For the record i think DLH clearly won the second fight but also clearly lost the first There was no way mosley won the second fight, jsut look at his face at the end...he was a beaten man.
Correct, Mosely didnt win the second fight at all, even his corner if you watch the fight (Journeyman if you have mate you must have picked up on this) His corner were telling him in the final rounds he was miles behind. That he was losing the fight.
People generally do remember the fight itself, they dont remember the circumstances in which the fight was held.
Mosely ex top money earner, P4P top 5 and big marquee name had his ass handed to him by Vernon Forest, and then went for the rematch and lost again in even more devastating fashion. He then has a no contest against Marquez so you can see it is now over 2 years since he has had a win(against stone) and his earning potential and p4p status are well and truly on the drop. In short when he met de la hoya it was his last chance at megafights before either retiring or rebuilding both = less money.
De la hoya on the other hand was quite the opposite, his stock was on the rise since his first loss to Mosely with victories over Gatti, Yory Boy Campas and Vargas, a controversial points loss to Mosesly would not harm his career but it may well cause irreperable damage to Shanes.
The money men would allow that to happen in my view the fight was extremely dubious, if it went to the cards it had controversial decsion written all over it.
The ironic thing is that De la hoya had exactly the same type of decisions go FOR him when he fought sturm, cos they coudlnt watch the big payday go down the pan.
Its not always just about the sport of boxing but the business also Im afraid.
As for mosely well this win enabled him to gain a shot at Winky, again he got smashed but now has got a rematch, cant see anything going different, guy in my opinion hasnt won a fight since 2001 and in terms of P4P is shot. Still could hold a version of one of the belts but no longer a top ten not even top twenty for that matter, fighter P4P in my view.
The scoring of DLH v Mosely II will run and run as a debate. I was at the fight and scored it for Mosely, very close. Most, if not all of the people around me, all of whom were DLH fans also scored it for Sugar.
The ringside reporter surveys straight after the fight were pretty even as well and I've seen the fight about 3 times on tape since. Its a close fight and how you score it depends on what rocks your subjective boat - Mosely's power work against DLH faster, more frequent but weeaker work.
It certainly isn't the travesy of scoring that people are trying to make it.
Well mate Ive stated my thoughts above, i thought it was pretty bad, on a par with Earl Vanzie, whom others have reckonded Earl deserved his win I personally couldnt see it. I feel the same bout Mosely / Oscar.
Mosely didnt work hard enough didnt thorw enough punches to win in my vierw, harder hitting or not. He only fought for the last 3 rounds more or less after his corner told him he was on the verge of needing a KO.
Its all subjective but I do feel the majority of people Ive spoken to thought it was a de la hoya victory in the same way most thought it was a Sturm victory in his last outing.
As said above Im a bit cynical on these big fights with huge match ups to be made round the corner. Same could be said of Pacquio Marquez, whom I thought was robbed (Marquez)....aaah yes a draw fit the (dollar) bill just nicely thanks.
J - as I said in my last post, its a debate that one could have all day. Quite happy to sit down with anyone and watch a re-run of the tape over a few beers and discuss.
Back to the central point of this thread though: can't see anything other than a mid-rounds stoppage for Hopkins.
I favoured Mosley in the second fight as well. The Sky commentary for that fight was some of the worst ive ever heard. They just couldn't stop saying De La Hoya. Oscar hardly did a damn thing in that fight, Mosley was landing the far harder punches and trying to be the aggressor in the fight. Oscar fought an incredibly defensive fight. Seriously, watch it again and ask your self just what the hell is Oscar doing, all the while Mosley is the one coming foward and throwing the hard punches.
Its the same with the Tarver vs Jones fight BBC commentary, they seemed to be awarding Tarver rounds in that fight based on "Roy doesn't look his usual self tonight".
If Oscar did sod all, Mosley did very little. So what if DLH was being defensive? You do not penalise someone for fighting off the back foot, unless their opponent
Mosley may have thrown some punches with more force, but how many did he actually land, very very few. You don't get extra rounds for merely coming forward, that's why they call it 'effective' aggression; the only case for awarding a round to a fighter for coming forward when they aren't landing, is if neither fighter lands anything much.
In honesty it was a fornicating awful fight, neither man exactly covered himself in glory, but Oscar fought a tactic which suited him, and you cannot penalise someone for fighting a tactic which you don't like much.
I had the Tarver Jones fight a draw for those that are interested, whoever they may be?
Since this has turned into a Mosley/DLH thread I've give my two penith.
Extremely defensive & somewhat negative performance by both fighters which was due to their styles I feel.
Mosely took the first by a whisker but the second was DLH's by a wider margin. Moseley was even more tedious in the second.
On DLH/Hopkins....I think Oscar wants this fight more and he has the tools to beat Hopkins. Then again conditioning & hand/foot speed will be a factor for both men.
I'm starting to think Oscar could well pull this off. He's probably scared to death, and that I think is going to help him. He'll be training like a demon and is probably planning on plenty of movement, keeping his jab in old man Hopkin's face all night.
The Strum fight was a good thing: a warning to Oscar that he can't stand and trade with middleweights.
Think I might have some of those odds on offer..............
while i totally respect your knowledge and opinion MW, save yourself the hassle give me the money you were gonna wager next fri, at least Ill buy you a beer out of it!!!
J wrote:while i totally respect your knowledge and opinion MW, save yourself the hassle give me the money you were gonna wager next fri, at least Ill buy you a beer out of it!!!
You might have a point there nah, but you can still by me a beer though. I'm not even an Oscar fan, but I think his chances are a lot better than people seem to think. Hopkins is over-rated ( GASP!!! )
Hopkins is overrated and underrated by various people. However, he's a genuine middleweight and in my opinionb a better all round technician than Oscar, who is a bigger talent, but has many technical flaws.
nah, but you can still by me a beer though. I'm not even an Oscar fan, but I think his chances are a lot better than people seem to think. Hopkins is over-rated ( GASP!!! )