RANK YOUR TOP 3 NON ADVANCING TOURNAMENTS,AND EXPLAIN WHY?

[415BOXING]

I HAVE ONLY INVOLVED IN THE AMATEUR GAME SINCE 2001,AND THOUGH MY SON HAS BEEN TO THE JO NATIONALS TWICE(2005 & 2006),WE REALLY NEVER WENT TO BIG NON ADVANCING TOURNAMENTS TILL THIS PAST YEAR,WHEN I TOOK MY BOXERS TO THE CALIFORNIA PAL(WHICH IS NON ADVANCING) AND THE DESERT SHOWDOWN IN INDIO WHICH IS A FANTASTIC TOURNAMENT,I WOULD LIKE EVERYONE'S OPINION ON THIS,IT ALSO MIGHT ENCOURAGE OTHERS FO GO TO THESE TOURNAMENTS AND GET EXPERIENCE AND EXPOSURE FOR THEIR FIGHTERS

[Kolya]

Ringside has to be number 1. The Titleboxing tournament looks pretty decent too. I don't know much about it but I'd really like to go to the Arnold Classic too. But Ringside takes the cake for me.

[Dennis]

The National PAL, National Junior Golden Gloves, and Ringside Tourney. Others I have good things about: Arnold Classic, Ohio State Fair, Desert Showdown and the Title Tourney.

[DCAmateurBoxing]

Ringside has to be number 1. The Titleboxing tournament looks pretty decent too. I don't know much about it but I'd really like to go to the Arnold Classic too. But Ringside takes the cake for me.

Arnold Classic isn't that good as far as number of entries. Looked to still be a lot of Ohio/Michigan boxers. Haven't gone back since first year when they didn't have anyone with boxing event experience running the tournament. I went to Title first year. It wasn't well attended but our boxers got 4 bouts, so it was great for us. I think last year, the attendance was up. I would have to say Ringside #1 simply because of 1) attendance (pretty much guaranteed a match in any division), 2) awards (hands down, the best awards), 3) Ringside store - which usually has good deals on equipment 4) pretty centrally located also for boxers/teams to come from all over 5) Clinic and seminars they run through the week - pretty nice for coaches to attend 6) Talent Level - I've seen a lot of Olympians, JO and US Champions at the Ringside

#2 PAL - last year's attendance was way down, but that was because of the economy. Usually well attended. Only thing about the PAL for me is that it's all the way out on the West Coast and it's a full week, which is really tough to take off especially with school for most boxers.

# Jr. GG, Title, Arnold, Desert Showdown etc. - Each has pluses and minuses and the rest either haven't been around long enough consistently, so case can be made for many.

[boxmel]

Ummm - National PAL is considered an advancing tournament because it can lead to international
competition and is a qualifier for the Olympic Trials. Non-advancing tournaments are those that don't go any further than their own championships.

There's a rumor floating around that Ringside will/wants to become a ranking tournament. If this is the case, seems to me it would have to conform to other ranking tournaments, i.e., no novice divisions; U.S. citizens only. We'll see.

[DCAmateurBoxing]

Ummm - National PAL is considered an advancing tournament because it can lead to international
competition and is a qualifier for the Olympic Trials. Non-advancing tournaments are those that don't go any further than their own championships.

There's a rumor floating around that Ringside will/wants to become a ranking tournament. If this is the case, seems to me it would have to conform to other ranking tournaments, i.e., no novice divisions; U.S. citizens only. We'll see.

When someone says advancing tournament, I always took that as you had to win multiple stages of the tournament over an extended period of time. Is it that winning the PAL "does lead" to international competition or "can lead" to international competition. I look at the PAL as an invitation unlike US Championships, GG, Silver Gloves. So, does that make the Under -19 an advancing tournament too? IMO, that's an invitational. I also always thought the fact that a tourney generated ranking pts was independent of the fact a tournament had the title of "advancing tournament". One does not automatically bring the other does it?

[DCAmateurBoxing]

There will be a lot of non-US citizen who would be pretty bummed if Ringside did that. I like that it's located in a fairly central location so lots of boxers can attend but if they make that change it's going to turn a lot of people away unfortunately.

Out of the 1,211 boxers in 2007 only 96 were from outside U.S./U.S. Territories. Not sure if that would outweigh the prestige of being part of the rankings.

[boxmel]

Is it that winning the PAL "does lead" to international competition or "can lead" to international competition.

It "can lead" (or, per the rule book, "would lead") just like U.S. Championships and Golden Gloves "can lead" since they are all ranking tournaments and feed into the Olympic Trials every four years. Athletes for international competitions are also picked from the rankings.

So, does that make the Under -19 an advancing tournament too?

Yes, as it can lead to international competitions, specifically the Under-19 Worlds.
PAL and U-19 are only "invitational" because a boxer does not have to qualify from the district level to the national level.

