Surely there would be enough fights to generate some type of list for the biggest guys, no? (Sauerland, Don King, Gary Shaw, etc)computerrank wrote:... the statistical base is too small ...JCS wrote:Marlin.
Could you run a study on which major promoters have the biggest home promoter influence?
Ratings - please read before commenting - Archived
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
There are 2 reasons why Donald can’t be ranked ahead of Ruiz.computerrank wrote:No:Blue wrote:“A newcomer is append at the end of the list”JCS wrote:As you can see, some kind of inactivity penalty is needed.
Hehe, Donald at #9.
Since Ruiz defeated Holyfield first, Donald would have to be rated behind him.
If U activate Donald, then U have to activate Tua who knocked him out.
That puts Donald out of the top ten which is what traditional rankings are about.
The computer only calculates what U tell it to.
2001 Ruiz defeated Holyfield, then ranked #7
2002 Holyfield defeated Rahman, then ranked #2
2004 Donald defeated Holyfield, then ranked #4
so Donald is ranked ahead of Ruiz
1- Precedence of position: John Ruiz defeated Evander Holyfield over 3½ yrs before Donald did. Therefore he was already rated ahead both when Donald beat Rahman.
That why I asked above if “newcomer is append at the end of the list” is the same as seniority or precedence of position (who gained first recognition).
2- Common opponents: In 2001 Kirk Johnson defeated Donald, Kirk then lost to John Ruiz a year later.
The "ladder-based" ranking system JCS mentioned means you are only as good as your last fight...
There’s no point in having rankings if you believe that.
BTW, Why don't U guys answer my above questions about the light heavyweights?
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
I'm not sure what your asking Blue. Is the system supposed know when people get arrested or retire? That's some pretty swift AI.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Yes it is,JCS wrote:I'm not sure what your asking Blue. Is the system supposed know when people get arrested or retire? That's some pretty swift AI.
Danny Green and Stipe Drews are retired and BoxRec list their records as complete;
They are not in the daily ratings which means they shouldn’t have been included in
computerrank’s ratings. Reggie Johnson is not ranked by FightNews, Ring or the world
bodies so I have marked his record as complete until his legal problem (Felony) is solved.
That’s why I asked;
The daily 175 ratings don’t seem to consider the losses on Francis’, Brancalion’s and Bell’sTell me why computerrank is using an 18 month cutoff for his rating on this thread
when he’s still using 1 year for the BoxRec Handicap ratings.
Point out to me what defining fight is used to put Dean Francis, Antonio Brancalion,
Nathan Cleverly, Najib Mohammedi, Tim Bell and Aleksy Kuziemski on the BoxRec 1st
page.
records. AFAIK, none of the above 6 mentioned lightheavys have a defining fight on their
records to justify them being ranked on the 1st page.
It is a good example of bias of new faces over established contenders and allows them to
leap over them without a true test.
That’s why I say don’t call it a rating.
-
Ninja Mantis
- Heavyweight
- Posts: 5
- Joined: 07 Oct 2004, 01:30
Re:
While its clear that there is some systematic formula for these boxrec rankings, they still do not make sense to me. I don't know how guys like Pacquaio can move up to a new division and be ranked #1 there... when he hasn't even fought anyone there yet except for a catchweight fight with faded 154 pounder in DLH? I was always curious how DLH was always ranked so high when he's not won a significant fight in quite a few years.JCS wrote:Cotto has beat good fighters past their prime and mediocre fighters in their primes. Half the time, belts don't mean shit anyway. Yeah the current ratings system has problems. Main ones are..acevedoalx wrote:how could they put miguel cotto #16 in the jr welter rankings and put aver him guys like demetrius hopkins that never been in a title bout and only fought 10 rounds fights,juan lazcano,unknown fighters like naoutel ben rabah, souleymare mbaye, juan diaz, nirio kimura, junior witter that only been in one title fight, vivian harris who get an upset in the hands of a garbage fighter,carlos maussa who got knockout against cotto, acelino freitas who only been fighting unknown fighters since he loss to corrales,arturo gatti who received the punishment of his life in hands of pbf, jose luis castillo who is a 135 not a 140. i think those rankings are very wrong cotto should be 3 or 4 in the rankings he is undefeated 25-0 and have a world title, and have defeat past and present champions. come on, those rankings are very wrong
A. Max rating caps arent handled well on draws
B. Decay rate needs doubled
But noone will change a thing since the current system suggests the "best prediction rate" on a "Standardized system" ;)
If boxing had a legitimate rankings system based on merit, activity and quality of opposition, ... (crazy as THAT sounds in this era of big name-ism) then we'd have rankings that made enough sense that anyone would easily understand it. This system requires a lot of variables that don't account for the fact that most fights are arranged by promoters against other fighters of "marketable" quality. Since the fights are NOT mandated by a rankings system that don't exist...how can we ever really rank anyone?
