record
Total fights 97
Wins 56
Wins by KO 24
Losses 4
Draws 4
No contests 32

John Frederic Coulon (February 12, 1889 – October 29, 1973) was the bantamweight boxing champion of the world from 6 March 1910, when he wrested the crown from England's Jim Kendrick, until 1914, when he was defeated by Kid Williams.

Biography
Born in Toronto to American parents Emile Eugene Coulon (1857-1911) and Sarah Loretta Waltzinger (1857-1923), Coulon grew up in turn-of-the-century Chicago, where as a prelim fighter he became known as "The Cherry Picker from Logan Square." He turned pro at 16 and was champion at 21. His career, managed by his father, Eugene "Pop" Coulon, stretched from 1905 to 1920. The hall-of-famer is listed as losing only four times in 97 fights, but he claimed to have fought over 300 pro fights.

Coulon won his first 26 bouts before losing a 10-round decision to Kid Murphy. In a rematch with Murphy in 1908, Coulon reversed the decision and earned recognition as the American bantamweight champion.

After capturing the world title against Kendrick in 19 rounds, he defended the title against Earl Denning, Frankie Conley, Frankie Burns, and Kid Williams. He finally lost the crown in 1914 when Williams stopped him in the third round. He also faced Harry Forbes during his career. Coulon met three Hall-of-Famers in his career: Kid Williams, Pete Herman, and Charley Goldman, who is best known for training Rocky Marciano.

Coulon served in the United States Army during World War I, often instructing soldiers on how to fight. He boxed twice after his service stint and retired from the ring in 1920 with a record of 56 wins, 4 draws, and 32 no-contests.

After retirement, he began public performances with a stupendous stage act. He would appear stripped to the waist and challenge anyone in the audience to try to lift him off his feet. It seemed an empty challenge since at five feet and barely 110 pounds, he was smaller than many schoolboys. But each who took up the challenge soon left the stage baffled and frustrated. Coulon himself never made any extravagant claims that he could violate natural laws. He was content to make a living by presenting a baffling stage act. The trick was that Coulon would feign a struggle, grabbing the opponent by the neck and applying pressure to a nerve there.

In 1921, Coulon married Marie Maloney (1892-1984). She never saw him fight professionally, but together they opened Coulon's Gymnasium on the South Side of Chicago. Marie was the business manager. "His professional career was over when we met, but together we saw oh so many of the great ones train at our gym down thru the years — men like Jack Dempsey, Gene Tunney, Jim Braddock, Joe Louis, Sugar Ray Robinson, and Muhammad Ali."[citation needed] Ali would often use the gym to keep himself toned during his exile years. Coulon managed junior welterweight champion Eddie Perkins (74-20-4) and light-heavyweight contender Allen Thomas.

Ernest Hemingway visited Coulon's and insisted on sparring with the local pugs. LeRoy Neiman sketched boxers working out. A cult movie of the sixties, Medium Cool, filmed scenes at the gym, where Coulon briefly appeared, a tiny old man captured forever on celluloid.

Coulon was not only a topnotch trainer, but living boxing history. He was a close friend of Jack Johnson, had frequented Johnson's restaurant, the "Café de Champion," and had even been a pallbearer at the great champion's funeral. He had known every heavyweight champion since the Great John L. Sullivan, had been bantamweight champion of the world, had trained hundreds of fighters and was a revered celebrity in Chicago during the 1960s. At 76 he could leave a ring by jumping over a top rope, landing softly on his feet. He celebrated a birthday by walking the length of the gym on his hands. He died at 84 in 1973 in Chicago and was buried in St. Mary's Cemetery.

