Hopkins vs Ray Robinson or Hopkins against Monzon in primes

[shanbopop]

Who wins this?I'd have to go with Hopkins against Monzon not so sure about Robinson UD for robinson perhaps?

[tonyevs]

I would go for Hopkins against Robinson, Hopkins would have been too solid.

[mrbassie]

I'd pick SRR over Hopkins (points win), Hop couldn't match his workrate, certainly not over 15 rounds.

[glittermonkey]

I'd pick both fighters over Hopkins.

Both Monzon and Robinson fought in a far stronger middleweight division than the one we currently have. During their reigns the level of opposition was consistantly higher than Nard's, and for that reason alone it's difficult to guage how well he would do against fighters that are acknowledged greats such as these two. It's my firm belief that given the state of the division at the moment, there are lots of middles throughout history that would dominate for as long as (and as easily as) Hopkins has.

IMO, Hopkins has little to trouble Monzon. He doesn't hit hard enough, he can't outbox him from the outside, Monzon could be just as rough (if not rougher), any way Hopkins wanted to fight Monzon would get the better of him. I don't think he'd come close to stopping Hopkins though.

I agree with mrbassie's assessment of Hopkins vs Robinson. Over the longer distance Nard would be outworked, i'll go a stage further though and say that even the slightly lesser version of Robinson that fought at middle would have been able to box rings round Hopkins.

Hopkins is good, but nowhere near good enough to beat these guys. Monzon and Robinson by wide margins on the cards.

[tonyevs]

I picked Hopkins over Robinson because I felt Robinson had trouble with the good boxers at the heavier weight(Welter was his prime).
Hopkins is solid and I don`t feel Robinson would have been able to really hurt him, Jones could keep him at bay because he was naturally bigger.

[Jukejar]

True that Robinson was awesome at welter, and fought many of his 200 (!) fights at what would be today's junior middle class, but Robinson's record is also littered with wins over tremendous boxers at middleweight, and I don't see him having much trouble winning virtually every round against Hopkins. I think it's easy to have myopia with regard to the current champions, but I don't see Hopkins as being anywhere near the class of Robinson. In my view, Hopkins is very good but not among the elite, (counting the "title defenses" is not necessarily an indicator)--and, unlike Robinson, his record does not yet contain victories over anyone in the all-time great category. If he had beaten Jones, then the story would be different. In Robinson's time, Hopkins and Jones would have had a series of fights, but as it is, Jones beats Hopkins and thats that--and we'll never know what might have happened "if." Not Hopkins' fault, but still . . .

Monzon would likely be a closer fight because of the styles, but I think Hopkins would again be on the losing side of a tough decision.

[mrbassie]

I personally don't thik Robinson would box rings around Hop, I really don't. Hopkins is a very talented guy and robinson could be hit, he could be hit more easily than say Leonard. There is a tendancy to look back on Robinson as a like precursor to Ali, Leonard, et al but IMO both were slicker than Rob (in terms of not being hit), who was IMO more like Hearns than either, only with an iron chin. I think Hop's attempts to turn the hypothetical fight into a chessmatch would hamper Robinson somewhat and I think Robinson would be counterpunched to some degree and effect. Over 12 I see a points win for Robinson or over 15 possibly a late knockout but I do think it would be competitive.

I say 'I think' and 'I see' rather a lot......perhaps I should seek medical help for that; it may be some psychological disorder. Possibly linked to the one that causes me to compile extesive lists, complete with addresses and allergies, of people people I meet who "disapprove" of yellow M & M's.

[Eric the Viking]

I picked Hopkins over Robinson because I felt Robinson had trouble with the good boxers at the heavier weight(Welter was his prime).

Even so, Ray won the vast majority of his bouts at MW, over appreciably better competition than Hopkins has faced during his reign.

Hopkins is solid and I don`t feel Robinson would have been able to really hurt him, Jones could keep him at bay because he was naturally bigger.

Likewise, I doubt Hopkins would've been able to hurt SRR, since Hopkins tends to take guys out via sustained punishment, and no way would he be able to lay that kind of sustained leather on someone with the skills and speed of SRR - in that sense Hops' fight vs. Jones (and an effectively one-handed Jones, although he didn't reveal the injury to his elft hand until afer the fight, for good reason) is a good barometer.

Re. Jones, when they fought, they were both true middleweights, and Hopkins in fact has a nearly 2-inch height advantage over Jones. RJJ perhaps has the kind of physique that allows him to put on muscle more easily, so it was more natural for him to move to 168, which he in fact did for his next few fights post-Hopkins were all at 168, though he defended his IBF middleweight title one more time (vs.. Thomas Tate) a year after fighting Hopkins, and then 6 months later took on Toney for Toney's IBF super middleweight title. Anyway, after Jones moved to 168, even if Hopkins had previously considered moving up himself, all the incentive was there for him to stay at 160 rather than rematch a prime Jones (this time one with 2 healthy hands, not like in their first bout) at a higher weight. I think Hopkins knows his limitations very well and has planned his career accordingly. Sure, he's talked about facing so-and-so at 168 or even 175 on numerous occasions, but talk is all it has been.

But back to the mythical Nard vs. Sugar matchup - it probably would have been a tactical boxing match, with both guys respecting the other's skills, but SRR would have had a big advantage in the speed-and-skills department, and would have won an easy UD.

[dan1030]

I'd have to go with Robinson over Hopkins but I don't think it would be any kind of blowout. It might be a comfortable margin on the cards, But my guess is that most of hte actual rounds would be pretty close.
I haven't seen enough of Monzon to speak of his chances with any authority, but from what I have seen, I think he'd be competative with Hopkins--maybe a slight edge--but would also come up short against Robinson.

[Sweet P]

I think that Robinson would be a close win over Hopkins. Robinson was at his best at 147 but would still edge out Hopkins.
I think that Monzan is the best Middle weight of all time and i think that he would have easily beaten Hopkins, Monzan was a great fighter and would be to tough for Hopkins.

[abigbeaner]

How can you even say Hopkins in the same breath as SRR ? Hopkins may have 19 defenses but quite a few are against guys he has beat 2 or 3 time allready. SRR

[dempseyfire]

I don't see how Hopkins beats Robinson. Robinson had better stamina (Hopkins never went 15), greater work-rate, faster, bigger punch etc.. He wouldn't be a smaller limited puncher like Tito was. Hopkins would def give him problems but Robinson had too many tricks in the toolbag.

Monzon is a different story. I'll admit I haven't seen many Monzon fights but I'm not too impressed with what I have seen. He was def. a complete fighter who had great longetivity and was tough as nails. But Hopkins is quicker and probably has as big if not ibgger punch than Monzon. I'd say Hopkins by splid decision.