This is not a criticism so much as a pinch of frustration...watching boxing fade from too much politics and too many "champions" in the same weight classes.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Nice way to quote an extremely outdated post.
However, I agree with the main idea of yours.
However, I agree with the main idea of yours.
-
computerrank
- Editor
- Posts: 2492
- Joined: 04 Jan 2003, 18:59
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
@Blue
your statement:
There are 2 reasons why Donald can’t be ranked ahead of Ruiz.
1- Precedence of position: John Ruiz defeated Evander Holyfield over 3½ yrs before Donald did. Therefore he was already rated ahead both when Donald beat Rahman.
That why I asked above if “newcomer is append at the end of the list” is the same as seniority or precedence of position (who gained first recognition).
2- Common opponents: In 2001 Kirk Johnson defeated Donald, Kirk then lost to John Ruiz a year later.
The "ladder-based" ranking system JCS mentioned means you are only as good as your last fight...
There’s no point in having rankings if you believe that.
--->
every traditional boxing organization ranking works like a ladder = the winner gets the position of the loser
* = Boxer inactive, but keeps relative background position for another 3 years
ad 1:
after Ruiz defeated Holyfield (2001):
Ruiz #11
Holyfield #12
Rahman #2 (after winning and losing to Lewis #1)
Donald not in top 100
after Holyfield defeated Rahman and Byrd defeated Holyfield (2002):
Byrd #2
Holyfield #3 (in no traditional ranking, Ruiz would keep a position above Holyfield)
Rahman #4
Ruiz #23 (a lot of others defeated boxers ahead of him)
Donald not in top 100
after Donald defeated Holyfield and Ruiz defeated Rahman (2004)
Donald #4
Holyfield #5
Ruiz #6
Rahman #7
ad 2:
2- Common opponents: In 2001 Kirk Johnson defeated Donald, Kirk then lost to John Ruiz a year later.
---> this did not mean, that Donald could not improve and defeat Holyfield later
The "ladder-based" ranking system JCS mentioned means you are only as good as your last fight...
There’s no point in having rankings if you believe that
---> Yes, I also think, a traditional ranking system does not make sense. A boxer can simply be blocked on one side and old merits are kept alive for too long a time on the other side. - Perhaps I could make sense, If one body could force the best boxers to fight one another regularly - but this is definitly not our reality - and will no be.
... I will publish the career rating point developments of the light heavyweights, you mentioned.
your statement:
There are 2 reasons why Donald can’t be ranked ahead of Ruiz.
1- Precedence of position: John Ruiz defeated Evander Holyfield over 3½ yrs before Donald did. Therefore he was already rated ahead both when Donald beat Rahman.
That why I asked above if “newcomer is append at the end of the list” is the same as seniority or precedence of position (who gained first recognition).
2- Common opponents: In 2001 Kirk Johnson defeated Donald, Kirk then lost to John Ruiz a year later.
The "ladder-based" ranking system JCS mentioned means you are only as good as your last fight...
There’s no point in having rankings if you believe that.
