Joe Calzaghe announces his retirement today

[stujones]

The needed each other equally the same... but the key difference is... Sven never claimed he was the best, he was quite contended driving his VV Polo and picking up the pay days in Germany, he made know bold statement about beating anyone, at the time of Sven's Career he had achieved more. Joe picked up the pieces from the titles Sven vacated and then beat Hopkins, which does put him above Ottke now.. but from 1997-2005 - Ottke achieved more, and thats a large part of Joe's career.

[Syntax Error]

I thought Joe was after a fight with Michael Spinks or Matthew Saad Muhammad!!!

Only joking!

Thoroughly good decision from Joe, although in the back of my mind, I'd like to see him face Froch; that's just a pipe dream for me & it's never going to happen & there is no sense in him beating up on old washed up SMWs from the 90s, so he might as well go out on top & be remembered for the good things he did!!!

[Horse]

I do, and could name at least 3 others (hardly an army but you get the point).

Who are these people and what do they know of boxing?

Do you propose that Calzaghe has not sought glory by challenging the likes of Kessler/Hopkins and Lacy? Or did he do it for some other reason. And as mercenary as it may sound, yes, making money is important, or else all fighters would stay amateur.

I don't really think Calzaghe cares about glory. I think he fought those fighters you mentioned for money. I am not against fighters fighting for money, but it is hardly inspiring to me when it seems that they don't care about glory and honour.

I care that he has retired as a British Boxing Great.

Surely, that is a mythical honour and therefore totally worthless.

Winning a world title is glorious, unifying a division is glorious, winning a title at a second weight is aslo...glorious. Being named P4P by a magazine is slightly less glorious in my opinion. I respect yours off course, but as i said it's subjective - not everyone agrees and it is also unproveable.

You don't think being classed as an all time great P4P fighter is more glorious than winning a World title?

You strike me as unable to consider that you are fallible mate.

Can you show me any comment that you have made which could be classed as conceding a point? I fail to see how you have shown yourself to be any different.

Lets just agree to disagree. I respect JC for what he has already done, you resent what never happened. My glass is half full, yours is half empty etc etc.

I resent want Calzaghe intends not to do. I believe Calzaghe should be striving for more, not telling himself that he has done enough.

[Horse]

Who cares if he retires as a British boxing great? Isn't that a totally worthless idea?

I do. No.

That was my point.

[stujones]

I thought Joe was after a fight with Michael Spinks or Matthew Saad Muhammad!!!

Only joking!

Thoroughly good decision from Joe, although in the back of my mind, I'd like to see him face Froch; that's just a pipe dream for me & it's never going to happen & there is no sense in him beating up on old washed up SMWs from the 90s, so he might as well go out on top & be remembered for the good things he did!!!

Sorry, not sure who you mean.... whose the 90's SMW that Calzaghe could fight?

[chinny]

I love to see boxers get out on their own terms at the top like this. Well done Joe.
Some bizarrely negative comments on this thread. I saw all Joe's title fights on TV (except Veit 2 which I don't think was televised) and was ringside for Lacy and RJJ (the latter because I could finally afford to travel to fights and wanted to see even the shell of Jones live).
Joe is a good guy with all his faculties who is great for the image of this sport.
He didn't have to fight Kessler; he made Frank sign it. He didn't care about the money, he loved the up for it feeling of the Lacy fight and wanted more of the same. Joe took short money for a long time, from the start with Micky Duff. Who can blame him for taking money fights at the end of his career?

Some daft comments on here, bl00dy hell.

[gobbles]

Horse, you know as well as me that far too many people knock the Lacy victory in hindsight, especially on web forums. As for not pushing on for the P4P No1? It's a mythical belt mate and I could argue that he already is.

Almost no one thinks Calzaghe is the P4P number one. So what if it is mythical? Does that mean it has no significance?

The p4p status seeking genuinely annoys me sometimes - its totally worthless and completely subjective.

"Totally Worthless"? In what way is seeking glory "totally worthless"? What is worthwhile in boxing? Making money?

I also think that his punch resistence is going and he has always suffered from fragile hands. For me he has already done enough to retire as a British boxing great, i will cherish his achievements rather than crowing about what might have been.

Who cares if he retires as a British boxing great? Isn't that a totally worthless idea?

