If Ali had stayed amateur

Newbie · Post by **Newbie** » 28 May 2004, 17:41

Could Muhammed Ali have won more gold medals if he had refused to turn pro? If so, how many?

revporl · Post by **revporl** » 05 Jul 2004, 05:54

I reckon a more interesting question would be about the procession of the heavyweight scene in the 60's/70's without Ali there. Who would have beaten Liston eventually? Who would have beaten foreman? Would anyone have dominated the era in the same way as Ali had he not been around?

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 05 Jul 2004, 11:16

Newbie wrote:Could Muhammed Ali have won more gold medals if he had refused to turn pro? If so, how many?

Muhammad Ali was in the Finals again, waiting to win another gold...but wait!!!

Larry Holmes runs in, Ali looks stunned, this is a real opponent, and one who he hadnt paid off before the fight!

He immidately smiles tho! these fights involve judges, all he has to do is get to the cards, like he did against Norton twice, Young, Shavers....

SMACK

But oh no!

Larry has KTFO Ali, and cooly collects the medal, the world is stunned!!

"im A fraud" crys ali "larry is the greatest"

J · Post by J » 05 Jul 2004, 12:05

until spinks comes out and spanks him senseless

Tantum · Post by **Tantum** » 05 Jul 2004, 12:07

Yeah, just like DLH spanked Sturm senseless.

TheRiverCityHippy · Post by **TheRiverCityHippy** » 05 Jul 2004, 13:45

J wrote:until spinks comes out and spanks him senseless

no-one of that stature j, it was duane bobick who ended larry`s golden dreams.
(1972 U.S olympic trials)

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 05 Jul 2004, 17:28

headhunter wrote:
J wrote:until spinks comes out and spanks him senseless
no-one of that stature j, it was duane bobick who ended larry`s golden dreams.
(1972 U.S olympic trials)

It was Larry who ended Ali's ability to feed himself.

J · Post by J » 06 Jul 2004, 05:11

personally dont find that funny.

pompous yes but justified also mate.

mrbassie · Post by **mrbassie** » 06 Jul 2004, 07:09

Not funny at all. Sick bastard.

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 06 Jul 2004, 11:47

mrbassie wrote:Not funny at all. Sick bastard.

Ali is better than Holmes....at shake and bake commercials.

J · Post by J » 06 Jul 2004, 12:00

you need fornicating help mate.

In fact I seem to remember talking to you before about Lewis and Holmes and after being a bit of a dick to begin with you came round and seemed alright. Shame you've reverted to type dude.

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 06 Jul 2004, 13:25

The_Power wrote:Ali is better than Holmes....at shake and bake commercials.

You forgot to mention that nothing goes better with Shake-n-Bake than ... Tyson brand chicken. The first time Larry actually had some Tyson brand in his grill, he said the flavor was "a real knockout."

Marciano Frazier · Post by **Marciano Frazier** » 07 Jul 2004, 01:53

Certainly he could've. There was no one in the amateurs who could match Ali. There wasn't even anyone in the pros who could've.

As for the question of what would have happened had Ali not shown up in the professional scene, we'd probably have scene Liston just grow old as champion while only occasionally defending the belt until some later-sixties contender finally beat him and became champ, then that guy is beaten by Frazier, who is beaten by Foreman, who has a pretty long title reign before he's beaten by, say, Young or Holmes, then if it's Young, Young loses to Holmes, and everything goes the way it's supposed to from there. And Leon Spinks would never have been champion.

revporl · Post by **revporl** » 07 Jul 2004, 08:59

As for the question of what would have happened had Ali not shown up in the professional scene, we'd probably have scene Liston just grow old as champion while only occasionally defending the belt until some later-sixties contender finally beat him and became champ, then that guy is beaten by Frazier, who is beaten by Foreman, who has a pretty long title reign before he's beaten by, say, Young or Holmes, then if it's Young, Young loses to Holmes, and everything goes the way it's supposed to from there. And Leon Spinks would never have been champion.