--->
every traditional boxing organization ranking works like a ladder = the winner gets the position of the loser
* = Boxer inactive, but keeps relative background position for another 3 years
ad 1:
after Ruiz defeated Holyfield (2001):
Ruiz #11
Holyfield #12
Rahman #2 (after winning and losing to Lewis #1)
Donald not in top 100
Code: Select all
2002 M 17 Lennox Lewis 1
2002 M 17 Hasim Rahman 2
2002 M 17 Jameel McCline 3
2002 M 17 Oliver McCall 4
2002 M 17 Gerald Nobles 5
2002 M 17 Serguei Lyakhovich 6
2002 M 17 Monte Barrett 7
2002 M 17 Robert Davis 8
2002 M 17 Sedreck Fields 9
2002 M 17 Shannon Briggs 10
2002 M 17 John Ruiz 11
2002 M 17 Evander Holyfield 12
2002 M 17 Michael Moorer 13
2002 M 17 Mike Tyson 14
2002 M 17 Brian Nielsen 15
2002 M 17 Dicky Ryan 16
2002 M 17 Larry Holmes * 17
2002 M 17 Henry Akinwande 18
2002 M 17 Andrew Golota * 19
2002 M 17 Vitali Klitschko 20Byrd #2
Holyfield #3 (in no traditional ranking, Ruiz would keep a position above Holyfield)
Rahman #4
Ruiz #23 (a lot of others defeated boxers ahead of him)
Donald not in top 100
Code: Select all
2003 M 17 Lennox Lewis 1
2003 M 17 Chris Byrd 2
2003 M 17 Evander Holyfield 3
2003 M 17 Hasim Rahman 4
2003 M 17 Wladimir Klitschko 5
2003 M 17 Jameel McCline 6
2003 M 17 Oliver McCall * 7
2003 M 17 Gerald Nobles 8
2003 M 17 Maurice Harris 9
2003 M 17 Serguei Lyakhovich 10
2003 M 17 Monte Barrett * 11
2003 M 17 David Tua 12
2003 M 17 Michael Moorer 13
2003 M 17 Michael Grant 14
2003 M 17 Robert Davis 15
2003 M 17 Tomasz Bonin 16
2003 M 17 Henry Akinwande 17
2003 M 17 Roman Suchoterin 18
2003 M 17 Derrick Jefferson 19
2003 M 17 Lawrence Clay Bey 20
2003 M 17 Sedreck Fields 21
2003 M 17 Shannon Briggs 22
2003 M 17 John Ruiz 23
2003 M 17 Mike Tyson 24
2003 M 17 Brian Nielsen 25
2003 M 17 Julius Francis 26
2003 M 17 Steffen Nielsen 27
2003 M 17 Timo Hoffmann 28
2003 M 17 Dicky Ryan 29
2003 M 17 Larry Holmes 30Donald #4
Holyfield #5
Ruiz #6
Rahman #7
Code: Select all
2005 M 17 Lennox Lewis * 1
2005 M 17 Chris Byrd 2
2005 M 17 James Toney 3
2005 M 17 Larry Donald 4
2005 M 17 Evander Holyfield 5
2005 M 17 John Ruiz 6
2005 M 17 Hasim Rahman 7
2005 M 17 Vitali Klitschko 8
2005 M 17 Corrie Sanders 9
2005 M 17 Lamon Brewster 102- Common opponents: In 2001 Kirk Johnson defeated Donald, Kirk then lost to John Ruiz a year later.
---> this did not mean, that Donald could not improve and defeat Holyfield later
The "ladder-based" ranking system JCS mentioned means you are only as good as your last fight...
There’s no point in having rankings if you believe that
---> Yes, I also think, a traditional ranking system does not make sense. A boxer can simply be blocked on one side and old merits are kept alive for too long a time on the other side. - Perhaps I could make sense, If one body could force the best boxers to fight one another regularly - but this is definitly not our reality - and will no be.
... I will publish the career rating point developments of the light heavyweights, you mentioned.