Almost no one sees him as PFP No 1?! What a joke, lots of people do, particularly in America. Most people say Pacquaio, but virtually no one has Calzaghe outside the top 2. That's something that probably no British boxer in history can claim, hence he is the best British boxer ever. If you think the PFP title is something he should go for, what fight out there would do it for him? Would beating Chad Dawson, a guy who boxes in casinos in front of 1,000 people going to do that? No. Would beating Hopkins? No. Would beating Froch? No. So why go on?
If Froch had won a world title before the age of 31, maybe Calzaghe would have faced him. But he's been calling Calzaghe out for years. It's one thing calling guys out and saying yo are willing to fight them, but the biggest name on Froch's record is a washed-up Robin Reid, more than two years after Jeff Lacy wiped the floor with him.

[Horse]

Almost no one sees him as PFP No 1?! What a joke, lots of people do, particularly in America.

I was over the top saying that almost no one see him as No.1, but it is still a small minority. Pacquiao is the clear P4P No.1.

Most people say Pacquaio, but virtually no one has Calzaghe outside the top 2.

A lot of people have Marquez ahead of Calzaghe, including The Ring magazine.

That's something that probably no British boxer in history can claim,hence he is the best British boxer ever.

I would say that it is most likely that a number of British fighters have had similar P4P rankings in the past. Most people would not rank Calzaghe as the greatest British boxer of all time, he might have given himself a chance at becoming the No.1 of all time if he had continued, but he decided against it.

If you think the PFP title is something he should go for, what fight out there would do it for him? Would beating Chad Dawson, a guy who boxes in casinos in front of 1,000 people going to do that? No. Would beating Hopkins? No. Would beating Froch? No. So why go on?

If Pacquiao loses to Hatton and Marquez loses to Diaz, then a win over Dawson or Hopkins could be enough to push Calzaghe to the number one spot.

Anyway, it is not just about becoming the P4P number one. Calzaghe's record could do with a few more big name wins on it to secure his legacy, give us some entertaining fights, a better all time P4P ranking and a lot of money.

[fist]

Good for Joe and good luck to him. He was an amazing talent who achieved great things; winning every belt at SMW, and in what is these days is a rare occasion, faced an undefeated exceptional two belt champ in kessler, and came out victorious, unifying the division. His move up to LH was a nice touch to end his career, proving he was the best at that weight also.

Joe was exciting to watch and in his demolition of Lacy, he provided a beautiful display of perfection, much to the shock of many who pre-fight thought Lacy would beat Calzaghe.

To retire undefeated after all these years, after winning every belt at SMW, after preventing other SMWs from dominating, he deserves his dues.

Great speed, great stamina, great chin, great heart, great tactician, great boxer, great achievements. IMO the best modern boxer Britain has had and the best SMW of all time.

You don't reach those height by being an average Joe.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

Quality boxer, very protected but came through some real championship risks, not 1 of true upper echelon elite, but not too far behind

As for why hes retired, hes not big boxoffice or hasnt got a big box office opponent. No greats around his weight, no ticket sellers either. JC-RJJ was a flop in PPVs, BHOPs-Pav was a flop PPV. Dawson while the top 175lber isnt a PPV fighter, Froch is nothing outside of Nottingham and Boxrec, that fight doesn't even interest me, Taylor is pissing in the wind

However if I was Joe I maybe tempted to punt on a Valuev fight, slow as mollases easy to outbox giant that just lost to Holy providing an easyish world HW title. It would be an intriguing David versus Goliath contest too

Oh if there is a huge money fight in the next 18months he'll be back

[Matt W]

I can't say I blame him. Whether people like it or not he has achieved all that he wanted to and if he can't maintain his motivation then it's right to call it a day.

Like many I wish he would have taken more chances early in his career but can't knock his performances against Lacy and Kessler. Hopkins & Jones may have been long past their best but can't blame him for wanting those names on his record before he retired.

I would like to see him fight Froch but the fact the he didn't doesn't harm his standing in any way IMO. Froch is good but he's not on Calzaghe's level at this point. There's always somebody else to fight and it's good to see somebody going out before becoming target practice for a change. And I don't give much credence to chasing the 'P4P title' - which is all bollocks IMO. In today's climate that would mean he would have to fight Manny Pacquiao or Ricky Hatton....

[dve3333]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5c3p8IkH2U
If you all havent seen this Dan Hardy a UFC fighter from Nottingham and friend of Carl Froch was on Setanta when Calzaghes retirement was announced and gave a different reflection to his career than the Interviewers were expecting!!