Coulon was inducted into Canada's Sports Hall of Fame in 1955 (Sport: Boxing; Theme: Strength & Science), was installed in the Catholic Youth Organization's Club of Champions for his contributions to amateur boxing in 1971, and into the International Boxing Hall of Fame in 1999.
Thanks Frank. :TU:
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Expug »

Johnny was married to a woman named Marie Maloney according to that bio.
Thats my Grandmothers name on my moms side. :o :D
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by kikibalt »

Image
My brother Mando clearing his walk way
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Rick Farris »

Expug wrote:
Rick Farris wrote:Just for fun, how's this for a fantasy heavyweight title match:

Vlad Klitschko vs. a prime Sonny Liston. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

(I guess I have a mean streak. :wink: )

-Rick
Liston by ko EARLY.
Klitschko would want npthing tom do with Sonny though.
These heavyweights nowadays would not be falling all over themselves to get in the ring with a prime Liston.
Your so right, Brian. The K brothers and company would want no part of a Liston or anybody from that era. What about the other Eastern European hero Valuev? His next opponent is Evander Holyfield. I've long written off Holyfield and wished he would retire. However, this is a fight he just might win? If he does, I shall NEVER again write anything less than complementary about the former champ. I'm tired of these Russian pretenders taking the EZ way out.

-Rick
Last edited by Rick Farris on 18 Dec 2008, 19:33, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Expug »

raylawpc wrote:
Expug wrote:Very interesting Tom.
Sonny , to the media was a "hood".
There is /was probably a whole lot more to Liston then what was portrayed in the media.
Its funny that there are those that want fighters to be perfect citizens but still be terrors in the ring.
Sometimes the disconnect isnt so easy.Im not saying that fighters are bad guys.In fact they the best guys around to talk to and socialize with. They are most often kind and generous in ways other athletes arent.
But most come from hard tough backgrounds and are not to be messed with.Countless have had brushes with the law and streetfights.
After all, who gets involved in fighting for a living?
Country Clubbers? No .
Its fighting, not a fu..in maypole dance.
Sonny was probably no worse then many many other athletes , Not just boxers.
His legacy is hurt by the strange Ali fight endings.
Before and while he was champ, Sonny had two strikes against him:

1. As my Mom used to say, “You’re judged by the company you keep” – and Sonny hung around with gangsters and criminals.
2. The media found him aloof and uncommunicative. I always suspected that, truth be told, Sonny was inordinately shy and, give his illiteracy, lacked confidence in his communications skills. (Wasn't it George Foreman who said that Sonny would open up to his friends, and was actually an interesting person with whom to pal around?)

The strange losses to Cassius Clay / Muhammad Ali were strike three against him.
Very true Tom.
Liston also had some rather welcoming replies to the ever inquisitive media.

Reporter-"Sonny, your rumored to be older than the thirty years old that you claim".
Sonny-My Momma says Im thirty....Are you calling my Momma a fu..in liar".? Complete with the Liston stare.

Ckassic :lol:
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Expug »

Rick Farris wrote:
Expug wrote:
Rick Farris wrote:Just for fun, how's this for a fantasy heavyweight title match:

Vlad Klitschko vs. a prime Sonny Liston. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

(I guess I have a mean streak. :wink: )

-Rick
Liston by ko EARLY.
Klitschko would want npthing tom do with Sonny though.
These heavyweights nowadays would not be falling all over themselves to get in the ring with a prime Liston.
Your so right, Brian. The K brothers and company would want no part of a Liston or anybody from that era. What about the other Eastern European hero Valuev? His next opponent is Evander Holyfield. I've long written off Holyfield and wished he would retire. However, this is a fight he just might win? If he does, I shall NEVER again write anything less than complementary about the former champ.

-Rick
I'd like to see Evander win that fight too Rick.
But your right,I would really like to see Evander shut it down.
Hes a warrior, but its time I think.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by kikibalt »

Image

Image
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by raylawpc »

Expug wrote:
raylawpc wrote:
Expug wrote:Rick and Tom, old timers here in Chicago still talk about Johnny Coulon and that trick.
Brian, he apparently had a few other tricks. As I recall, he would typically exit the ring by leaping over the top rope and landing lightly on his feet - a feat he pulled off into 70s. And he used to celebrate his birthday every year by walking the length of his gym on his hands.
Tom, what year did Coulon die?
I know he had that gym here for years, but I dont know when.
Delete.