-
computerrank
- Editor
- Posts: 2492
- Joined: 04 Jan 2003, 18:59
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
@Blue
... and here is the career ratings development of the mentioned light heavyweight boxers:
ra0: rating 1st boxer pre-bout
ra1: rating 1st bxoer after-bout
rb0: rating 2nd boxer pre-bout
rb1: rating 2nd bxoer after-bout
... and here is the career ratings development of the mentioned light heavyweight boxers:
ra0: rating 1st boxer pre-bout
ra1: rating 1st bxoer after-bout
rb0: rating 2nd boxer pre-bout
rb1: rating 2nd bxoer after-bout
Code: Select all
+------------+--------------------+-----------+-------------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
| date | division | last_name | last_name | result | decision | ra0 | ra1 | rb0 | rb1 |
+------------+--------------------+-----------+-------------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
| 1994-05-28 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Littlewood | W | PTS | 0 | 28 | 33 | 27 |
| 1994-06-17 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Jolley | W | PTS | 28 | 73 | 81 | 64 |
| 1994-07-28 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Fleary | W | TKO | 73 | 134 | 58 | 40 |
| 1994-09-02 | | Francis | Osborne | W | TKO | 95 | 136 | 52 | 39 |
| 1994-10-27 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Booth | W | TKO | 136 | 168 | 69 | 53 |
| 1994-11-22 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Griffiths | W | TKO | 168 | 319 | 260 | 160 |
| 1995-03-30 | | Francis | Murray | W | TKO | 319 | 319 | 41 | 41 |
| 1995-05-25 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Clay | W | TKO | 319 | 350 | 147 | 116 |
| 1995-06-16 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Murray | W | RTD | 350 | 350 | 41 | 41 |
| 1995-10-20 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Ballogou | L | TKO | 350 | 228 | 340 | 512 |
| 1995-12-16 | Cruiserweight | Francis | Milo | W | TKO | 168 | 175 | 56 | 49 |
| 1996-02-13 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Bonislawski | W | TKO | 228 | 228 | 35 | 35 |
| 1996-04-26 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Simpson | W | TKO | 228 | 297 | 166 | 116 |
| 1996-06-08 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Marceta | W | TKO | 297 | 360 | 204 | 144 |
| 1996-09-14 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Kenney | W | TKO | 360 | 360 | 24 | 24 |
| 1996-10-19 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Torres | W | TKO | 360 | 378 | 130 | 112 |
| 1997-03-14 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Carr | W | TKO | 378 | 586 | 437 | 279 |
| 1997-05-15 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Munroe | W | TKO | 586 | 586 | 96 | 96 |
| 1997-07-19 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Starie | W | TKO | 586 | 738 | 477 | 325 |
| 1997-12-19 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Seillier | W | KO | 738 | 808 | 469 | 398 |
| 1998-03-07 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Baker | W | TKO | 808 | 814 | 214 | 209 |
| 1998-08-22 | Super Middleweight | Francis | Ngemntu | W | TKO | 814 | 814 | 41 | 41 |
| 1998-10-31 | Super Middleweight | White | Francis | W | TKO | 93 | 561 | 814 | 450 |
| 2002-04-20 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Mbonambi | W | PTS | 83 | 137 | 88 | 68 |
| 2003-03-29 | Super Middleweight | Barney | Francis | W | PTS | 417 | 432 | 137 | 122 |
| 2005-07-09 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Bonson | W | PTS | 43 | 72 | 37 | 31 |
| 2005-11-12 | Cruiserweight | Francis | Rasani | W | TKO | 55 | 169 | 151 | 88 |
| 2006-02-25 | Cruiserweight | Francis | Eastwood | W | PTS | 169 | 196 | 148 | 134 |
| 2006-10-07 | Cruiserweight | Francis | Rasani | W | KO | 196 | 229 | 163 | 130 |