Yeah, I'd go along with that, probably Ellis to beat liston in 68/69 then Frazier to beat him etc etc

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 07 Jul 2004, 10:27

Eric the Viking wrote:
The_Power wrote:Ali is better than Holmes....at shake and bake commercials.
You forgot to mention that nothing goes better with Shake-n-Bake than ... Tyson brand chicken. The first time Larry actually had some Tyson brand in his grill, he said the flavor was "a real knockout."

Good one Viking.

Shame others cant accept banter.

J · Post by J » 07 Jul 2004, 11:05

I CANT ACCEPT BANTER OVER A TRUE GREAT WHO HAS BROUGHT PLEASURE TO MILLIONS DONE PROBABLY MORE FOR HIS SPORT THAN ANY OTHER IN HISTORY AND IS MOCKED FOR THE TERRIBLE CONDITION HE HAS FOUND HIMSELF IN . NO I CANT.
AND VIKE YOU SHOULD KNOW BETTER MATE.

TheRiverCityHippy · Post by **TheRiverCityHippy** » 07 Jul 2004, 12:33

i dont think eric was having a go j, i think he was trying to use the general gist of THE POWER `s `humour` for want of a better word and turn it on its head.
in other words i think eric was saying your man holmes got ktfo by tyson, just in a subtle way thats all.
thats the way i read it anyway.

J · Post by J » 08 Jul 2004, 05:29

aaah ok did seem out of character for Vike whom I have the upmost respect for.
Apologies vike if I misread you

Eric the Viking · Post by **Eric the Viking** » 08 Jul 2004, 12:19

Yeah, I was just defending Ali by throwing Holmes' KO at the hands of Tyson back at 'em.

In boxing terms, yes the blow was really low, but instead of whining to the ref I preferred to fire back in kind.

Bit touchy around here, though, especially for a boxing forum.

victorious · Post by **victorious** » 08 Jul 2004, 13:19

Ali was a creep and a jerk, he deserves what he got.
As for him staying amateur, he would have wound up being frazier's opponent in 1968 Olympic trials, or might have fough Buster Mathis, who Frazier lost to in Finals. Mathis hurt hand, Frazier got Olympic spot.

A lot of fighters from Soviet Union, Cuba, and other communist countries used to stay around for 2, 3, olympics, since they could not turn pro, and were not allowed to leave their countries. If comunism had held up, we would be seeing Kotsa Tzu, Klitsccho's, and others in one Olympic competition every four years. Makes you think of all the fighters we missed in 50's, 60', 70's, and most of 80's due to them not being allowed to turn pro.

The_Power · Post by **The_Power** » 08 Jul 2004, 17:12

Eric the Viking wrote: Bit touchy around here, though, especially for a boxing forum.

Exactly.

J · Post by J » 09 Jul 2004, 04:57

well maybe it was the way I was brought up, dont take the piss out of people less fortunate than yourself. What next taking the piss out of Michael watson? Come in you must admit it was a bit of a sick joke.

RAPID · Post by **RAPID** » 09 Jul 2004, 09:20

The_ Power and Victorious have it correct. Everyone that knows boxing
would agree. Just read some of the sad comments to their postings.
We can see who's sick and is in need of the help in regard to ALI in this forum.

J · Post by J » 09 Jul 2004, 11:44

RAPID wrote:The_ Power and Victorious have it correct. Everyone that knows boxing
would agree. Just read some of the sad comments to their postings.
We can see who's sick and is in need of the help in regard to ALI in this forum.

wha that a fighter any fighter deserves to crippled.

well done. bollox iM not posting on this subject anymore.

all those who mock any fighter for being in a state post their ring life is NO BOXING FAN in my view.

actually rapid im not sure if you are having a pop or agreeing with me mate.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » 09 Jul 2004, 22:36

I can safely say, without a shadow of a doubt, if Ali had stayed amateur - he'd never have turned pro.

If Ali had stayed amateur

If Ali had stayed amateur

Re: If Ali had stayed amateur