Best Fighter of the 1920's?

[Ambling Alp]

Outside of Dempsey, Tunney, and Greb, who was the best fighter from the 1920's?

Some of the notables:

Paul Berlanbach
Sammy Mandell
Jack Delaney
Johnny Dundee
Tiger Flowers
Frankie Genaro
Fidel LaBarba
Benny Leonard
Tommy Loughran
Young Stribling
Lew Tendler
Pancho Villa
Mickey Walker

[Expug]

Great list. One of the most interesting times in boxing history.

A few more:
Jimmy McClarnin
Georges Carpentier
Kid Norfolk
Billy Petrolle
Ray Miller
Jackie "Kid" Berg
Bud Taylor

I cant come up with the number one guy.

On your list is Benny Leonard. It would probably be him or Mickey Walker.

[Adamj1987]

Outside of Dempsey, Tunney, and Greb, who was the best fighter from the 1920's?

Some of the notables:

Paul Berlanbach
Sammy Mandell
Jack Delaney
Johnny Dundee
Tiger Flowers
Frankie Genaro
Fidel LaBarba
Benny Leonard
Tommy Loughran
Young Stribling
Lew Tendler
Pancho Villa
Mickey Walker

[Goodnight, Irene]

I am a dyed-in-the-wool fan of Boxing's fabled, "Toy Bulldog," but, I have to concede, he takes a backseat to Benny Leonard.

[klompton]

I dont think Walker takes a back seat to Leonard in the TWENTIES. Leonard retired less than midway through the decade rather than face Walker.

My picks:

Walker
Loughran
Delaney more for the early part of the decade than the latter part when he wanted to become a heavyweight.

No offense expug but have you checked Carpentiers record in the 1920s? From 1920 until his retirement in 1927 he only beat two world class fighters: Battling Levinsky (in a fight that was heavily rumored to be fixed) and Ted Kid Lewis (Who was outweighed by nearly twenty pounds and would go on to show several times that he could easily still make the welterweight limit... even weighing 138 FOUR years later). Even in his prime Carpentier was overrated but in the 1920s he did nothing to qualify him as one of the greats of that decade. Every name on any of the previous men listed within ten pounds of Carpentiers weight would whip his ass and whip it handily.

[Expug]

I dont think Walker takes a back seat to Leonard in the TWENTIES. Leonard retired less than midway through the decade rather than face Walker.

My picks:

Walker
Loughran
Delaney more for the early part of the decade than the latter part when he wanted to become a heavyweight.

No offense expug but have you checked Carpentiers record in the 1920s? From 1920 until his retirement in 1927 he only beat two world class fighters: Battling Levinsky (in a fight that was heavily rumored to be fixed) and Ted Kid Lewis (Who was outweighed by nearly twenty pounds and would go on to show several times that he could easily still make the welterweight limit... even weighing 138 FOUR years later). Even in his prime Carpentier was overrated but in the 1920s he did nothing to qualify him as one of the greats of that decade. Every name on any of the previous men listed within ten pounds of Carpentiers weight would whip his ass and whip it handily.

Your right about Carpentier now that I look closer at his record Klompton.
I guess I had him on merit of the magnitude of the Dempsey fight.And that he fought in all those divisions.
But most of his work was prior to the twenties.

[klompton]

If it were "who was the most famous fighter of the 20s" Carpentier would easily make the top 2. But not the "Best fighter of the 20s"

[Djanders]

Harry Wills.

[Ox Baker]

Weight not an issue:

1. Dempsey
2. Wills
3. Tunney
4. Sharkey
5. Schmeling
6. Godfrey
7. Greb
8. Norfolk
9. Loughran
10. Gibbons

Pound for pound:
1. Greb
2. Leonard
3. Dempsey
4. Tunney
5. Rosenbloom
6. Walker
7. Dundee
8. Loughran
9. Canzoneri
10. Sammy Mandell

[raylawpc]

I dont think Walker takes a back seat to Leonard in the TWENTIES. Leonard retired less than midway through the decade rather than face Walker.

That is not true. Walker and Leonard were matched for Walker's welterweight title in August 1923. Leonard took a tune-up fight with Pal Moran, and suffered a broken hand. The fight was postponed to September, and when Benny's hand did not heal properly (as determined by two NYSAC doctors), the commission cancelled the bout. Leonard decided to retire rather than sit around waiting for his hand to heal.

The idea that Benny Leonard retired "rather than face Walker," is simply incorrect.

[klompton]

That is your opinion. It is my opinion that Leonard saw the writing on the wall and knew that age was catching up with him fast while Walker was a tremendous fighter in his prime and probably would have been too much for the smaller Leonard.

[Ox Baker]

Leonard was quite wealthy by the time he retired. And he'd had nearly 200 professional bouts. He'd grown up dirt poor, and he was injured. If he didn't want to fight Walker, he simply could have stayed at 135 and made more money, but he didn't really need it.

[raylawpc]

That is your opinion. It is my opinion that Leonard saw the writing on the wall and knew that age was catching up with him fast while Walker was a tremendous fighter in his prime and probably would have been too much for the smaller Leonard.