| 2007-02-09 | Light Heavyweight | McKenzie | Francis | L | TKO | 449 | 313 | 229 | 426 |
| 2007-06-02 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Powers | W | KO | 426 | 439 | 195 | 182 |
| 2007-12-08 | Light Heavyweight | Francis | Gbenga | W | UD | 439 | 439 | 0 | 0 |
| 2008-06-13 | Light Heavyweight | Oakey | Francis | L | TKO | 286 | 165 | 439 | 608 |
+------------+--------------------+-----------+-------------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
+------------+--------------------+------------+--------------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
| date | division | last_name | last_name | result | decision | ra0 | ra1 | rb0 | rb1 |
+------------+--------------------+------------+--------------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
| 1996-12-20 | | Brancalion | Magyar | W | PTS | 0 | 11 | 2 | 1 |
| 1997-02-07 | Middleweight | Brancalion | Raffesberger | W | KO | 7 | 7 | 0 | 0 |
| 1997-03-21 | | Brancalion | Olah | W | TKO | 7 | 7 | 0 | 0 |
| 1997-05-23 | | Patko | Brancalion | L | PTS | 0 | 0 | 7 | 10 |
| 1997-11-28 | | Brancalion | Timofte | W | TKO | 9 | 23 | 0 | 0 |
| 1997-12-26 | | Fiorentino | Brancalion | L | PTS | 11 | 9 | 15 | 25 |
| 1998-11-21 | Middleweight | Brancalion | Dimitrov | W | TKO | 23 | 43 | 4 | 4 |
| 1999-02-27 | | Brancalion | Ortiz | W | PTS | 33 | 33 | 0 | 0 |
| 1999-04-17 | | Brancalion | Ortiz | W | PTS | 30 | 30 | 0 | 0 |
| 1999-05-13 | | Brancalion | Moncini | W | DQ | 33 | 37 | 18 | 18 |
| 1999-07-08 | | Horvath | Brancalion | L | TKO | 7 | 7 | 37 | 61 |
| 1999-10-22 | | Brancalion | Alfano | W | PTS | 41 | 77 | 56 | 45 |
| 2000-05-05 | Super Middleweight | Imparato | Brancalion | W | PTS | 193 | 204 | 77 | 66 |
| 2000-07-28 | Super Middleweight | Brancalion | Nogueira | W | PTS | 66 | 101 | 64 | 53 |
| 2000-11-17 | Super Middleweight | Imparato | Brancalion | W | TD | 204 | 204 | 101 | 101 |
| 2000-12-16 | Super Middleweight | Brancalion | Cukusic | W | PTS | 101 | 101 | 20 | 20 |
| 2000-12-30 | Super Middleweight | Brancalion | Cukusic | W | PTS | 101 | 101 | 20 | 20 |
| 2001-03-30 | Super Middleweight | Brancalion | Colombo | W | PTS | 101 | 121 | 55 | 48 |
| 2001-05-11 | Super Middleweight | Brancalion | Filippo | W | DQ | 121 | 126 | 65 | 64 |
| 2001-11-02 | Super Middleweight | Brancalion | Filippo | W | TKO | 126 | 209 | 115 | 77 |
| 2002-04-12 | Super Middleweight | Imparato | Brancalion | W | MD | 230 | 251 | 209 | 197 |
| 2002-12-26 | Light Heavyweight | Saiani | Brancalion | W | PTS | 35 | 131 | 182 | 121 |
| 2003-07-12 | Super Middleweight | Veit | Brancalion | W | UD | 369 | 369 | 131 | 131 |
| 2003-08-10 | Light Heavyweight | Minelli | Brancalion | D | PTS | 12 | 31 | 121 | 102 |
| 2003-10-19 | Light Heavyweight | Urbinati | Brancalion | D | PTS | 80 | 77 | 63 | 66 |
| 2004-02-06 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Robert | W | PTS | 66 | 151 | 187 | 139 |
| 2004-03-12 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | De Beul | W | PTS | 151 | 163 | 70 | 63 |
| 2004-10-29 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Halasz | W | TKO | 163 | 169 | 53 | 47 |
| 2004-12-18 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Robert | W | PTS | 169 | 182 | 84 | 74 |
| 2005-02-18 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Saiani | W | UD | 182 | 242 | 140 | 104 |
| 2005-05-13 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Selini | W | UD | 242 | 240 | 89 | 91 |
| 2005-07-01 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Adamovich | W | PTS | 240 | 240 | 1 | 1 |
| 2006-01-07 | Light Heavyweight | Drews | Brancalion | W | UD | 342 | 374 | 240 | 208 |