I also always thought the fct that a tourney generated ranking pts was independent of the fact a tournament had the title of "advancing tournament".

Nope - but it's all semantics.

One does not automatically bring the other does it?[/code]

Per the rule book, and possibly the best explanation, is the citizenship rule. "Foreign athletes are barred from participation in advancing local, regional and national tournaments that would lead to international competition."

Clear as mud, eh?

[DCAmateurBoxing]

Mel, I gotcha.

[415BOXING]

I DEFINETLY WOULD RECOMMEND THE DESERT SHOWDOWN IN INDIO,CA.RALPH ROMERO RUNS A VERY GOOD TOURNAMENT,IN MOST BRACKETS YOUR GUARENTEED A MATCH,THE ONLY THING IS THE WEATHER,YOUR IN THE OUTSKIRTS OF THE DESERT SO AT THAT TIME OF YEAR(MID JULY)ITS ABOUT 110- 115 DEGREES OUTSIDE,BUT YOUR BOXING IN A AIR CONDITIONED CASINO SO THATS GOOD,THEY RUN 3 RINGS DAILY SO THATS GOOD,BUT THEY SHOULD GO TO AT LEAST 4 CAUSE ON THURSDAY THIS YEAR OF THE TOURNAMENT THEY AVERAGED 50 BOUTS PER RING.THIS YEAR I EXPECT THAT THERE WOULD EXPECT MORE CAUSE LAST YEAR ALOT OF TEAMS DID NOT MAKE IT CAUSE OF HIGH GAS PRICES,ALSO I THINK RINGSIDE STARTED NEAR THE END OF THE SHOWDOWN

[boxmel]

it's fun and there isn't the favoritism that is at Nationals. And Mel, before you jump me for saying that,

Mel, jump Amy? Why, I never!

I'm just talking about the general attitude of exclusivity at the event. It's off putting and discouraging to new comers.

They are two entirely different tournaments. As you said - Ringside is fun -and will use anyone as officials (newly registered, coaches, etc). The U.S. Championships is USAB's premier event where the best of each region comes together to see who's the best in the U.S. There is more to gain at the Championships, therefore the atmosphere is different. Yes - it can be very off-putting to newcomers, athletes and non-athletes alike. At least for non-athletes, the more you go, the easier it gets.

[boxmel]

The officiating at Ringside definitely needs work. I think it would be a good idea to have an all-day seminar for officials during registration just to help make sure that all officials are more on the same page as far as what actually counts as a legit scoring blow...when to stop a fight....etc.

If that type of seminar is needed, then the officials are not trained. And training should never be done at a tournament. That's why only Level 2 and 3 officials are allowed at the USAB national tournaments.

From a new-comer's point of view....it's a good old boys club and they are taking new members.

Yeah, have to agree there. However, you don't have to be friends with or like the GOB club members. My best boxing friends I've met over the years at national tournaments and they are definitely NOT GOB people. 8)

[Dennis]

Desert Showdown and the PAL are way out west so flying is the only way to go for about 1/2 of the boxers in the country. Ringside - the majority of boxers can drive to it. It is nice to be centrally located.

[415BOXING]

I AGREE THAT RINGSIDE IS EASIER CAUSE ITS CENTRAL TO ALL CLUBS,IVE NEVER BEEN TO IT BUT I CAN IMAGINE IT CAN BE A MESS WITH ALL THE ENTRIES THEY SAY THEY GET.SOMETIMES MORE ENTRIES MEAN MORE CHAOS,IN RINGSIDE'S CASE I CAN IMAGINE TOTAL CHAOS,BUT THE DESERT SHOWDOWN YOU GOT ABOUT 500-700 ENTRIES,AND IT WAS RUN VERY SMOOTH,I HIGHLY RECOMMEND THIS TOURNAMENT

[DCAmateurBoxing]

I AGREE THAT RINGSIDE IS EASIER CAUSE ITS CENTRAL TO ALL CLUBS,IVE NEVER BEEN TO IT BUT I CAN IMAGINE IT CAN BE A MESS WITH ALL THE ENTRIES THEY SAY THEY GET.SOMETIMES MORE ENTRIES MEAN MORE CHAOS,IN RINGSIDE'S CASE I CAN IMAGINE TOTAL CHAOS,BUT THE DESERT SHOWDOWN YOU GOT ABOUT 500-700 ENTRIES,AND IT WAS RUN VERY SMOOTH,I HIGHLY RECOMMEND THIS TOURNAMENT

With Ringsides massive entries, every sessions (2 per day) started on time and the weigh-ins went smoothly. They even had the Under-19 tourny there this year. Been there 5 years and never had any issue with chaos.

[415BOXING]

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW MANY ENTRIES THERE WERE FOR THE 2008 RINGSIDE TOURNAMENT,AND DO PEOPLE THINK THAT MAYBE ITS GROWN TO BIG OVER THE YEARS?