Then why did he sign to fight Walker, and engage in a tune-up with Pal Moran? If he was ducking Walker, why didn't he just announce his retirement in 1922?

[Ox Baker]

That is your opinion. It is my opinion that Leonard saw the writing on the wall and knew that age was catching up with him fast while Walker was a tremendous fighter in his prime and probably would have been too much for the smaller Leonard.

Then why did he sign to fight Walker, and engage in a tune-up with Pal Moran?

Because he hadn't gotten injured yet. Hand injuries are death to a boxer. Remember when Floyd Mayweather broke his hand against Famoso Hernandez? It was three years before he could take on a serious challenger, and that injury has plagued him to this day.

[raylawpc]

That is your opinion. It is my opinion that Leonard saw the writing on the wall and knew that age was catching up with him fast while Walker was a tremendous fighter in his prime and probably would have been too much for the smaller Leonard.

Then why did he sign to fight Walker, and engage in a tune-up with Pal Moran?

Because he hadn't gotten injured yet. Hand injuries are death to a boxer. Remember when Floyd Mayweather broke his hand against Famoso Hernandez? It was three years before he could take on a serious challenger, and that injury has plagued him to this day.

You are missing my point. Klompton claims that Leonard "saw the writing on the wall," and was ducking Walker. Signing to fight Walker, taking a tune-up fight, and then pulling out on orders from the Commission doctors is one heck of a round-about way to duck Walker!

[klompton]

Wait he quit boxing because of a hand injury? "Hand injuries are the death of a boxer?" and you use Mayweather as an example? Last time a checked Mayweather had several fights after publicly disclosing he has bad hands and is currently scheduled to face one of the P4P best fighters in the world. RJJ had notoriously bad hands, as did Tommy Loughran, Harry Greb, Jim Braddock, and countless other fighters. To say hand injuries are death of a fighter is ridiculous, indeed they are fairly common place. Furthermore it wouldnt be the first time that a fighter, or rather his manager, obliged him to a fight he didnt want only for the fighter to pull out. One of the more famous instances of this was when Graziano was signed to fight LaMotta thinking the fight would never come off only to find out that LaMotta was serious about it. Graziano famously punched a tree fracturing his hand to get out of the fight.

[Ox Baker]

Wait he quit boxing because of a hand injury? "Hand injuries are the death of a boxer?" and you use Mayweather as an example? Last time a checked Mayweather had several fights after publicly disclosing he has bad hands and is currently scheduled to face one of the P4P best fighters in the world. RJJ had notoriously bad hands, as did Tommy Loughran, Harry Greb, Jim Braddock, and countless other fighters. To say hand injuries are death of a fighter is ridiculous, indeed they are fairly common place. Furthermore it wouldnt be the first time that a fighter, or rather his manager, obliged him to a fight he didnt want only for the fighter to pull out. One of the more famous instances of this was when Graziano was signed to fight LaMotta thinking the fight would never come off only to find out that LaMotta was serious about it. Graziano famously punched a tree fracturing his hand to get out of the fight.

Well, Jim Braddock lost fight after fight because of his hand injuries, so you've pretty much proven my point. Moreover, Harry Greb DIED during surgery to help correct injuries he received during his fighting career (and a car accident). And Tommy Loughran spent most of his career as a one-handed fighter!

I mean, these men didn't live in our era, where there there were numerous treatments for hand injuries. Watch Mayweather/Hatton 24/7 to see the type of therapy Mayweather had to go through, and we all know how Roy Jones dealt with his problems (steroids).

Oh, and you believing that stupid rumor about Graziano purposely breaking his hand after a month of training? That's all I need to know about you.

[klompton]

You can believe whatever you want but if you believe Greb died having surgery performed to fix boxing injuries and somehow those injuries were hand injuries than that just shows exactly how much you know about this era.

[raylawpc]

. . . Furthermore it wouldnt be the first time that a fighter, or rather his manager, obliged him to a fight he didnt want only for the fighter to pull out. One of the more famous instances of this was when Graziano was signed to fight LaMotta thinking the fight would never come off only to find out that LaMotta was serious about it. Graziano famously punched a tree fracturing his hand to get out of the fight.

Are you suggesting that the great Benny Leonard deliberately broke his thumb on Pal Moran's noggin to avoid fighting Mickey Walker?

[My2Sense]

Getting back to the topic, I would say Leonard.

[Ox Baker]

You can believe whatever you want but if you believe Greb died having surgery performed to fix boxing injuries and somehow those injuries were hand injuries than that just shows exactly how much you know about this era.

Oh, I get it. You're stupid. I said that Greb was died having surgery from injuries he received in the ring, as well as in a car crash.

[harrygreb]

you are SUGGESTING that i died in that hospital due to the docs working on my hands. thats crap! they were messin' around with my eyes when they ballsed it up. yes, the injuries were mostly from fights but the hands had nothing to do with what happened at the end.

in my view benny leonard was the best fighter of the twenties. he'd a whopped that mug walker

[elmersalsa]

It gotta be the great Benny Leonard...Mickey Walker and Tommy Loughran did their mark MOSTLY in the 1930s.