| 2006-11-14 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Vanicky | W | PTS | 208 | 212 | 70 | 66 |
| 2007-03-24 | Light Heavyweight | Kurzawa | Brancalion | L | MD | 171 | 148 | 212 | 249 |
| 2007-06-28 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Adamek | W | SD | 249 | 343 | 223 | 155 |
| 2007-11-16 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Kratki | W | PTS | 343 | 343 | 17 | 17 |
| 2008-03-29 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Greter | W | UD | 343 | 346 | 94 | 92 |
| 2008-11-07 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Kratki | W | TKO | 346 | 346 | 13 | 13 |
| 2008-12-02 | Light Heavyweight | Brancalion | Cichello | W | UD | 346 | 358 | 209 | 196 |
+------------+--------------------+------------+--------------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
+------------+-------------------+-----------+-----------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
| date | division | last_name | last_name | result | decision | ra0 | ra1 | rb0 | rb1 |
+------------+-------------------+-----------+-----------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+
| 2001-10-26 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | De Raco | W | KO | 0 | 39 | 21 | 13 |
| 2002-05-09 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Wickliffe | W | KO | 39 | 39 | 0 | 0 |
| 2002-08-09 | Light Heavyweight | Dowling | Bell | W | MD | 131 | 127 | 39 | 44 |
| 2003-07-25 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Garling | W | TKO | 44 | 44 | 0 | 0 |
| 2003-10-17 | Light Heavyweight | Wood | Bell | W | UD | 110 | 114 | 44 | 40 |
| 2004-04-16 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Enyi | W | TKO | 40 | 57 | 12 | 11 |
| 2004-05-20 | Light Heavyweight | Westerman | Bell | W | UD | 128 | 136 | 57 | 51 |
| 2004-06-18 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Zohs | W | TKO | 51 | 82 | 12 | 12 |
| 2004-08-28 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Brennan | W | TKO | 82 | 82 | 5 | 5 |
| 2004-11-12 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Reid | W | KO | 82 | 178 | 95 | 49 |
| 2004-12-03 | | Bell | Schwalger | D | PTS | 136 | 115 | 13 | 34 |
| 2005-06-17 | Light Heavyweight | Walker | Bell | L | TKO | 71 | 56 | 150 | 166 |
| 2005-09-30 | Light Heavyweight | Clements | Bell | L | TKO | 95 | 71 | 166 | 206 |
| 2005-11-27 | | Bell | Masua | W | KO | 206 | 210 | 61 | 56 |
| 2006-02-17 | Cruiserweight | Bell | Wood | W | KO | 161 | 161 | 42 | 41 |
| 2006-05-05 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Stenton | L | MD | 210 | 136 | 50 | 141 |
| 2006-12-09 | Cruiserweight | Bell | Connell | L | MD | 136 | 108 | 70 | 113 |
| 2007-08-17 | Light Heavyweight | Bargero | Bell | L | UD | 127 | 104 | 136 | 184 |
| 2007-10-06 | Light Heavyweight | Bell | Connell | W | TD | 184 | 184 | 54 | 54 |
| 2008-10-05 | Light Heavyweight | Lovett | Bell | L | TKO | 186 | 98 | 184 | 323 |
+------------+-------------------+-----------+-----------+--------+----------+-----+-----+-----+-----+Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Is there any official explanation why we rate current WBC lightweight champion in light welterweight? I was asked to by one local journalist but i dont know the answer.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
I don't think there are any specific rules, however, it looks almost certain that he will now campaign at Light Welterweight. Pacquiao was at Welterweight for a short time, but I think an editor changed his weight division because it looked a little silly having Pacman as the number 1 Welterweight.sandis wrote:Is there any official explanation why we rate current WBC lightweight champion in light welterweight? I was asked to by one local journalist but i dont know the answer.