[Max Molyneux]

How is Pavlik fighting Hopkins and bigger risk than Calzaghe fighting Hopkins? Thats just plain silly. Seriously mate.

I said early in his reign. Although it actually was a bigger risk, as Pavlik had to move up two weight divisions for the fight instead of one.

Weight didn't matter at all, Hopkins used skill to beat Pavlik not size. Pavlik Is a limited pressure fighter.

[ALI]

Calzaghe successfully managed to resurect his career over the the last 3 years, but it all came to late IMO! Kessler is by far his best victory, the Lacy win was outstanding but we cannot hide from the fact that he has since been exposed as a plodder. Both Jones and Hopkins would have beaten him in their primes. Eubank would have also ran him very close at his peak. Also, most noteworthy is that Calzaghe fought in the wilderness for what seemed like an eternity and he should always be held to account for that.

Froch's comments hold weight with me when he says "lets not loose our minds here!". As a nation we are often guilty of doing just that, but i'm with Froch this time.

[stujones]

I agree with Terrence re Lennox Lewis - as for Froch, the fight doesn't really interest me that much to be honest... only really for the atmosphere in the UK and the event. As a fight it does very little to enhance Joe's legacy and to be honest, I don't think it will be that competitive. Froch is just another belt holder at the moment, even less proven than Jeff Lacy.

Chad Dawson is a different kettle of fish - he is the only challenge left, well I would like to see rematches with Kessler and Bhop also... mainly cause on my card Joe didn't win either. I know my sanity has been question regarding my Kessler vs Calzaghe draw - but many had it 7-5, and I know of a few people who thought it was closer than Calzaghe vs bhop.

[Twinkle Toes]

I agree Barney, the guy has retired, and all some people can do is post links to Froch slavering shite, even britishboxing.net can't run something sensible without turning it into a Froch advert.

Some people eh!

[stujones]

A lot of sour grapes about Joe but unbeaten as amatuer and pro says it all
he beat what was in front of him what more could he do

I do generally agree with this... I wish him all the best, no sour grapes - I was shouting for Ottke and names years ago on a different forum. Can't rectify that now... so wish him all the best... been a great servant and a true British boxing great. But no prime Roy Jones.

[Autobarn]

What always makes me laugh on these forums is the mention of fighters just being in it for the money, well I'm sorry but that is the whole point of professional boxing, it's a business as much as it is a sport. If you want to see people fighting solely for glory then I suggest you watch two blokes fighting bareknuckle on the street and waking up the next morning with nothing but cuts, bruises and respect.

Yes JC could have fought fighters earlier than he did and yes he should of taken risks and fought abroad more often but it's not as simple as that, nothing is easy in life especially when money is involved. Anyway I wish him a healthy life outside of the ring and many happy times with his family.

He could have made himself marketable earlier, couldn't he?

If he'd perhaps gone for Beyer's title (or Woodhall before he lost to Beyer, or Catley before he lost to Thobela), then I'm sure lots of ppl would have been talking about Calzaghe v Danny Green, who became top WBC contender. He would have had his Lacy 2 or 3 years earlier, OK wouldn't have been big profile in America, but would have been big business in the UK and Oz, would have been a potential fight of the year, the Yanks would have taken more notice and so on. Calzaghe could have been a bigger earner earlier.

Personally, although super middle is one of my fave weights, I feel the fighters can be a bit overpaid. You have the break te fvcking bank just to see the top fights, which is ok for fighters but not for fans. They have to do far less - IMO - than the super bantams & the super feathers & the lightweights. Those guys put it all on the line, they take on better opponents more often. They do it for the money, of course, but they have more intensity and you really do find out who's who - a lot quicker. Granted, I think it's a bit harsh with Vazquez-Marquez, Corrales-Castillo having immediate rematches as the only way to make decent money, but these weights and these fighters are far more watchable.

[big lennox]

Joe Calzaghe = a dead set legend.i think it was james Toney who said you cna't call yourslef a proper world champion until you've held onto it for two years.To hold on to his for so long is quite simply, remarkable.Even factoring in bad days, awkward opponents, guys raising their game forv their title shot, injuries, for him to not lose once is quite something.

He'd have chased Otke out of the ring.An all time great.

[gobbles]

What always makes me laugh on these forums is the mention of fighters just being in it for the money, well I'm sorry but that is the whole point of professional boxing, it's a business as much as it is a sport. If you want to see people fighting solely for glory then I suggest you watch two blokes fighting bareknuckle on the street and waking up the next morning with nothing but cuts, bruises and respect.