[DCAmateurBoxing]

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW MANY ENTRIES THERE WERE FOR THE 2008 RINGSIDE TOURNAMENT,AND DO PEOPLE THINK THAT MAYBE ITS GROWN TO BIG OVER THE YEARS?

About 1,400. I don't think anyone thinks it has gotten too big. This was really the first year I saw a lot divisions had to be split because of the number of entries. I didn't really notice that much in the past, but it happens. This was the largest year according to John Brown. Again, if you're going to pay the money to go to a tournament and bring boxers - at Ringside you almost always get matched and can box as many as 4 times. The three boxers that I brought boxed 4, 3 and 3 times respectively. Well worth the trip IMO against good competition that included some of the countries top boxers.

[Kolya]

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW MANY ENTRIES THERE WERE FOR THE 2008 RINGSIDE TOURNAMENT,AND DO PEOPLE THINK THAT MAYBE ITS GROWN TO BIG OVER THE YEARS?

About 1,400. I don't think anyone thinks it has gotten too big. This was really the first year I saw a lot divisions had to be split because of the number of entries. I didn't really notice that much in the past, but it happens. This was the largest year according to John Brown. Again, if you're going to pay the money to go to a tournament and bring boxers - at Ringside you almost always get matched and can box as many as 4 times. The three boxers that I brought boxed 4, 3 and 3 times respectively. Well worth the trip IMO against good competition that included some of the countries top boxers.

I'm already looking forward to this year's Ringside.

[DCAmateurBoxing]

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW MANY ENTRIES THERE WERE FOR THE 2008 RINGSIDE TOURNAMENT,AND DO PEOPLE THINK THAT MAYBE ITS GROWN TO BIG OVER THE YEARS?

About 1,400. I don't think anyone thinks it has gotten too big. This was really the first year I saw a lot divisions had to be split because of the number of entries. I didn't really notice that much in the past, but it happens. This was the largest year according to John Brown. Again, if you're going to pay the money to go to a tournament and bring boxers - at Ringside you almost always get matched and can box as many as 4 times. The three boxers that I brought boxed 4, 3 and 3 times respectively. Well worth the trip IMO against good competition that included some of the countries top boxers.

I'm already looking forward to this year's Ringside.

LOL. I think everyone is. I wish I could go to a lot more events, but Ringside is the one that is always marked on the calendar. See you there!

[Kolya]

LOL. I think everyone is. I wish I could go to a lot more events, but Ringside is the one that is always marked on the calendar. See you there!

You will be. The way it's working out now I might be asking you to work my corner. But I'll probably be back home again once before then too.

[DCAmateurBoxing]

LOL. I think everyone is. I wish I could go to a lot more events, but Ringside is the one that is always marked on the calendar. See you there!

You will be. The way it's working out now I might be asking you to work my corner. But I'll probably be back home again once before then too.

Going to try to raise funds early to get a big group out there this year - so we'll be there. No problem. Tez had his first open bout in the USA Tourney this Saturday. Some good action and all I can say is that unequivocally across the board - boy does 3-3 minute rounds make a difference!!! lol. Thomas Williams won at 178lbs. , Tez won at 152lbs., Marquis Moore won at 152lbs. , Marcus Gaddis won at 119lbs. Before you ask me how anyone looked, let me repeat boy does 3-3 minute rounds make a difference!!! Even with athletes that spar and train off 3-minute clock - it still was very very apparent.

Are you seeing the same?

[boxmel]

let me repeat boy does 3-3 minute rounds make a difference!!!

We had our districts this weekend. I didn't hear any comments from the boxers regarding the 3-3's. My husband, as a referee, says it really feels long and I time kept and agree - I kept feeling like I was letting the round go too long and that it would never end! We'll adjust. 8)

[Kolya]

LOL. I think everyone is. I wish I could go to a lot more events, but Ringside is the one that is always marked on the calendar. See you there!

You will be. The way it's working out now I might be asking you to work my corner. But I'll probably be back home again once before then too.

Going to try to raise funds early to get a big group out there this year - so we'll be there. No problem. Tez had his first open bout in the USA Tourney this Saturday. Some good action and all I can say is that unequivocally across the board - boy does 3-3 minute rounds make a difference!!! lol. Thomas Williams won at 178lbs. , Tez won at 152lbs., Marquis Moore won at 152lbs. , Marcus Gaddis won at 119lbs. Before you ask me how anyone looked, let me repeat boy does 3-3 minute rounds make a difference!!! Even with athletes that spar and train off 3-minute clock - it still was very very apparent.

Are you seeing the same?

Yeah. Caferro had to try really hard to carry his opponent the last round this weekend. It was weird how long they felt. Good for Tez and good for my dude Thomas. So you couldn't get Tez down to 41, huh?