^^^ That's obviously not an official answer, just my opinion.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
The boxers are rated in the weight category where they and their teams request.
Arum plans May bout for Pacquiao
By Abac Cordero; Philippine Star, Updated December 14, 2008 12:00 AM
http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?Ar ... egoryId=69
He only officially weighed 142 for the non tile bout with Dela Hoya and It is
common for light welterweights to be a few lbs over the limit in non title bouts.
Arum plans May bout for Pacquiao
By Abac Cordero; Philippine Star, Updated December 14, 2008 12:00 AM
http://www.philstar.com/Article.aspx?Ar ... egoryId=69
He only officially weighed 142 for the non tile bout with Dela Hoya and It is
common for light welterweights to be a few lbs over the limit in non title bouts.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
to ask the question again, does any fighter who requests a move get a move? or just the big boys
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Every fighter is given the same treatment, but not just anybody can request it
unless they have a reference such as the previously mentioned Arum interview.
unless they have a reference such as the previously mentioned Arum interview.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Are the ratings broke?
-
computerrank
- Editor
- Posts: 2492
- Joined: 04 Jan 2003, 18:59
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
MatthewS asked:
10- and 20- fights
10- and 20- fights
Code: Select all
+------+-------------+--------------+--------+------+
| nr | first_name | last_name | rating | cc |
+------+-------------+--------------+--------+------+
| 1 | Zolani | Tete | 434 | 10 |
| 2 | Beibut | Shumenov | 406 | 7 |
| 3 | Wanheng | Menayothin | 314 | 8 |
| 4 | Yasuhiro | Hisada | 277 | 9 |
| 5 | Faisal | Ibnel Arrami | 271 | 9 |
| 6 | Yoshihiro | Kamegai | 269 | 10 |
| 7 | Kosuke | Takeichi | 255 | 10 |
| 8 | Shinsuke | Yamanaka | 245 | 9 |
| 9 | Melissa | Hernandez | 244 | 6 |
| 10 | Danny | McIntosh | 236 | 9 |
| 11 | Carlos | Molina | 225 | 9 |
| 12 | Ryo | Miyazaki | 224 | 9 |
| 13 | Magbau | Pathy | 207 | 2 |
| 14 | Viorel | Simion | 206 | 10 |
| 15 | Muhamad Des | Afrizal | 206 | 9 |
| 16 | Frank | White | 203 | 9 |
| 17 | Seiichi | Okada | 201 | 8 |
| 18 | Thangthong | Kiattaweesuk | 200 | 8 |
| 19 | Jason | Cintron | 198 | 10 |
| 20 | Tsukasa | Takase | 191 | 8 |
+------+-------------+--------------+--------+------+
+------+-------------+---------------+--------+------+
| nr | first_name | last_name | rating | cc |
+------+-------------+---------------+--------+------+
| 1 | Nobuo | Nashiro | 715 | 13 |
| 2 | Nkosinathi | Joyi | 686 | 19 |
| 3 | Daniel | Geale | 634 | 20 |
| 4 | Abner | Mares | 634 | 17 |
| 5 | Andre | Dirrell | 611 | 17 |
| 6 | Paul | McCloskey | 547 | 18 |
| 7 | Yuriorkis | Gamboa | 547 | 13 |
| 8 | Milan | Melindo | 546 | 17 |
| 9 | Matt | Godfrey | 540 | 19 |
| 10 | Konosuke | Tomiyama | 534 | 20 |
| 11 | Danilo | Pena | 522 | 19 |
| 12 | Hassan | N'Dam N'Jikam | 516 | 17 |
| 13 | Takashi | Uchiyama | 514 | 11 |
| 14 | Herman | Ngoudjo | 509 | 20 |
| 15 | Tomonobu | Shimizu | 480 | 17 |
| 16 | Alexander | Povetkin | 460 | 16 |
| 17 | Masatate | Tsuji | 457 | 15 |
| 18 | Juan Carlos | Reveco | 454 | 20 |
| 19 | Masaaki | Serie | 447 | 16 |
| 20 | Rendall | Munroe | 445 | 18 |
+------+-------------+---------------+--------+------+Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Shouldn't the star system be a bit less stringent when it comes to women fights?