Brian, I see Frank beat me to it - see above.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by raylawpc »

Expug wrote:
Rick Farris wrote: Your so right, Brian. The K brothers and company would want no part of a Liston or anybody from that era. What about the other Eastern European hero Valuev? His next opponent is Evander Holyfield. I've long written off Holyfield and wished he would retire. However, this is a fight he just might win? If he does, I shall NEVER again write anything less than complementary about the former champ.

-Rick
I'd like to see Evander win that fight too Rick.
But your right,I would really like to see Evander shut it down.
Hes a warrior, but its time I think.
Apparently, Evander's out of money and he has no other marketable skills, so his decision to keep fighting comes as no surprise. Regrettable - but not surprising.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by kikibalt »

by Marc Abrams
PACQUAIO-HATTON CLOSE TO BEING FINALIZED

Sources close to the situation just informed ESPN Sportscenter that a deal between pound for pound king, Manny Pacquiao and world Jr. Welterweight champion Ricky Hatton is close to being finalized.

The fight would most likely take place on May 2nd with Las Vegas being the leading venue to hold the superbout.

Pacquiao is fresh off his eight round destruction over Oscar De La Hoya on December 6. Just two weeks earlier, Hatton registered an eleventh round stoppage over Paulie Malignaggi.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by kikibalt »

Juan Manuel Marquez vs Juan Diaz
By Edgar Gonzalez

It’s a done deal. Juan Manuel Marquez will take on Juan Diaz on February 28th in Las Vegas for the IBO lightweight title. Rumor has it that “The Baby Bull” Juan Diaz is complaining about the location. Diaz wants to fight at the Toyota Center in Houston, Texas. Marquez hasn’t given the green light yet to fight Diaz in his hometown, but one thing is clear both Marquez and Diaz will duke it out February 28th. Marquez-Diaz will be televised by HBO.

“I’m very, very excited and I’m hoping that everything works out and we get to step in the ring. But I’m very excited, he’s a legendary fighter and I think right now in my career what I need is a marquee fighter that will put me over that line from a regular fighter to a superstar-status fighter. And I believe that by beating Juan Manuel Marquez and fighting him, I will accomplish that,” said Diaz, who has taken on the likes of Julio Diaz, Acelino Freitas, Nate Campbell and Katsidis in recent years.

It’s definitely going to be a bloodbath, both Marquez and Diaz are brawlers, I can’t wait.
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Randyman »

Expug Wrote:
I'd like to see Evander win that fight too Rick.
But your right,I would really like to see Evander shut it down.
Hes a warrior, but its time I think.
Brian, Rick, I feel the same way. I would like to see Evander retire, however, if he is going to fight Valuev I want him to win. I don't know how much he has left but Holyfield is a proven warrior. For every fighter there is a last fight. Maybe this is it.


Randy :TU:
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Re: Classic American West Coast Boxing

Post by Randyman »

raylawpc wrote:
Expug wrote:
Rick Farris wrote: Your so right, Brian. The K brothers and company would want no part of a Liston or anybody from that era. What about the other Eastern European hero Valuev? His next opponent is Evander Holyfield. I've long written off Holyfield and wished he would retire. However, this is a fight he just might win? If he does, I shall NEVER again write anything less than complementary about the former champ.

-Rick
I'd like to see Evander win that fight too Rick.
But your right,I would really like to see Evander shut it down.
Hes a warrior, but its time I think.
Apparently, Evander's out of money and he has no other marketable skills, so his decision to keep fighting comes as no surprise. Regrettable - but not surprising.
I remember a few years before Roberto Duran retired he was asked why he continued to fight at his age. His answer "It's all I know how to do". That was the first time I ever really felt sorry for Duran. The honest truth though is they brought it on themselves. Both Holyfield and Duran made millions... and squandered it. It's hurtful to any real boxing fan to see an aging great losing to someone that under any other circumstances would never be anything more than a sparring partner. A shame.
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