Yes JC could have fought fighters earlier than he did and yes he should of taken risks and fought abroad more often but it's not as simple as that, nothing is easy in life especially when money is involved. Anyway I wish him a healthy life outside of the ring and many happy times with his family.

He could have made himself marketable earlier, couldn't he?

If he'd perhaps gone for Beyer's title (or Woodhall before he lost to Beyer, or Catley before he lost to Thobela), then I'm sure lots of ppl would have been talking about Calzaghe v Danny Green, who became top WBC contender. He would have had his Lacy 2 or 3 years earlier, OK wouldn't have been big profile in America, but would have been big business in the UK and Oz, would have been a potential fight of the year, the Yanks would have taken more notice and so on. Calzaghe could have been a bigger earner earlier.

Personally, although super middle is one of my fave weights, I feel the fighters can be a bit overpaid. You have the break te fvcking bank just to see the top fights, which is ok for fighters but not for fans. They have to do far less - IMO - than the super bantams & the super feathers & the lightweights. Those guys put it all on the line, they take on better opponents more often. They do it for the money, of course, but they have more intensity and you really do find out who's who - a lot quicker. Granted, I think it's a bit harsh with Vazquez-Marquez, Corrales-Castillo having immediate rematches as the only way to make decent money, but these weights and these fighters are far more watchable.

I think the big miss of his career was, when Ottke made it clear he wouldn't fight him, Warren did not go all out to get a unification with the WBC title. There were some real second-rate champions like Eric Lucas and Markus Beyer, who Calzaghe would have beaten easily but, by winning a second belt, his career would have put on a higher level quicker.
Still, all that's hindsight. I'm glad he's got out on top. Comeback in October?

[Wrists]

For me a legend - one of the reasons I got into boxing.

Thanks for the memories Joe.

Deserves a massive amount of respect from everyone - not the perfect resume and there are gaps but I prefer to remember the positive stuff.

Like many he will only be truly appreciated once he is gone

Thanks Joe - enjoy your retirement you have earned it

Wrists

PS. Calzaghe W KO 8 Froch

[Autobarn]

I don't think there's any question Joe is better than Ottke. Yes not fighting Ottke was a massive hole in the record.

What for instance would Ottke-Lacy e like? Sven SD12 - maybe - with a sympathetic ref and biased judges. Running for dear life, barely scraping by, peck and run for miles.

[Ted]

Well, put it this way - his annilhiation of Jeff Lacy was simply the most one-sided world title fight ever.

Lacy was an embarrassment to previous world champs that night. But it says more of JC's talent than it it does Lacys somewhat lack of.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Joe Calzaghe = a dead set legend.i think it was james Toney who said you cna't call yourslef a proper world champion until you've held onto it for two years.To hold on to his for so long is quite simply, remarkable.Even factoring in bad days, awkward opponents, guys raising their game forv their title shot, injuries, for him to not lose once is quite something.

He'd have chased Otke out of the ring.An all time great.

Oh do come along. Ottke was a very good fighter in his own right - Calzaghe struggled with awkward movers and counterpunchers, Ottke was very good at both. Joe wouldn't have been able to chase him out of the ring.

Staying unbeaten is impressive, but it's a lot easier when you're facing shit opposition, which Calzaghe did consistently.

[gobbles]

Joe Calzaghe = a dead set legend.i think it was james Toney who said you cna't call yourslef a proper world champion until you've held onto it for two years.To hold on to his for so long is quite simply, remarkable.Even factoring in bad days, awkward opponents, guys raising their game forv their title shot, injuries, for him to not lose once is quite something.

He'd have chased Otke out of the ring.An all time great.

Oh do come along. Ottke was a very good fighter in his own right - Calzaghe struggled with awkward movers and counterpunchers, Ottke was very good at both. Joe wouldn't have been able to chase him out of the ring.

Staying unbeaten is impressive, but it's a lot easier when you're facing shit opposition, which Calzaghe did consistently.

Behave. Ottke was upright, slow and didn't throw many punches. Even someone like Starie gave Ottke problems, while Reid, who by that stage was basically a spoiler (see Lacy fight where he didn't have a clue and just held), was robbed in many people's view. Ottke was only happy when allowed to dictate, something he wouldn't have done against Calzaghe. Sauerland just didn't want to know. Interestingly, Ottke is not held in any great esteem in Germany now, unlike someone like Henry Maske who is still a superstar.