-
computerrank
- Editor
- Posts: 2492
- Joined: 04 Jan 2003, 18:59
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
I don't think so.JCS wrote:Shouldn't the star system be a bit less stringent when it comes to women fights?
The rating points in the top ranges also represent the level of competition - as do the stars for the bouts. This will change only, when the number of women boxers will increase.
So there are 3 star bouts in women boxing sometimes, such as Holm vs Sanders.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Hey Martin...
I feel that Barrera's rating is too little. I believe its because of the wide scorecards issued in the Marquez/Barrera fight... and how that impacts the opponent quality calculation.
If that fight was scored a split decision, or 115-113 UD, how would it affect his current ranking?
I feel that Barrera's rating is too little. I believe its because of the wide scorecards issued in the Marquez/Barrera fight... and how that impacts the opponent quality calculation.
If that fight was scored a split decision, or 115-113 UD, how would it affect his current ranking?
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computerrank
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Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
Opponent quality calculation regards all opponents inside a range of 25% and 400% of the boxer's own rating anyway (independent of the result).JCS wrote:Hey Martin...
I feel that Barrera's rating is too little. I believe its because of the wide scorecards issued in the Marquez/Barrera fight... and how that impacts the opponent quality calculation.
If that fight was scored a split decision, or 115-113 UD, how would it affect his current ranking?
As the ratings of Barrera and Marquez were inside this range - the result does not effect the opponent quality rating of both.
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
I'm confused then... why did Crazy Kim drop 10 spots today, since his last opponent was Mundine?computerrank wrote:Opponent quality calculation regards all opponents inside a range of 25% and 400% of the boxer's own rating anyway (independent of the result).JCS wrote:Hey Martin...
I feel that Barrera's rating is too little. I believe its because of the wide scorecards issued in the Marquez/Barrera fight... and how that impacts the opponent quality calculation.
If that fight was scored a split decision, or 115-113 UD, how would it affect his current ranking?
As the ratings of Barrera and Marquez were inside this range - the result does not effect the opponent quality rating of both.
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computerrank
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Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
I will look ...JCS wrote:computerrank wrote:Opponent quality calculation regards all opponents inside a range of 25% and 400% of the boxer's own rating anyway (independent of the result).JCS wrote:Hey Martin...
I feel that Barrera's rating is too little. I believe its because of the wide scorecards issued in the Marquez/Barrera fight... and how that impacts the opponent quality calculation.
If that fight was scored a split decision, or 115-113 UD, how would it affect his current ranking?
As the ratings of Barrera and Marquez were inside this range - the result does not effect the opponent quality rating of both.
I'm confused then... why did Crazy Kim drop 10 spots today, since his last opponent was Mundine?
Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
I thought that opponent quality was disregarded if it was not a win, draw, or close loss....
Could be mistaken though.
Could be mistaken though.
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computerrank
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Re: Boxrec Ratings - Read first before commenting on the ratings
As pointed out above, the criteria is - all bouts are regarded, where the rating is at risk.JCS wrote:I thought that opponent quality was disregarded if it was not a win, draw, or close loss....
Could be mistaken though.
So losses also are regarded for the loser, if the superior winner was not outside of 400% of the loser's rating.
But ... the promoter advantage might have been involved ... and so:
The Mundine bout was outside of bounds - as:
Mundine current 639
Kim current (before being degraded) about 250
ratio: 639 / 250 * 1.31 * 1.31 = 4.38 > 4.0; 1.31 promoter advantage factor for decision on points